To this point, I've put my John Handcock on 4

 

Agreed, criminals should be afraid of us, not the other way around. If one of every three armed robberies or car jackings resulted in the death of the criminal there's be a lot few armed robberies and car jackings.

 

Until you live in a society where gun-related crime is so miniscule that you rarely even give it a remote thought, you will never understand how liberatingly safe it really is when guns... just... aren't... around.

And before you start to think I'm referring to some communist country or other "strange" place, I'm talking about Australia.

More guns does not make any sense whatsoever, after I lived 9 years of my life there, and never even giving them a second thought. Just my opinion, nothing more... we're all entitled to our own. Unfortunately this country is so far beyond any kind of meaningful gun control because it's a gun-centric culture, and has been for its entire history... so the cat is WAY out of the bag, so to speak.

However, while we've all been able to say our peace on this thread (including me, obviously), I do need to caution people because this topic can clearly get very political very quick... and then it can get ugly... so in the interest of maintaining a peaceful, friendly thread, let's get back to the original topic!

Speaking of which... I once read a wonderful book on "How to talk your way out of a traffic ticket", written by a former highway patrolman. A quick search reveals an author by the name of David W. Kelley... I'm not 100% sure that is the same book I read, but regardless, it was excellent advice. I know I have greatly increased my odds of a warning, reduced charge, or at the very least, more pleasant court experience with each stop I have had in my 15 years of driving.

The bottom line is - you do everything you can to very quickly and efficiently remove any fear from the cop (i.e. you present no threat whatsoever) and at the same time slyly reaffirm his authority & boost his ego (without being over the top). Show much calm and respect, and it will improve your situation tenfold.

 

first let me say that cops really are part of the 1%..and as someone who gets pulled over alot (get a big lead foot) most cops just really seem ok to deal with if you make em laugh a little, and if all else fails just show em the tata's...jk

 

Austrailia may be virtually homicide free....but so is this country if you aren't involved with crime in the first place....I have no more fear of homicide here than you would in austraillia because I dont associate with people around gangs and drugs. If you arent around those elements then statistically speaking your spouce is more likely to kill you than some random guy on the street! Secondly those other places may be homicide free but you are much more likely to get your face beat in just because you go to a soccer game! From the stats I have seen assaults and robberies are HIGHER per capita than the US. IMO our gun ownership society strikes a very good balance between retaining peoples freedoms while protecting innocent citizens. Here I dont have to worry about getting beat robbed or killed because I can carry....whereas in gun controlled culture you can only not worry about homicide.

 

Your last statement is just plain nuts.

 

That makes no sense whatsoever - you can't just conveniently ignore the homicide rate because you "aren't involved with crime". The mere presence of firearms that they will be used... of course! And the more of them out there, the greater the likelihood that one of them will be used. Once they are used, it's more likely that "someone" (could be you, could be a "bad guy", could be an innocent bystander) will get hurt.

Like I said, the cat's out of the bag for the US... once the firearms are "out there", they aren't coming back, so even aside from the 2nd Amendment, it's entirely unlikely that the situation is going to change here anyway.

I do want to point out one thing though - the fallacy (IMO) that guns are for "protection". Guns don't "protect" you, they don't stop a bullet from hitting you. They are "attack" devices. Once the other guy pulls the trigger, the gun itself won't stop you from getting hit, will it? That's a factor of their reflexes and accuracy/aim vs. yours. It's attack vs. attack, not defense vs. defense. I'm merely trying to point out the illogical terminology of "protection". The only protection is the behavioral change threat/fear factor that possessing a gun provides... not the gun itself.

The increased presence of guns (i.e. "lots more guns") only increases the chance that one of them will be used, which means that it's more likelly that "someone" (could be you, could be a "bad guy", could be an innocent bystander) will get hurt.

Meh - it's such an ongoing and never-ending debate... and I'm trying hard to keep it from getting into a heated and very political discussion (i.e. against NAM site guidelines), which it most certainly will if we don't keep our calm (and thankfully we are, so far). Regardless, the thread will definitely need to be moved off-topic soon if we don't get back on topic.

So planeguy - do you have anything to say regarding the traffic stop / ticket discussion?

 

Well he DID have handcuffs...

I KID!!

 

Just about everyday I read in the paper about a kid or a parent getting "caught" in the middle of drive-by shooting or some gang-related incident (usually involving teens). Or an ex in a domestic abuse -- or, worse, the kids, being shot/killed. So, what was their crime?

 

Being in a place where there are too many guns.

 

Well, that was my point....

 

I had 2 violent crimes committed against me & my cousin had the most violent crime committed against her (short of death) before I decided to arm myself. I have one in the car & one in my bedside table. I am a female who lives alone & drives alone & I am very well trained in the legalities & usage of a firearm so I am sorry if I get tired of hearing how the world would be safer without guns. In my life experiences, that argument just doesn't hold water.

Sorry if the thread keeps getting OT but when you type a long argument anti-gun argument & then casually say let's get back on topic at the end it's tough to not respond

 

In the USA, I understand. That's where your life experiences are, so that's where you developed your feelings on the issue. The crimes happened here too, I gather? Yes, crimes can happen anywhere... but US society is very different than most others.

Regarding guns in the USA, forget the bag, the cat has been totally missing for a long time. Point taken. It's a slippery slope, and I might have landed on my *** at the bottom by now!

 

We can always bounce back up

 

There are always cases where the exception seems more appropriate. Fact is, the more guns, the more people get shot.

 

The cat is out of the bag, I saw the number 90 guns per 100 people a lot of guns. Most people have no clue what it is to be shot at or shoot somebody, they go out and buy the biggest pistol (it's handguns that are the problem) they can and put it in the car or house and think everything is OK now, no training at all.

It's pretty damn hard to hit something with a handgun at 10 yards at a range when you're calm, it's a different story when the ++it is hitting the fan.

Another problem is now people use a pistol to settle a fight they get in a pissing contest with somebody and before they know it someone is dead.

We need to think.

 

"There is nothing more exhilarating then getting shot at without results"
Winston Churchill




I prefer to just take his word for it.

 

I'm curious...for a thread started by someone that got a speeding ticket and felt bad about it, how did we end up in a gun discussion? This is starting to sound a little politically charged...

Mark

 

Yeah. This is one of those areas where some preemption is warranted....

 

Yeah, I was concerned about that... although I think that polite, civil debate is a healthy thing, it is all too easy for things to deteriorate fast.

Perhaps it's time to just close the thread.

How did we get here? I believe it had to do with reaching for the glovebox during traffic stops... and the risks of doing so because the cop may think you're packing. That of course segways very easy into a gun discussion!

 

Before we close this thread Mr. Edge, I'd like to share with everyone the possibility of the ticket becoming a non-sequitor. I've been checking the state's electronic ticket "pay-up" site on-line and have had negative results in being able to find any record of the citation in the database. Maybe the data-entry clerk is sleeping on the job this week or somethin' I don't know.

Anyways, I'd like to thank all of you for sharing and helping me through.
I love you's maaaaan! (As you can see I'm feeling better!)
Sincerely, W.

 

Don't get too excited yet. Same thing for me in NJ. It just took about a week to show up in the system.....

 

 

how many of those icons do you have???

 

At least one for every occassion.
Feel free to borrow one whenever you like Lynn