Helix13mini,

I sent you an email the other day regarding the 19% GIAC and injectors. Hope you recieved it. Hope to hear from you soon.

 

RC injectors are around $90 each, so are you balking at an extra $100?

 

Some rough estimates from Helix13-
Initial install of 15% pulley $400 for parts and labor
Change from 15% to 19% pulley and smaller belt $200 parts and labor
New Factory Siemens 380cc injectors $115 each x 4 and 45 to 60 minutes labor est $460 + $65= $510-525 but price likely to be better once cheaper source found for injectors (in progress).
GIAC for various sized pulleys always $325 installed.

So go from 15% to 19%/GIAC/380cc injectors installed for $1050.

 

Yup thats what I had figured as well.. Wish I could do it all at once but that would put me in the dog house.. so I will settle for the smaller pulley now and the balance by Spring.. and yea..jlm.. a 100.00 savings if it works out is a decent savings and I do not have to HAVE to have the extra power right now so waiting for Siemens 380s at a "possible" better rate is not gonna to kill me.. I have other irons in the fire right now..

 

I had a meeting with a new injector connection yesterday. We fitted several injectors into my car to check for clearance. Although we didn't have the perfect fitment for a 380cc injector, there is one available, which fits perfectly; and get this, it would cost around $75 per injector. That's a brand-new, factory built (not a re-valve) injector. We are having some shipped from Germany and should have them on the car in a couple of weeks. Barring some unforseen disaster, this would be THE solution that I have been looking for. Of course, with all things automotive, it's not done 'til it's done, so keep your fingers crossed.

 

So I only over paid $140? That's ok - I'm cool with that. It's the best upgrade - worth every penny Eric!

 

Well I guess a lot of this makes sense, but I'm wondering how much is due to the injectors/19% and how much is the GIAC. Correct me if I'm wrong (and I will always defer to Eric), but I thought the GIAC software doesn't really modify anything (throttle response, maps, rations) unless and until you're at WOT - in which case it really kicks in and kicks a**. Just curious.:smile:

 

FIRST of all, I already had the 19% pulley. In fact, I've had the 19% pulley for 33k miles (14 months)!

SECOND - adding injectors without a specifically tuned ECU is not recommended. At lower RPMs you'd actually run richer and lose power!

So I already know how much power and pleasure the 19% gave (and I had the 15% for 17k miles before that). So ALL of the NEW gains are from the GIAC and injectors. And the injectors only help at the very top end. So the GIAC software alone has provided most of my recent pleasure.

Now WHERE in the world did you hear this? The ECU is precisely tuned. All throttle positions at all RPMs. Air/fuel ratios, ignition timing and who knows what else. You can give it just a tad of throttle off the line and it'll accelerate nice and smoothly. Like nothing you have never experienced in a MINI before. Trust me, a lot of time and effort went into this ECU.

 

I'm looking forward to trying this out (with lots of datalogging of course) when the summer tires go back on.

 

I'm considering going this route too. I don't know if the performance pay off will be enough to justify the expense considering my level of satisfaction with my current setup. I'm running a 15% reduction pulley, alta intake, mth software and a milltek catback. According to Eric the torque figure may gain 9ftp and maybe an additional 5hp.

Greatgro, what rpm is your power band hitting at? My concern with the 19% pulley has always been about highway driving and pronounced power band changes at 65 to 75 mph. You know, driveability. Afterall my car is just a daily driver. I know I know you said your car is a smoothie, I just need some reassurance. Help!
:smile:

 

Score!!! Are these Siemens units as well? Good luck with the new units..
Looks like theres gonna be lots of fun down at Atco this Spring..

 

After reading this thread I am very excited. My only question is: I now have a 19% pulley, I have access to a set of 2005 JCW injectors. Would these be able to work the GIAC tuning flash for the 19% pulley?? I was told that the JCW injectors are 380's. Is this true? IF it is I am getting this done this weekend. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks!

 

I'm not sure exactly what you're asking. Driveability is great of course. My MINI is 11.5% faster in the 60-80mph range from the GIAC/injectors alone! That's versus an already fast 19% setup. But that's in third gear. You can use 6th and pass people with EASE even at 60mph. Not sure if that answers your question. What are you talking about - "My concern with the 19% pulley has always been about highway driving and pronounced power band changes at 65 to 75 mph". What does that mean? How could the 19% negatively affect that? Could you clarify that?

 

Greatgro, as you know by reducing your pulley to 19% your power comes on at lower revs, what I'd like to know is where in the rev range do you notice the car get stronger as in your powerband hitting. I do most of my driving on highway at 65 to 75 mph, that is in the 3000 rpm range give or take. If I'm in 6th gear in the 3000 rpm range I wouldn't like my car to be in the in and out of the powerband state of tune. I hope that claryfies my question for you. You'll have to forgive me otherwise I'm talking to you in motorcycle language.
Thanx for your help.:smile:

 

Dont forget about that pesky supercharger! I guess you could just add some ponies to the desired crank HP number....

--
Cheese

 

Hey cheese, just scroll down further to the Fuel Injector Worksheet.
OOPS! had to edit this post.
I just tried it out looking for 275 Hp but don't know the fuel rail pressure so left it at default (175 PSIG), duty cycle .75 to be safe.
It said 27.42 lb/hr, 288 cc/min.
Anybody, please share.


What the heck do I know anyway?

 

I think I understand now but remember, this is a supercharged car not a turbo. The power delivery is linear not exponential. It's been a long time since my MINI was stock so maybe the difference there was greater. Even with the 15%, I don't remember a particular RPM where the powerband began. But there isn't ANY spot in the RPM range with the 19% where there's a power surge or anything. ESPECIALLY with the GIAC, like I said, the power delivery is VERY smooth. Cruising at 3k RPMs, you won't be going in and out of any powerband. It's got smooth power delivery at 1k RPMs now. I have yet to find a spot where it just starts to dominate - it's powerful all over.

 

Greatgro, thanx for your patience and info. You've answered my question, that is good news. It sounds like your set up has a more linear power delivery than mine. I feel the power come on stronger somewhere between 3500 and 4000 rpm, I would have to pay attention an look to know exactly where it starts. I'll have to give this upgrade real consideration, the cost is equivalent to 3 car payments

 

You can always do it in installments. You could just start with the 19%. I had the 19% with the stock ECU for 33k miles.

 

Yes the JCW injectors are the right size. You're good to go! ENJOY!

 

i need to do this to the womans Mini....$1050 huh? good thing i know a GIAC dealer...gonna hit this up in the summer...

tell me, the added injectors, are thye needed?

Does the 19% pulley make enough power to require the further addition of fuel? Or is it just that much better for the system as a whole to run the upgraded injector set?

I was thinking about doing a 15% pulley on the MCS, but this 19% w/software and injectors sounds awesome.....my only quesdtion is, what is the reliability with it?

This is on my womans MCS, she wants more power, but she needs the everyday reliability of the car.

ANy ideas on which route to take for this?

Thanks,
Steve

 

I think when Helix gets the new, less expensive injectors in, it will be under $1000 for the 19% pulley, GIAC ECU and injectors. What a bargain. You could stop there and have a faster MINI than all but the very heavily modded ones.

The injectors AND software is not NEEDED. It's well worth it, IMO, but you could get a 19% pulley and leave it at that. That'll give you around 20lbs of torque and almost as much HP.

The GIAC ECU and injectors for the 19% are a package deal. The ECU is TUNED for the larger injectors so you would absolutely not want to run the stock injectors with the 19% ECU. That would be bad. The 19% makes enough boost (16-17lbs in hot weather up to 19lbs in the very cold) that yes, it needs larger injectors at high RPMs to make the most power AND keep temperatures down.

The only problems 19% pullies have had are a few reported incidents of broken belts. But there are some weak links in the belt supporting structures on the MINI. I believe Helix is working on this to help support these other parts - belts (and tensioners and idlers) have broken on MINIs with 15% pulleys as well and even on bone stock MCSs. Broken belts rarely occur with street use. It is heavy tracking of the MINI that sometimes causes a belt to break b/c of the severe strain and heat. I've had my 19% for 36k miles with no issues. I've had some type of pulley on for 51k miles and currently have 62k miles on my MINI. Runs better than ever. Obviously adding a pulley adds some risk, but to most people the risk is very very low. Ultimately it's up to you to decide what's risky and what's not. I highly recommend you call Helix ( http://www.helix13.com 215-739-8800) and ask for Eric. He'll go over all the pros and cons of all the different sizes in an honest and unbiased way and help you make the right decision for you. :smile:

BTW, my MINI is my daily driver and I plan on keeping it another 60k miles.

Keep in mind you COULD go the 15% route and get the GIAC for the 15% pulley. That would only cost you $700 total - LESS than most ECUs out there (mth excluded) and give significantly more power. The injectors are not needed nor recommended for the 15%.

 

Hey man, thanks for the AWESOME reply.....i understand on how programming and injectors work together, so i can see the benefits/potential. I run 440's in my 1.8T w/Big Turbo programming for a T3/T4 turbo and without the injectors i would be dead in the water.

But for her car, i want to make it reliable. Something "bolt-on" so to speak. Put it on and forget about it, and just enjoy the benefits. No monitoring of AFR, or temps, etc.

So my choices i think are 15% and GIAC programming

or 19% and GIAC Programming/Injectors


not even putting exhaust/intake into the conversation because those are irrelevant in this decision right now. Right now im focusing on a pulley and programming.

id like to get programming MOST definetly. Because i am firm believer in when you run fuel maps that are made for your car with your modiciations (example, 15% pulley w/programming for A 15% pulley) will make your car that much better then if you just had the stock ECU.


ill see where my budget takes me on this. If i had my choice id be all over the 19% one. But ill have to consult with her as well. We are waiting till her warrenty is up anyways, so whatever breaks is on us anyways no matter how we look at it. Know what i mean.

 

Any dyno results showing exactly how much power an MCS with just 19% pulley, 380cc injectors, and GIAC would be making? My guess is around 185-190hp? Greatgro, have you dynoed your car and if so how much hp/tq are you making now with the GIAC and injectors?

 

[QUOTE=SHUMopper]
But for her car, i want to make it reliable. Something "bolt-on" so to speak. Put it on and forget about it, and just enjoy the benefits. No monitoring of AFR, or temps, etc.

So my choices i think are 15% and GIAC programming

or 19% and GIAC Programming/Injectors

not even putting exhaust/intake into the conversation because those are irrelevant in this decision right now. Right now im focusing on a pulley and programming.

QUOTE]

SHUMopper,
From what you have described I would suggest the 15% pulley and GIAC as being the best solution for the cost and benefit with the least hassle and worry. You don't need an upgraded intake, exhaust or anything else but those are also helpful when you are ready.

Light wheels and non runflat tires would also help alot so when you are ready that would be a big upgrade in performance.

Ethereal,
Given that the stock MCS has about 145 WHP if you added "Only" the 19% pulley, GIAC and 380cc injectors then I'd estimate a dyno could show about 175-180+ WHP. There is alot of variation from one MCS to another. Eric at Helix13 can give you the closest estimate. It's hard because many of those that have the 19% have upgraded intakes, exhausts, headers, throttlebodies and more.