Drivetrain OBX Header Questions
#1
11-14-2006, 04:51 PM
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OBX Header Questions
For my next mod I think I want to get an OBX header. I just have a couple questions before I go out and buy one:
1. I was wondering if I can retain the use of the stock header if I cut off the cat and weld it onto the OBX header? I want to know in case I ever have to go back to stock.
2 Is it street legal to run the OBX header in California? I know it is supposed to be CARB exempt, but that does not mean street legal right?
3 What is a reasonable price (excluding the cost of the header) to cut the stock cat from the stock header, weld it onto the obx, and install on my car? I have been quoted at $300 total in labor to get it installed. Is that reasonable?
4. What kind of performance gains can I expect (I have 15%, HAI, One-Ball)? Do you need to have head, cam, etc work done to really see a difference, or will it be noticeable with what I have already done?
5 I know there is tons of information available if I search, but for those of you that have had your OBX header on for a while, what are your impressions thus far? Have they changed at all? Have you had any problems since you first put it on?
Thanks in advance!
1. I was wondering if I can retain the use of the stock header if I cut off the cat and weld it onto the OBX header? I want to know in case I ever have to go back to stock.
2 Is it street legal to run the OBX header in California? I know it is supposed to be CARB exempt, but that does not mean street legal right?
3 What is a reasonable price (excluding the cost of the header) to cut the stock cat from the stock header, weld it onto the obx, and install on my car? I have been quoted at $300 total in labor to get it installed. Is that reasonable?
4. What kind of performance gains can I expect (I have 15%, HAI, One-Ball)? Do you need to have head, cam, etc work done to really see a difference, or will it be noticeable with what I have already done?
5 I know there is tons of information available if I search, but for those of you that have had your OBX header on for a while, what are your impressions thus far? Have they changed at all? Have you had any problems since you first put it on?
Thanks in advance!
#2
11-14-2006, 05:16 PM
For my next mod I think I want to get an OBX header. I just have a couple questions before I go out and buy one:
1. I was wondering if I can retain the use of the stock header if I cut off the cat and weld it onto the OBX header? I want to know in case I ever have to go back to stock.
2 Is it street legal to run the OBX header in California? I know it is supposed to be CARB exempt, but that does not mean street legal right?
3 What is a reasonable price (excluding the cost of the header) to cut the stock cat from the stock header, weld it onto the obx, and install on my car? I have been quoted at $300 total in labor to get it installed. Is that reasonable?
4. What kind of performance gains can I expect (I have 15%, HAI, One-Ball)? Do you need to have head, cam, etc work done to really see a difference, or will it be noticeable with what I have already done?
5 I know there is tons of information available if I search, but for those of you that have had your OBX header on for a while, what are your impressions thus far? Have they changed at all? Have you had any problems since you first put it on?
Thanks in advance!
2- Dont' know
3- That sounds a tad high I would check out other shops.
4- No you don't "need" head work although it will compliment it.
5- I have one. I like it and there are at least 3 other guys in our little club that have or are going to order them. I was able to lay down decent power with my Mini and the OBX header is part of my system.
Hope this helps -- Johan
#3
11-14-2006, 05:45 PM
1) I kept my stock header to sell, I have no idea if it can be reattached to the stock cat, I would assume yes
2) Nobody except a factory trained Mini Tech and an enthusiast with way too much time on their hands would know that you had it installed. Most smog techs have no idea what the stock Mini header looks like.
3) I think I paid about that to have it installed, maybe a bit more now that I think about it. He pulled my stock header, cut the cat off, welded it to the OBX and installed it all in about 3-4 hours. That included a little time that I was goofing around with hearing the car run with no exhaust attached, just a header with no cat (It was REALLY LOUD)
4) I have the DDM HDI Box, Alta 15% Pulley, One Ball, OBX w/stock cat, and MTH Software. I had the Pulley and One ball done at the same time, that was the biggest gain. I had the OBX header done a few days later, it was noticeable, mostly in the throttle response, but not nearly as big as the pulley. I went back the same day to have the DDM Box installed, mostly because I was lazy and didn't feel like going out to buy tools that I didn't have, I noticed a bit of a change, but again not much.
5) All in all I'd say it's worth it to get, the installer (Steve's Auto Clinic doesn't do muffler work, the guy next door does all of it) was confused about the ball joint installation, as apparently this particular one mounts up slightly different than most others. He wanted to cut the spring cause it didn't fit, but after some direction on my part he got it to work another way (The only way it looked like it should have
). I'm displeased with the sound, it sounds fairly tinny when cold, but I don't think that has anything to do with the header, and if I make any changes to the exhaust, it will definitely be a cat-back. I noticed almost no changes to the sound after installing the header, it was slightly louder, but almost imperceptible.
2) Nobody except a factory trained Mini Tech and an enthusiast with way too much time on their hands would know that you had it installed. Most smog techs have no idea what the stock Mini header looks like.
3) I think I paid about that to have it installed, maybe a bit more now that I think about it. He pulled my stock header, cut the cat off, welded it to the OBX and installed it all in about 3-4 hours. That included a little time that I was goofing around with hearing the car run with no exhaust attached, just a header with no cat (It was REALLY LOUD)
4) I have the DDM HDI Box, Alta 15% Pulley, One Ball, OBX w/stock cat, and MTH Software. I had the Pulley and One ball done at the same time, that was the biggest gain. I had the OBX header done a few days later, it was noticeable, mostly in the throttle response, but not nearly as big as the pulley. I went back the same day to have the DDM Box installed, mostly because I was lazy and didn't feel like going out to buy tools that I didn't have, I noticed a bit of a change, but again not much.
5) All in all I'd say it's worth it to get, the installer (Steve's Auto Clinic doesn't do muffler work, the guy next door does all of it) was confused about the ball joint installation, as apparently this particular one mounts up slightly different than most others. He wanted to cut the spring cause it didn't fit, but after some direction on my part he got it to work another way (The only way it looked like it should have
). I'm displeased with the sound, it sounds fairly tinny when cold, but I don't think that has anything to do with the header, and if I make any changes to the exhaust, it will definitely be a cat-back. I noticed almost no changes to the sound after installing the header, it was slightly louder, but almost imperceptible. For my next mod I think I want to get an OBX header. I just have a couple questions before I go out and buy one:
1. I was wondering if I can retain the use of the stock header if I cut off the cat and weld it onto the OBX header? I want to know in case I ever have to go back to stock.
2 Is it street legal to run the OBX header in California? I know it is supposed to be CARB exempt, but that does not mean street legal right?
3 What is a reasonable price (excluding the cost of the header) to cut the stock cat from the stock header, weld it onto the obx, and install on my car? I have been quoted at $300 total in labor to get it installed. Is that reasonable?
4. What kind of performance gains can I expect (I have 15%, HAI, One-Ball)? Do you need to have head, cam, etc work done to really see a difference, or will it be noticeable with what I have already done?
5 I know there is tons of information available if I search, but for those of you that have had your OBX header on for a while, what are your impressions thus far? Have they changed at all? Have you had any problems since you first put it on?
Thanks in advance!
#4
11-14-2006, 05:51 PM
I forgot to add that my exhaust has actually gotten to be fairly annoying with the pops and burbling (I haven't had a person yet that hasn't looked at my car as it passes by because of how loud the popping is, and when cold, it's completely ridiculous, and sounds awful). Most people that ride in my car with me are scared when I leave my house after not driving for several hours (cold exhaust system) because of how loud and seemingly random the popping is. I don't mind the popping, and it sounded great stock, but after doing the one-ball mod it seemed to develop a very ricey popping sound, and when accelerating past the 3000 rpm range when cold there is a noticable buzzyness to the exhaust. I don't think this has anything to do with the OBX Header install, but I do think that it amplified the condition that was already present after the one-ball.
#5
11-14-2006, 06:15 PM
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I forgot to add that my exhaust has actually gotten to be fairly annoying with the pops and burbling (I haven't had a person yet that hasn't looked at my car as it passes by because of how loud the popping is, and when cold, it's completely ridiculous, and sounds awful). Most people that ride in my car with me are scared when I leave my house after not driving for several hours (cold exhaust system) because of how loud and seemingly random the popping is. I don't mind the popping, and it sounded great stock, but after doing the one-ball mod it seemed to develop a very ricey popping sound, and when accelerating past the 3000 rpm range when cold there is a noticable buzzyness to the exhaust. I don't think this has anything to do with the OBX Header install, but I do think that it amplified the condition that was already present after the one-ball.
And I know what you mean about the burbling and popping. I didn't notice it stock, but as soon as I got my one ball it became very obvious. It's a cool sound, but it can get kind of annoying after a while.
#7
11-14-2006, 07:56 PM
1) I guess you could. It would be easier to just buy another stock header so that you wouldn't have to re-attach the cat.
2) I'd say no. Nothing seems to be street legal in California. But I garuntee you won't have any problems with law as long as you have a cat.
3) I'd say thats a fair price. I paid about that much. Some people paid much much less, but I have no idea how they got their prices so low. Every quote I got was between 200-350. And in my opinion, it was worth every penny to have it installed. It's a major pain in the butt and I highly recommend having someone else do the install.
4) Yes, you will notice a difference with the header. I had almost the same mods as you also, and it was noticeable. It's all a midrange gain though. You probably wont gain any peak horsepower or torque, but from 3000-5000rpm I gained almost 10 ft-lbs of torque and about 5 horsepower at the wheels. Makes passing on the highway in 6th gear a breeze. You won't regret getting it!
5) I know sound is a very subjective thing, but I personally love how it sounds. The one ball+obx is quiet when cruising and comes to life when you get on it. Its not obtrusive in the cabin either. The popping is rather annoying when cold, but I think thats because my cat is bad...it was not that bad when I first installed it. I have sound clips that I made a while ago of it, http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...7&q=obx+header . If you don't have a decent set of speakers though, you wont be able to hear what it really sounds like.
I can say, make sure that it is installed correctly the first time around. I have spent more money than is imagineable on getting the damn thing to be installed correctly.
To answer your MTH question...I also have MTH and got that after the header. I feel it is decent, but no where near perfect. My car is far too rich for having a "tuner" software installed on it. Also, I've had some problems with 91 octane and timing retard. I had them write my software for 91 octane, but my car seems to have more timing retard than it did on the stock software...weird. I had them make me a file for 100 octane also, and I will say that it works wonderfully. The car is rediculous powerful with it uploaded and with 100 octane in the tank...but I don't have enough money to run that all the time! In my opinion, the car performs on the 100 octane program how is should have performed with the 91 octane "tuner" program. It does make the car rev smoother though, and it is nice to be able to rev to 7200.
2) I'd say no. Nothing seems to be street legal in California. But I garuntee you won't have any problems with law as long as you have a cat.
3) I'd say thats a fair price. I paid about that much. Some people paid much much less, but I have no idea how they got their prices so low. Every quote I got was between 200-350. And in my opinion, it was worth every penny to have it installed. It's a major pain in the butt and I highly recommend having someone else do the install.
4) Yes, you will notice a difference with the header. I had almost the same mods as you also, and it was noticeable. It's all a midrange gain though. You probably wont gain any peak horsepower or torque, but from 3000-5000rpm I gained almost 10 ft-lbs of torque and about 5 horsepower at the wheels. Makes passing on the highway in 6th gear a breeze. You won't regret getting it!
5) I know sound is a very subjective thing, but I personally love how it sounds. The one ball+obx is quiet when cruising and comes to life when you get on it. Its not obtrusive in the cabin either. The popping is rather annoying when cold, but I think thats because my cat is bad...it was not that bad when I first installed it. I have sound clips that I made a while ago of it, http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...7&q=obx+header . If you don't have a decent set of speakers though, you wont be able to hear what it really sounds like.
I can say, make sure that it is installed correctly the first time around. I have spent more money than is imagineable on getting the damn thing to be installed correctly.
To answer your MTH question...I also have MTH and got that after the header. I feel it is decent, but no where near perfect. My car is far too rich for having a "tuner" software installed on it. Also, I've had some problems with 91 octane and timing retard. I had them write my software for 91 octane, but my car seems to have more timing retard than it did on the stock software...weird. I had them make me a file for 100 octane also, and I will say that it works wonderfully. The car is rediculous powerful with it uploaded and with 100 octane in the tank...but I don't have enough money to run that all the time! In my opinion, the car performs on the 100 octane program how is should have performed with the 91 octane "tuner" program. It does make the car rev smoother though, and it is nice to be able to rev to 7200.
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#8
11-14-2006, 08:34 PM
To be honest, I didn't notice a damn thing... hard to tell whether it did anything. 4-5 HP are hardly noticable. It raised the rev limiter by a few hundred RPM's and bumped up the speed limiter, that's about all I can imagine would really affect performance. The car seems to be almost identical in everyday driving. I'm sure it did something, i'm just not that good at picking up on the 4-5 HP gains you get from these types of mods.
#9
11-14-2006, 08:38 PM
Well, it's not so much the popping. I don't mind popping at all, I liked it on my first car (Which was a LOT louder than this one) and stock, but it sounds ghetto for lack of a better explaination. It's very tinny and bumble bee sounding when you accelerate much past 3k rpms when cold (first 5-10 minutes) and the pops are very loud and echo sounding. It's hard to explain, but suffice to say it doesn't sound good. I've heard Miltek exhausts with headers and they sound fine, loud, but it's not annoying. I'll agree that there is NO drone (Well... maybe a bit, but mainly because the 06's have such crazy gearing that i'm at 3200 rpm's cruising on the highway). I'm probably going to end up swapping out the exhaust for a Miltek system. I've heard one clip of the Miltek catback and header/cat combo, but i'd like to hear it with an obx header/stock cat before I pull the trigger.
1) I guess you could. It would be easier to just buy another stock header so that you wouldn't have to re-attach the cat.
2) I'd say no. Nothing seems to be street legal in California. But I garuntee you won't have any problems with law as long as you have a cat.
3) I'd say thats a fair price. I paid about that much. Some people paid much much less, but I have no idea how they got their prices so low. Every quote I got was between 200-350. And in my opinion, it was worth every penny to have it installed. It's a major pain in the butt and I highly recommend having someone else do the install.
4) Yes, you will notice a difference with the header. I had almost the same mods as you also, and it was noticeable. It's all a midrange gain though. You probably wont gain any peak horsepower or torque, but from 3000-5000rpm I gained almost 10 ft-lbs of torque and about 5 horsepower at the wheels. Makes passing on the highway in 6th gear a breeze. You won't regret getting it!
5) I know sound is a very subjective thing, but I personally love how it sounds. The one ball+obx is quiet when cruising and comes to life when you get on it. Its not obtrusive in the cabin either. The popping is rather annoying when cold, but I think thats because my cat is bad...it was not that bad when I first installed it. I have sound clips that I made a while ago of it, http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...7&q=obx+header . If you don't have a decent set of speakers though, you wont be able to hear what it really sounds like.
I can say, make sure that it is installed correctly the first time around. I have spent more money than is imagineable on getting the damn thing to be installed correctly.
To answer your MTH question...I also have MTH and got that after the header. I feel it is decent, but no where near perfect. My car is far too rich for having a "tuner" software installed on it. Also, I've had some problems with 91 octane and timing retard. I had them write my software for 91 octane, but my car seems to have more timing retard than it did on the stock software...weird. I had them make me a file for 100 octane also, and I will say that it works wonderfully. The car is rediculous powerful with it uploaded and with 100 octane in the tank...but I don't have enough money to run that all the time! In my opinion, the car performs on the 100 octane program how is should have performed with the 91 octane "tuner" program. It does make the car rev smoother though, and it is nice to be able to rev to 7200.
2) I'd say no. Nothing seems to be street legal in California. But I garuntee you won't have any problems with law as long as you have a cat.
3) I'd say thats a fair price. I paid about that much. Some people paid much much less, but I have no idea how they got their prices so low. Every quote I got was between 200-350. And in my opinion, it was worth every penny to have it installed. It's a major pain in the butt and I highly recommend having someone else do the install.
4) Yes, you will notice a difference with the header. I had almost the same mods as you also, and it was noticeable. It's all a midrange gain though. You probably wont gain any peak horsepower or torque, but from 3000-5000rpm I gained almost 10 ft-lbs of torque and about 5 horsepower at the wheels. Makes passing on the highway in 6th gear a breeze. You won't regret getting it!
5) I know sound is a very subjective thing, but I personally love how it sounds. The one ball+obx is quiet when cruising and comes to life when you get on it. Its not obtrusive in the cabin either. The popping is rather annoying when cold, but I think thats because my cat is bad...it was not that bad when I first installed it. I have sound clips that I made a while ago of it, http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...7&q=obx+header . If you don't have a decent set of speakers though, you wont be able to hear what it really sounds like.
I can say, make sure that it is installed correctly the first time around. I have spent more money than is imagineable on getting the damn thing to be installed correctly.
To answer your MTH question...I also have MTH and got that after the header. I feel it is decent, but no where near perfect. My car is far too rich for having a "tuner" software installed on it. Also, I've had some problems with 91 octane and timing retard. I had them write my software for 91 octane, but my car seems to have more timing retard than it did on the stock software...weird. I had them make me a file for 100 octane also, and I will say that it works wonderfully. The car is rediculous powerful with it uploaded and with 100 octane in the tank...but I don't have enough money to run that all the time! In my opinion, the car performs on the 100 octane program how is should have performed with the 91 octane "tuner" program. It does make the car rev smoother though, and it is nice to be able to rev to 7200.
#10
11-14-2006, 08:50 PM
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#11
11-14-2006, 10:22 PM
I'm not aware of any other way to switch maps than through the interface cable (reflash).
GIAC used to offer a dynamic map program for VDubs (Valet mode, 91 Octane, 100 Octane, Etc, think you could store 3). I don't know if anything similar is offered for Mini. I bought MTH based on availability (Didn't feel like shipping my ECU out for a week, this is my only car) and because it was cheap (I paid 325). To my knowledge, there's nothing drastically different between the various ECU softwares available, so why spend more!
GIAC used to offer a dynamic map program for VDubs (Valet mode, 91 Octane, 100 Octane, Etc, think you could store 3). I don't know if anything similar is offered for Mini. I bought MTH based on availability (Didn't feel like shipping my ECU out for a week, this is my only car) and because it was cheap (I paid 325). To my knowledge, there's nothing drastically different between the various ECU softwares available, so why spend more!
#12
11-15-2006, 07:12 AM
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For my next mod I think I want to get an OBX header. I just have a couple questions before I go out and buy one:
1. I was wondering if I can retain the use of the stock header if I cut off the cat and weld it onto the OBX header? I want to know in case I ever have to go back to stock.
2 Is it street legal to run the OBX header in California? I know it is supposed to be CARB exempt, but that does not mean street legal right?
3 What is a reasonable price (excluding the cost of the header) to cut the stock cat from the stock header, weld it onto the obx, and install on my car? I have been quoted at $300 total in labor to get it installed. Is that reasonable?
4. What kind of performance gains can I expect (I have 15%, HAI, One-Ball)? Do you need to have head, cam, etc work done to really see a difference, or will it be noticeable with what I have already done?
5 I know there is tons of information available if I search, but for those of you that have had your OBX header on for a while, what are your impressions thus far? Have they changed at all? Have you had any problems since you first put it on?
Thanks in advance!
1. I was wondering if I can retain the use of the stock header if I cut off the cat and weld it onto the OBX header? I want to know in case I ever have to go back to stock.
2 Is it street legal to run the OBX header in California? I know it is supposed to be CARB exempt, but that does not mean street legal right?
3 What is a reasonable price (excluding the cost of the header) to cut the stock cat from the stock header, weld it onto the obx, and install on my car? I have been quoted at $300 total in labor to get it installed. Is that reasonable?
4. What kind of performance gains can I expect (I have 15%, HAI, One-Ball)? Do you need to have head, cam, etc work done to really see a difference, or will it be noticeable with what I have already done?
5 I know there is tons of information available if I search, but for those of you that have had your OBX header on for a while, what are your impressions thus far? Have they changed at all? Have you had any problems since you first put it on?
Thanks in advance!
Lets see -
1) you could always graf back the stock cat to the stock header. BUT you will not go back to stock - even if you sell the car - why go thru the unistall expense for a 200 header?
2) Calif. - Not from Calif but w/ a cat you should pass any inspection requirements.
3) I spent 200 to install header and ss weld of stock cat.
4) had your set-up - you will feel a TQ gain mid rpm (very useable gain for the street) and a percieved hp gain at top end.
5) definetly do a search and READ! some useful install info and even dyno numbers.
Prior to install you have decision - as it / header wrap / thermo coat /
Once you have done this - get an ecu upgrade and it will tie all your mods together. I went with GIAC but there numerous options. READ "ecu GIAC upgrade" to help you pick the ecu software.
#13
11-15-2006, 07:19 AM
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I have their 15%/CAI/Exhaust file and I am delighted with it.
#14
11-15-2006, 07:49 AM
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If you don't mind me asking, how much did you pay for your GIAC flash?
#15
11-15-2006, 08:06 AM
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#16
11-15-2006, 09:30 AM
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GIAC sounds like the way to go for me too. I don't plan on doing much more than 15%/Intake/One-ball/OBX Header, so their 15% file sounds perfect. Plus the 30-day guarantee gives me a no pressure window to return my car to the way it was if I am not satisfied with the upgrade. 
I have a feeling, however, that I will be from what others have experienced. Now I have to decide whether its worth it to upgrade to a CAI from my HAI. I might just leave it as I don't think I will be able to tell the difference in power.
#17
11-15-2006, 11:11 AM
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On GIAC - go over the return and reflash policies with the local installer (no misunderstandings).
#18
11-15-2006, 11:22 AM
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One of the reasons I am contemplating switching to a CAI is because I got my HAI free from someone who was switching to a CAI and had no use for it anymore. I have no idea how many miles it has been on the car since I didn't get a chance to look at his odometer or if the filter has ever been changed, since that guy just bought his car used from someone else. 
I know I can just go out and get a replacement filter and call it a day, but if I'm already going to be spending more money I might as well use that money towards a CAI right? At least that's what I tell myself...
I know I can just go out and get a replacement filter and call it a day, but if I'm already going to be spending more money I might as well use that money towards a CAI right? At least that's what I tell myself...
#19
11-15-2006, 11:26 AM
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Helix does for sure.
#20
11-15-2006, 11:32 AM
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Thanks for all the helpful tips everyone! NAM is awesome! 
#21
11-15-2006, 11:58 AM
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Does anyone have any experience getting GIAC flashes in SoCal? I did a search at GIAC USA and got the following dealers for Mini's. Are one of these places the place you went to? If not, where would you recommend to get it done?
OC:
VF Engineering
Euro Sport Accessories, Inc
GMG
San Diego County:
AJ USA
All German Auto
Group 5 Motorsport
LA County:
Torque Factory
Weilinger Motoring Group
Wicked Motorsports
Too bad I don't live on the East Coast or I would go to Helix.
OC:
VF Engineering
Euro Sport Accessories, Inc
GMG
San Diego County:
AJ USA
All German Auto
Group 5 Motorsport
LA County:
Torque Factory
Weilinger Motoring Group
Wicked Motorsports
Too bad I don't live on the East Coast or I would go to Helix.
#22
11-15-2006, 12:00 PM
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Same thing if a newer better flash for your car becomes available.
#23
11-15-2006, 12:01 PM
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#24
11-15-2006, 01:04 PM
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#25
11-15-2006, 03:03 PM
No experiance at all with GIAC. I've only heard good things about them in the VDub tuning world... can't imagine they're much different for Mini's :-).
I don't know much about the HAI, other than the fact that I know engines like to suck in cool dense air (Hotter air is less dense). I went with the HDI box because i've heard good things about it, and it looks good. I ended up painting mine black (Got it thermal coated, one of the first i'm told, and didn't like the gold finish) but it's coming off, so i'll have to work on repainting it sometime. M7 treated me fine. It took forever to get because of the thermal coating, but peter and the other folks there treated me great and ended up refunding the 75 bucks for the thermal coat and sending it next day air for me (Even though I only live about 30-40 miles away).
I don't know much about the HAI, other than the fact that I know engines like to suck in cool dense air (Hotter air is less dense). I went with the HDI box because i've heard good things about it, and it looks good. I ended up painting mine black (Got it thermal coated, one of the first i'm told, and didn't like the gold finish) but it's coming off, so i'll have to work on repainting it sometime. M7 treated me fine. It took forever to get because of the thermal coating, but peter and the other folks there treated me great and ended up refunding the 75 bucks for the thermal coat and sending it next day air for me (Even though I only live about 30-40 miles away).