What are the advantages of a hot air intake compared to a cold air intake?

 

I think it was here (NAM) that someone did an underhood temp test. When the Mini is moving the temp is pretty much the same underhood as is outside.
Help me out here, does anyone remember that post? It might have been under the Hot Air Intake thread...
Found it! Hot Ait Intake thread (good read)

 

Hi Randy,

I have bought some M7 products including the scoop and the catch can. The quality is first rate. Your other equipment also looks first rate. Peter has been incredible answering my questions......I am an M7 fan. I am very interested in the AGS and several people I respect have them and like them. At this late date....months into it......isn't it fair to ask for performance numbers. I WANT to buy one. I had one on order and then I had some personal problems and I put my car on hold, I'm back. Randy Webb has published his findings on several different intakes........can't you do the same with the AGS? I'm not trying to start trouble....I'm really not.

Bob

 

I read a lot:

http://www.cooperspeed.com/forums/sh...?t=2380&page=3

 

The HAI works and is a low cost, elegant solution. I seriously doubt the other commercially available CAIs consisting of a filter, tube, and heat shield are worth the $100 to $150 extra. The AGS is in a different category with the revised SC tube, so I can't comment on this.

Although inlet air temp at standstill may be higher than a CAI, the lack of tubing and the large filter area in the KN 1540 give the HAI the edge on flow. Andy showed that compared to the Alta, the HAI has about 0.5 psi less pressure drop.

I love the slightly enhanced sound of the SC; from what I'm told it is not nearly as loud in the cabin as the Alta. Get the HAI and put the money you save toward an exhaust, or MTH, or TB ... that's what I'm doing!

 

The short answer is the hot air intake (HAI) is simple.

You just attach an air filter to the throttlebody and remove-
The stock intake box (both top and bottom), the intake snorkel, the intake to throttlebody hose, and the plastic piece that runs from the front cowl to the snorkel.

Air is rushing in when you drive and provides enough cooler air for the air filter that it works (at least better than stock).

You can do it yourself and put the stock parts back in if you don't like the results.

There is no heat shield so when you do stop to park, open the bonnet to let the heat out and cool off your engine.


Prices on any of the intakes can vary from source to source so shop wisely and widely.

 

Is there anyone out there can just put an end to this by posting the number for this AGS. How many AGS has been sold? There's got to be one that had dyno it right?
If the number are good, more sale for M7 and if not then is everyone choice to chooses which intake they want. I am one of them that want to know the dyno results.
P.S. Nothing against M7.

 

Bob your post is valid and I do not think in any way you are trying to cause trouble. When Randy Webb tested the intakes he was testing products he did not manufacturer. Lets think for a moment if he had one of his own creations in the mix and he showed better results than all the others . There would be some here on NAM that would think his results biased. The same thing applies here . If we post numbers of any kind there will be all kinds of comments whether warranted or not. We are just trying to avoid that as best we can. We have shipped a good number of units. There has been some independent testing done and those individuals were satisfied with the results but have chosen to avoid the forum wars as well. I am confident that someone will post their independent results and we feel confident they will match up with what has already been discovered. Thank you for your post.

Randy
M7 Tuning

 

Ahh crap here it goes again

 

I disagree jlm. Do you have an AGS installed to back up this opinion? The RTV is not necessary with the final production model. The RTV is not part of M7's installation process. I improvised this method to ensure my seal wouldn't move because mine was a "pre-production" version only used by a few beta testers :smile:

 

my mistake, apparantly. But look at it this way: there have been reports of leaks at the SC with the AGS; you reported how the RTV solved the leaks and then later, after 3 months, how it was leaking again. There is no mechanical support for the cantilered weight of the tb and filter except the bypass hose, making the adhesive crucial. I don't particulary have an issue with M7, but asking the adhesive to do the job typically requiring a clamp is a marginal solution.

In my opinion, the factory solution is weak, even though they take the weight with a bracket. Had M7 figured out a band clamp for the AGS, they would get my support.

 

Let me clarify...Mine's a "pre-production" version which did not benifit from from beta testing which concluded the leaks were resulting from large mating angle varience of SC/AGS amongst different year Minis. The current production version, as I understand it, have had this angle adjusted to compensate for the varience. Does that make sense? Please correct me if I'm wrong Peter/Randy:smile:

 

- (just going by pictures) supporting the ags via the rubber tube does have the advantage of avoiding a cte mismatch / thermal stresses due to heat induced length changes between the ags tube and the engine.

- i have to give some defense for the much maligned stock internally ribbed tb to filter tube. i'll bet the ribbing is to stress relieve the tb from forces caused by a rigid or semi-rigid tube attached to a moving engine / tb and to a fixed air filter box. somebody went to a lot of trouble to mold those in, so i wouldn't dismiss the design so quickly.

 

Let me try so explain why we do not need to have a mount for the TB as does the stock system. This is apparent to those that have seen the AGS first hand but for those who haven't I will try to make things clearer.With the AGS system the throttle body base is 5/8 of a INCH from the fitting which connects with the rubber tube.The system is connected to the engine only and is free to move as it does. Attached to the TB is only the filter which has no significant weight. With the TB and filter mounted eight times closer to the support provided by the rubber tube there is no leverage asserted on the AGS tube itself
On the other hand the stock system is very different in design. The throttle body is over 4 inches away from the rubber tube connection.Then there is the ribbed air tube which connects to the air box. Not only does this weigh a bit it also is connected to the air box which does not move as does the engine in its mounts. Therefore there is some amount of pull on the TB itself. These three reasons are why there is a mount for the TB when using other intake systems . These are also the reasons we do not need one with our system
Again this would all become very clear when you actually see the components in place but for now I hope I have put this in a clear enough light for all to understand.

Randy
M7 Tuning

 

Sounds great. Thanks Randy!

 

this is NOT true with the stock ribbed tube; see my post just above. a solid tube, like the alta looks to be, WILL put more force on the tb due to engine movement and thermal growth. whether it's enough to matter is another question.

 

Ive got the AGS on my car and i have had no problems after the Install. Even with Randy Webb pulling the motor up to put on a M7 Pully at the recent MD/DC area pully party. And to me as the way the design is with the rubber hose on the bypass valve isnt as bad as you think it is, if you think about how tight you screw down the clamps and how much closer the TB is to the S/C it doesnt seem like much stress. I havent seen any movement on my AGS tube or anything since i have installed it. Even with running the car hard and grabing gears i have yet to see it come loose or move.

 

Thank you for the observation. I think that when more people actualy see the AGS they will have a better understanding of the product.

Randy
M7 Tuning

 

I love my AGS. I do, however, have a question. Have any of you AGS owners been getting SES & EML lights? Mine have been coming and going. I get the light, ignore it, get to destination, turn off the car and when I start it up again, the light is gone. I think that it's the ECU thinking that there is an air leak, because it is getting so much more air.


Anybody?

 

Before we get into another AGS debate, let me take a moment and shift back to the original topic of this thread: which intake?

Thanks to Steve (from Steve's Auto Clinic), I'm now a very satisfied JCW intake owner. My concern was mainly the noise vs. gain factor. Since most of the intakes are producing about the same HP range (5) at similar cost (picked up mine as part of the upgrade kit split purchase), I decided to go with one that will complement my next mod, the catback exhaust.

My observations: during low RPM the sound is very subtle, if any at all. The engine does seem to rev faster. But the party starts at 4500 rpm, and the super charger whine is really music to my ears, not to mention the slight rush the engine seems to provide as a result of more air.

Bottomline, as someone else has already stated, it's the sum of all the parts, not the individual component, that will provide you with the power gains. IMHO, JCW intake is about as good as any. Plus, it's just a matter of time before someone like K&N comes up with a replacement filter. Then this is just the perfect kit for me and my needs.

 

I've only had my AGS on for a few days but the only time I had the SES/ EML lights come on is when I made a bone head mistake when tightening the bypass hose clamps. When I slid the clamps in place they were in perfect position, however, when I tightened them down the clamp interfered with bypass valve and held it in the open position. This basically caused the car to bog down in the higher RPMs and go into limp mode. Imagine my surprise when I took my test drive while accelerating on the freeway. I made a quick adjustment on the hose clamp and I haven't had any SES/EML lights since. From my experience if you have an air leak you will definitely hear it, it is one heck of an annoying high pitched whistle at idle.

PS sorry to hijack this thread, I should have PM'd Webstrands.

 

I don't think it's a leak. I idle perfectly and if there were a leak, it would not be idling smoothly.

 

I have a DINAN intake in my S, I just love it because it looks like the original box but has a wide opening in the back so sure the engine breaths better.

I love the sound too, it may not be as loud as an Alta or equivalent but when I hit the gas, you can really hear it when it sucks air. Best thing is that I dont need to be too carefull when I clean the engine compartment as the filter is well protected from spills.

Only difficulty was to cut the plastic wall behind the filter box as it needs to go further in the back to get air in the "sealed" compartiment. it has roughly the same design as the JCW without the electric flap but also cost a lot less ($250)

 

Just go with the ALTA. It's one of those intakes where no discussion is needed.

 

alta cold air intake is the way to go.