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If you are asking me to comment on what you put in bold, read further down the web page and you will see the answer:
All of the values indicated are based on standard production vehicles and are obtained with 98 octane (RON).
Measurements are performed in accordance with DIN (German Institute for Standardization) 70020 which means at the clutch, at 293 K / 20° Celsius / 68 F, and 1013 Pa.
Here in America we measure it differently.

 

1/4 mile is not the end of tuning. Tuning, among other things, enhances throttle response which has nothing to do with 1/4 mile. The driver can influence that more than any other one factor.

 

So I'll get 200hp on a stock(163hp) MCS if I use 98 octane(RON)?

 

Keep reading the testing parameters...Measurements are performed in accordance with DIN (German Institute for Standardization) 70020 which means at the clutch, at 293 K / 20° Celsius / 68 F, and 1013 Pa.

 

Can you explain what that means to someone who doesnt understand it? It's not a hard question I'm asking.

 

He is saying no unless you meet the required testing environment..
I wonder if they can replicate that number with dyno graph to show, from Germany.. under the same testing parameters

 

If you test a new or blueprinted engine using the DIN method and with 98 RON fuel you will generate approximately 200 HP at the clutch.
Here in America, that is not our typical method -- I rarely see blueprinted engines on an engine dyno. I have been testing a few stock MCS's lately for exhaust development purposes and I see about 135 HP at the wheels on average.

 

I'm sorry but to me that is shady.

So how many hp can I expect to see in the engine from just MTH Tuner? from 163 engine hp to? I have no idea what temp it was when they got 163hp out of the stock MCS...

 

I dynoed my stock MCSC 06 and then loaded the MTH Tuner File made for a stock setup. I ran the recommended miles before doing the next dyno. The ambient temp was within 5F and humidity was the same between the two runs. The curve definitely showed a 5% improvement throughout from 1.5k until around 6.7k. Above that your torque in either config was already on the down turn and HP matched. Redline was bumped up from 6.75k to 7.2k.

No I'm not going to show numbers as I think there's way too many variables to get twisted over. The important aspect is what your delta's are. Not total HP. I'll try to edit my pics to show only the curves. Maybe tomorrow?

 

BMW uses the DIN method: 20° Celsius (68 deg F)

 

Something seems inconsistent because as you advance the ignition timing in these engines the HP will increase (up to a limit, of course, due to detonation).

 

How many additional hp will I get from an MTH Tuner file on a stock MINI Cooper S? 37hp +/- 10hp? (200-163=37)

 

163 HP for your '03 + MTH software with 98 RON and DIN conditions, you can expect 195 at the clutch.
This conversation is all posted on my web site. Nothing new here.
I can tell you, however, from looking at your signature that the 3" exhaust you are running will not be helping you make power. It may be loud but...

 

So I should be making about 30hp with only MTH Tuner file, sounds pretty good.

Yes I know the 3" cat-back isn't much for performance.

 

MTH is great!! I have not seen any dyno provin that the file will bring a stock MCS to 200hp, but the file is awesome!!

I have no problem with it on my car. It pulls strong from 2000rpm to 7200rpm...

The traction control mod & no-hang RPM mod are great.

And MTH can make a file to match almost any mods...


On the other hand, GIAC seems pretty good too... GIAC is a well-known tuner!!

 

You don't wanna show the numbers - fine by me but PLEASE do share the comparison / deltas.

The tough thing about ECU upgrades is that you can't hold it in your hand and compare it to another brand. I have seen very few before after comparisons and would love to see it so please take the time and modify the charts.

Wouldn't it be great if there was an ECU shoot out! Yes, it would be heckled over and some brands would scream foul but I for one would love to see it. Maybe MC2 will conduct one someday - bet that issue would really sell.

 

I thought I did. I'll repeat: +5% throughout the curve until 6.75k.

DMH - Sorry that my numbers don't support the claims. I'm just reporting on my discoveries. By now I've already made hardware mods and additional MTH Tuner Files based on those mods have already been loaded and dynoed every step of the way. I wish I could've added A/F measurements but alas... The most important thing to me was not as much the power gain as the way it smoothed out the delivery and pulling all the parts together in a much more cohesive way.

Thanks. I just got home from work so I'll work on it tonight. I'm not very good at this sort of thing so patience is the name of the game.b

Wouldn't it be great if there was an ECU shoot out! Yes, it would be heckled over and some brands would scream foul but I for one would love to see it. Maybe MC2 will conduct one someday - bet that issue would really sell.[/quote]

 

For dyno comparisons all must be as close to equal as possible and that means operating temperatures and the IAT. And that is hard to do without a rheostat helping with the controlling.

 

My '02 had a Helix 15% which certainly added power and GIAC tuning which produced very noticeable smoothness. My '06 has a Helix 17% and GIAC tuning which produced a noticeable improvement in power vs. the '02, as well as a more distinct supercharger whine. This is a great combination with zero problems over four years in two different Mini's.

 

exactly! That's why I'm not posting numbers. I came pretty close to ambient temp & relative humidity but they are still going to account for a large discrepency in results. That's why I'm not posting numbers. My measurements are not professionally derived in a lab. I use them merely for determining the delta from one mod to the next so I can know whether I'm getting addition or subtraction through each step of the way. Sure I wish I had the money for a wind tunnel and if frogs had wings...

BTW, if I had this to do all over again I wouldn't change a thing except I would've got my stuff from Don! He has bent over backwards to help me from being stranded high & dry by a less reputible vendor. I recommend him and the MTH Tuner File product for anyone who is doing power mods. You won't be disappointed.

 

Ok, this is a chart that compares the curves between a stock 06 MCSC 93 octane (DANE001 in red) to the same car but with a MTH Tuner File for the stock (DANE006 in blue). Ambient temp was about 5F different & RH was about 2RH different. If you notice there is about a 5% increase in performance all through the curve except for the end. Don't know why. I didn't take A/F's or IAT's or whatever else. I suspect the previous middleman I dealt with did not report my specs correctly.

 

I don't think that Eric claims 30 hp from the GIAC, but having the dyno right there in his shop, he seems to have a good handle on what various software packages make. Btw, he has dyno charts on MTH as well .

 

Wish my MTH dyno chart looked like that....

Looks good!

 

I do realize that some of you think that top end dyno power is the end of the line but there is more to tuning than that. Drivability is the key for both the street and track. And that means closed loop as well as open loop tuning. Please keep in mind that dynos that do not allow you to hold a steady throttle are not ideal for tuning because you cannot tune in the closed loop. Either are dyno setups that cannot control IATs. They are only good for open loop, to the redline pulls.

 

preach on, preach on, preach on!