Here's a BIG post that kind of gathers all of the information from the link of the above post in regard to the Webb Motorsports stuff:

We are flowbenching every head we do - and we've found all sorts of little tricks to make more power in the head. It isn't just in the porting either. We're now using larger valves than the "larger valves" most of the other guys are using, and our valve job is a bit different as well. The flow bench numbers come with the head when you buy it, so you know exactly what you are getting.


Here's a flow bench test from one of the heads with the old "big valves" - expect a little more flow on the exhaust side with the new valves (I sent that head flow chart to the buyer though).

For the bench numbers, we are using 28 for a pressure drop, and the stock peak numbers are around 120 for the exhaust and 170 for the intake. I haven't done testing with the head not using a cam, as the porting is based on the lift from the new cam, but other than that, I have done dynos with everything else being as equal as possible. The issue is the dynos were done on different days (I had to install the head after all), and I had to try to get the temps the same with the Scan Tool. Dynoing the MINI isn't easy! I've also had customers dyno their own cars, but obviously I have no idea what control was like.

The numbers range from 13 to 19 horsepower on average depending on what other items there are. With the fuel injectors, ECU and other flow items addressed, on a Dynojet, I'm seeing over 20 (but not much over 20).


Final numbers:
intake lift cfm
.050" 52.8
.100 81.7
.150 109.3
.200 138.4
.250 166.5
.300 188.6
.350 203.2
.400 210.7
.450 214.0
.500 214.8


Exhaust lift cfm
.050 50.7
.100 83.5
.150 117.7
.200 141.3
.250 154.4
.300 160.0
.350 162.3
.400 163.4
.450 164.7

You'll note that it says final numbers - that's because we port then take it to the bench, then port some more, then back to the bench, etc. That gives us valuable data to make sure we keep going in the right direction.

Here are the numbers with comparisons to stock using one of the first heads we did - the numbers are higher still now that we've learned more.

They are stock, 1mm oversized, and 1mm oversized ported.

lift __int stk __1mm stk __1mm ported __exh stk __1mm stk __1mm ported
.050 __32.7___49.3_______51.7________31.0_____29.7_____ _44.7
.100 __66.2___82.6_______84.2________51.4______45.0____ __82.7
.150 __98.2___110.4______111.1_______76.9______81.2____ __113.6
.200 _127.4___136.2______149.4_______97.5_____106.9____ __137.9
.250 _153.0___160.1______176.1_______106.0____120.1____ __151.4
.300 _169.1___179.3______195.5_______111.0____126.9____ __158.6
.350 _174.3___182.3______205.8_______113.0____130.2____ __160.6
.400 _175.7___191.0______209.5_______114.5____132.1____ __162.6
.450 _175.3___193.4______211.0_______115.9____133.2____ __164.3
.500 ___________________215.7__________________________ _166.3

The ported values go higher due to the additional lift of the new cam. This is the street head, and you can see the great increases we got in flow at the lower lift values. The race head has higher flow numbers up top, but not as good at lower values.

I also have two different heads - one is ported for outright top power, the other for drivability. Two different cams are used with those as well.

Finally, our head includes the cam - for $1705, making it the biggest bargain on the market.

Here's a shot of it:





Here are some of the flow bench shots:







Here are our other pieces which have been on the market with good success for some time now:










All of these work well together, and the header is a recommended upgrade with the head as well. Upgraded injectors may be needed, and if they are, you also need to upgrade the ECU to take advantage of them. This project may end up costing a bit...

As a side note, we looked at the black intake to the supercharger as well, and found that as long as the flashing and all is cleaned up nicely, the unit flows pretty well. That surprised me if you have ever seen the cross section.

Let me know if you have any questions.

Randy
720-841-1002
www.webbmotorsports.com

 

Randy,


Tell us a little more on the intake manifold and S/C runners that you have. I have a JCW, and that would be a good stealth addition. Does it make sense? What kind of power are you getting? hp/torque? And what rev range are you seeing it in? Thanks.

 

Randy:

does your chart mean you are seeing .500 valve lift with your cam? Can you clairify this?

 

No, but we are seeing more than .45, and the flow bench works in .05 increments.


I haven't tested the numbers before and after on a JCW car with the runners and manifold. I have installed them, and we did an after run (in Providence on the Dyno Dynamics unit), but that doesn't really give you a good comparison.

On a typical modified car, I'm seeing gains in the 5-7 horsepower range, and that holds about even across the RPM band. It starts at about 2500 (which is really where the dyno run starts being useful) and makes 3 or so hp gaining to the peak at redline.

Hope that helps.

Randy

 

Thanks Randy.

 

Randy
Newbs49. My car was the one with the runners,intake plus the throttle body. Total gain with all three was 6hp,but the car didn't have a real good cool down before dyno run. Yes it did improve the car. The car has the stage II injectors in it from the JCW kit. Thanks Larry

 

We are going to be testing our intake runners that were ported (we are still waiting on the manifold), plus we are testing them with performance coatings from Calico (http://www.calicocoatings.com). They have been ceramic coated on the outside, as well as Calico’s CT-4 heat dissipating coating (magnesium) on the inside to keep the runners cooler. This should help the efficency of the engine by keeping lower intake charge temperatures, as well as increase the flow from the porting that we did. Should be interesting.

 

newbs,

This was on a JCW?

 

always fun to see testing gear

 

dgszweda1

Yes the car is a JCW which Randy has helped with a lot of improvements.The combination of the intake ,runners and TB jumped the HP by 6 on a car which didn't have the best cool down after the mods were completed. I would really like to hear more about Pilo's project intake and runners. Sounds interesting with the coatings. I know Randy and Yarrow had a discussion about JET Coat when I was at the Rhode Island pulley party.

 

An interview with Larry Widmer of ENDYN, http://speedtalk.com/broadcast/index.html.

 

i spent an hour listening to it; the guy is the king. In this context, note how he talks about flowing the head conventionally (on his custom flow bench), and then flowing it using laminar flowing air to measure the amout of quality flow he is getting, not just max cfm.

 

Jim,

When you say "amount of quality flow" are you referring to a measure of the nature of the flow (laminar or turbulent)?

And is it another level of measurement to determine the content of the flow?

Paul

 

I'm no expert by any means, but I think what he does is try to get the max flow with the least disruption due to turbulence and optimize the air path. when he is flowing laminar air, he can see where the flow is actually going, so it reveals the quality of the flow...remember the part about assymetrical radii on the bowl side of the seat to direct more of the flow sideways into the combustion chamber as opposed to down into the cylider wall...that kind of thing. He also made a point about decreasing port size, which would probably lower flow rates, but increase gas velocity, therby improving cc filling.

 

Dang it, I missed it,

"i spent an hour listening to it; the guy is the king. In this context, note how he talks about flowing the head conventionally (on his custom flow bench), and then flowing it using laminar flowing air to measure the amout of quality flow he is getting, not just max cfm."
But spent an hour or so reading some real good stuff in the forums.
Thanks jlm for the tip!
http://speedtalk.com/forum/

 

ENDYN is doing my head. Eric at Helix is doing the install. What ever info I get I will be glad to share.

 

I guess the 850cc in my STi would be a little overkill? LOL.

 

Thanks for the heads up. What all is he doing on the head?

 

Good combo!

 

Eric Has been cordinating everything for me. ENDYN seems to have a very long waiting list, so if you are looking for a quick install, that may not be the best route. I am having a cam & Larger exhaust valves put in. Right now They told Eric around 3-6 weeks before they take the head in to start the job. That was roughly 4 weeks ago.
You will also need to get a spare head which Eric was nice enough to arrange for me.

 

Just so you know... DPR (a Pilo Racing Partner) has a Cylinder Head at all times as a core, and can get a Modified head to your spec out in about 3 days, as all Pilo Racing Customers get priority Scheduling. No waiting required... Also, Our cylinder head is currently being used on one of the Highest if not the highest Horse Power Mini Cooper in the US right now at over 280 Wheel HP, and soon to be 300.

 

Dan, do you have any before and after dyno #'s for the head on a less modified car then el diablo ? I am curious as to what gains you are getting from your dps head.

 

This is our lowest model head. No Valves, No Retainers, and a Street Port Job. We have much wilder variations now that make more power.

 

I can't believe I leave the honda camp to come over here and still have to hear about Larry. For every one person whose satisfied dealing with him, there are 25 who are disgusted. I just sold one of my old race engines to a guy in Panama who has been waiting over a year for Larry to send his engine back.

As many public lies as he's been caught in, I can't believe people would still send him business - especially with all of the other good vendors out there.

 

no doubt JeffS will be happier with the level of experience brought by other vendors on this forum, like Pilo.

for my buck, the info from Larry is unmatched.