Alan,

Yes. Those are the springs. Although, the spring rates quoted here are much softer than I recall and the rude quality is harsh for New England roads!

I've never heard of them referred to as "barrel or beehive" before. So, to be clear, what you are saying is that in order to pull the front bar you need to be running coil overs. Unfortunately, coil overs aren't a good option here in New England, as the winters are tough and they salt the roads.

Thanks for the input!

 

Yes, if coilovers are the only way to get straight springs of at least 450 lb/in (8K) rating.

 

I realize this is an old thread...not sure if any of you guys are still around...but I just disconnected my swaybars for much of the reasons you all have been discussing here (except I'm doing it for dirt traction in rallycrossing). My worry was that I'd pull a shock apart...never thought I may break a spring!

So, Alan, you've broken stock springs on a MINI before? OUCH! And you've tried various spring rates, breaking them all, and arrived at the 450lb rating? It sounds like you must have to be so adamant about it?

Just curious. Man...now I need to figure out the spring thing.

 

No, I broke a 320 lb/in barrel spring (the stock barrel springs are about 220). Replaced it with a 450 lb/in straight, and ran it for about two years without any problem. Now run 600 lb/in springs front & rear.

So, I know 450 is fine. Less than that and you are on your own.

 

Thanks for the clarification, Alan! Is it because the extra distance that that spring can extend that there's an issue? Or possibly how hard the car is pushed and the loads caused...by sticky tires...on pavement? (I ask, hopeful the answer is yes since I'm only in the dirt)

I ran most of the season last year with the rear swaybar off - it helped so much with the oversteer. Only recently did I overhear a conversation about front swaybar removal which got me looking into it. With only 3 weeks until my next event, I'm guessing I'm not going to learn everything I need to know about buying custom springs and matching to whatever shocks by then.

Think I'll put it back on...205k miles on my stock springs and I drive the car to/from events. Guessing that would be a tough ride home.

 

Yes, it is because of the barrel spring can extend inside itself.

I think you will have the same issues or worse on a bumpy dirt track.

 

The spring (any spring) will only compress as far as the suspension geometry/bump stops will allow. Under heavy cornering loads, it's not unusual for the suspension to be compressed to the bump stops. The springs cannot "extend inside itself". Removing or disconnecting the fsb does not change this.

 

No ****, that's why it breaks.

The swaybar transfers some of the load across the car, without it each corner must obsorb all it's shock load.

 

Oh dear. The thread bumps had stopped. Readers were unswayed, barring other topics; now someone has sprung a leak it was too much to be absorbed, apparently. Lol

 

Mudhen,

Since you're racing on dirt, ignore spring rate advice from people racing on pavement. Clearly, the cornering forces for RallyCross are way less than on pavement. Forums are mostly for lolz, not for learning how to get faster. You do that by talking to people at your events and getting as much seat time as possible. Or at least post your questions to the "racing/competition" section of a forum - everything else is mostly crap. You may also find a good RallyCross article on the grassrootsmotorsports.com site if you search there. I remember one about racing in the dirt in one of my issues of the magazine.

At your next event, talk to the fast people in FWD cars - preferably same class as what you're running. Keep in mind that swapping out parts will probably bump you into a different class with even faster cars.

Have fun! I autocross and RallyCross looks awesome as well.

 

The only reason spring rates came up is regarding breakage, I realize whatever racing Alan is doing may be different than rallyx - but boy do I wish it was so I'd be able to shorten my learning curve on the best way to set up a MINI!

This is the racing/competition general discussion forum.

There's only 1 car faster than me in the top level Modified-Front-Wheel-Drive class (just because I'm asking about front swaybar removal on a MINI doesn't mean I don't have driving experience - I usually beat almost everyone else including modified AWD cars, too ) - a Golf...no front swaybar, but coilovers. If he was running stock MINI springs I would definitely ask his advice. The only MINIs I know rallying are both doing real rallying - and both running Reiger suspension now - $5k is out of my price range at the moment (especially since I just dumped $3k into my car - new clutch, Quaife, 5k different maintenance related things, etc)

Good idea about poking through past issues of GRM for generic car setup info - thx bhegg - I'm on it.

 

Finally had an event to try out the swaybar removal - seems better and no broken springs [yet]. So how does one go about getting different weight springs? Or is that only possible with coilovers?

I guess I thought I'd just call a spring store and it would be easy...lol. Even figured since it wasn't a fancy coilover I could get them fairly cheaply to try out different weights. double lol.

I'm coming up completely empty on any sort of suspension for my car. Every phone call, every website keeps telling me Reigers is the ONLY gravel option. I'm even thinking maybe just buy new factory springs - at least they wouldn't have 205k miles on them...looks like even that option will set me back $600.

 

Hi Mudhen! I may have missed what model MINI you have, so if you can provide some details we'd be happy to help. We have several spring application guides on our site that may help in the meantime.

http://new.minimania.com/Search_Results/springs/default

 

Thanks MM. I have a 2005 'S'. Looks like everything is lowering...I can't do lower.

I have a line on a set of Hot Bits gravel coil overs in need of rebuilding...sounds like they were a complete failure at stage rally - but hopefully will work fine for the much lower intensity rallycrosses. Heck, rallycrosses aren't much different then normal street driving!

 

Thanks for sharing that great photo! Hope your windows were closed.

 

Never has so many said so much that meant so little;hahahhhhhhhaaaaaa
Front sway bar NOT needed when one has proper spring rates when for a track or even autocross machine. The higher front spring rates make up for lack of FSB (500 min I'dsay)
rears need to be at least 750 rate so rear will rotate while the front, now using both wheels on tarmac can grip on entrance and exit
I picked up 2 sec's a lap at Sonoma Raceway just when I disconnected the FSB.
Now I'm just taking it out for weight savings.
Oooops ; broke my rule about too much bla bla bla