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And just how will that ^^^ help ? It's another cheap tube/fin Chinese knock off, offering absolutely nothing in terms of heat rejection,, that the stock intercooler can't do with a little help from an air diverter guide plate.
This means the forge is good or no good? Since it is a knockoff of Helix FMIC... but almost as expensive...........
Neither do what we do. Neither have all the features or attention to detail that the Helix stepped core intercooler offers. There is a reason ours is more expensive.
Neither do what we do. Neither have all the features or attention to detail that the Helix stepped core intercooler offers. There is a reason ours is more expensive.
Exactly. I have a helix, so i'm not shitting on it, trust me. I love it.
But, to all the haters of "its less expensive automatically means its crap" ...why doesn't everyone who hates on this wagner also hate on the forge? I rarely ever see anyone hating on the forge unit.... maybe they'll respond because its a known reputable company... but also is true for wagner, just across the pond not here. Then I bring back up the unichip. lol
But, to all the haters of "its less expensive automatically means its crap" ...why doesn't everyone who hates on this wagner also hate on the forge? I rarely ever see anyone hating on the forge unit.... maybe they'll respond because its a known reputable company... but also is true for wagner, just across the pond not here. Then I bring back up the unichip. lol
haha this actually made me laught ! It is so true, why not one is saying that Forge is a cheap knockoff ? Wagner and Forge are based on the same design ... and price is about the same. In Europe, Wagner sells for $700++ since they only opening their market to the US, the price is lowered.
Btw, I dont understand why ppl are saying "cheap knockoff" $500 isnt cheap ... and if the company makes IC for Audi, BMW and Porsche, I dont think they would just have it made in China, paint it and sell it massivily to the US ... anyway.
If you make X boost and Y intake temps before, and the same boost levels are present (aka no change in pressure drop across the IC) and the intake temps are cooler, then it works.
If you make X boost and Y intake temps before, and the same boost levels are present (aka no change in pressure drop across the IC) and the intake temps are cooler, then it works.
That sounds a logical idea, however, it's not that simple is it ?
X boost Y intake temperatures and you carry the same X boost into the aftermarket intercooler with no change in pressure across the intercooler core and end up reducing Y
By what volume comparison have you based this simulated equation on ?
You can't use the stock intercooler X and Y factors then increase the volume by the quoted 280% volume increase and say, wow look it works, simply by the shear volume increase will have an effect on Y you could alter Y simply by replacing the stock factory intercooler with a 50mm ø straight finned tube, what you need to find out is how efficient at heat rejection the Wagner Tuning intercooler is, in comparison to another similar stepped core front mount intercooler.
Random question to you Czar, can you paint the intercooler ? for example, let say I get an Forge or Helix, how would I go with having it stealth black without "harming" the IC
Random question to you Czar, can you paint the intercooler ? for example, let say I get an Forge or Helix, how would I go with having it stealth black without "harming" the IC
If your a purist and are purchasing an intercooler for performance cooling of your charged air, then why would you want to apply a thermal barrier ?
With the above said, the measurable difference between a raw unfinished and painted (thermal barrier) intercooler, will be quite minimal, but will depend on the paint blend and the density of the coats applied, however for street use where aesthetics play a greater role than performance, then it's a personal choice.
Also lets say you do paint your intercooler, are you going to spend the many hours needed to prepare each individual charge tube, end tanks, top and bottom finishing plates to accept a paint finish, without it flaking off after a month of constant abrasive abuse from suspended air particles, stones and driving water ?
If you don't do the preparation then your intercooler will look quite unsightly after a short while, you'll then be in a dilemma, do you strip it back to it's raw unfinished as it should be look, or repaint it!
Sorry to continue to sidetrack the original post, but I bought a radiator that was black anozized. Is anodizing a viable option for an intercooler to alter the appearance?
As for the original post, I would think that buying from a reputable vendor would not be a risky manuver. My guess is that any of the IC's mentioned (wagner, helix, forge, alta) would provide a major improvement in performance from stock. Unless the car will be in a highly competitive environment (or unless the owner is chasing every last horsepower), there is probably little to lose with the 'best deal' at the time of purchase. If you want black, go with Alta. If you believe that Helix may have the best technology, go with them. Forge has a great following, so you can go with them. If Wagner can save you $$, and they have a solid reputation, go with them. For a street car using a butt dyno, any of them will be a good upgrade.
Mike
I couldn't find any Hellix so i end up got a Wagner instead its seems pretty nice to me,the fitment wasn't that easy i had to do a little bit of mods,i had to cut the top mounting point wich just used less and it was in tge way
Just got my Wagner Intercooler installed on my 2012 Mini Coupe S R58. Installation was no biggie. I did it over the course of a Saturday taking my time. The biggest challenge I had was removing the air hoses as they were on tight! I wanted to keep them to sell but on the last one I got tired of the struggle and cut a slit into it. A couple observations:
1) I removed the hard plastic air vent, the one that has the sensor on it. Located on the left side of the engine as you are facing the car. This required loosing the engine bay frame, headlight and a couple wires that were clipped on the engine. While this isn't necessary, I did it because I was trying to get the hoses off without cutting them.
2) I would recommend clamping the air hoses on the intercooler first as those are the tightest area's to work with. I deleted the air hose resonator on the right side of the engine as you are facing it and replaced it with red silicone Forge hose.
3) I modified the front crash bar to facilitate intercooler. Before I cut it, I did observe that it would fit, albeit very tightly. Due to concern of the intercooler moving a bit as it has rubber mounts, I elected to remove some material from the crash bar with a grinder cutting wheel and painted it. When putting the crash bar back on, I ended up having to put a jack underneath the frame tube piece because alignment was not 100% which had nothing to do with the intercooler. You have two bolts that you have to access from the inside and those were tight. With the added fact that they were torx screws it made alignment and screwing them in next to impossible. This may not be every mini, mine may be slightly out of alignment. I used a 14 mm socket instead of the torx as it was easier to use and it does have a 14 mm head on it in addition to the torx head.
4) I didn't remove the top tab of the intercooler. I'm debating on taking the crash bar back off and threading a hole where I can use a bolt through the intercooler top tab for added rigidity. It doesn't appear that the intercooler is in any danger of pushing into the radiator as it sticks out about 1/4" but just for peace of mind I think I may do this.
5) I broke at tab on one of the air hose inlets trying to get the bumper off. Instead of trying to remove the air hose inlet, remove the faceplate of the air inlet.
UPDATE: the hardest damn part of this entire install was getting the damn bumper back on. Said more curse words in one setting that I have done all year. Too many plastic tabs to line up and it's basically held in by friction not screws. I had a screw left over, no idea where it went. Broke one of my intake tabs. I have a new one but I'll be damned if I'm going to take this off again.
Front tab still in place
Last edited by the_redpill; 04-21-2017 at 11:39 AM.
You pm'd me this info and you're still not convinced on either Forge or Helix? Geez...
Not always true. I got a forgery , an ebay clone of forge, it works great, I am pushing 25PSI in map C and it drops temps just fine. I think it was $299 shipped. Have had installed for a couple of years, no problems.
Up to you. My forgery bolted right in, no tweaking , no fuss. All the hype I read about flow and turbulence and what ever. All I know is I put hot air in and cooler air comes out , and way better than the tiny stock did.
I bought a Wagner Tuning intercooler for my JCW. It was an easy install and fit nicely. Unfortunately I don't have before or after numbers since my need came rather suddenly.
An unhappy Hilla being upgraded.
A happy Hilla visiting the parts department for plastic bumper fasteners!
I had a cheap IC (but beautifull) installed in my 2011 N18 Cooper S. I though it was working great until i start to control, through my smartphone, the intake temps (IT). then i check in foruns and realize that my IT was surprisingly high!
I endend up buying an Airtec Stage 2, considering the reasonable price and some good feedback, especialy in ford community!
What i can say is that Airtec works great and isn´t very heavy - maybe 5/6 kg (i don´t weight it but it seems light).
Values was recorded in similar conditions: hard pull from 4th, 5th and 6th, untill +- 6000 rpm, continuing pushing 6th for a while (in best possible safe conditions ok!!!)
With the cheap IC the temperature reaches the maximum much more quickly, while with the airtec it goes up much more slowly
Despite the pressure drop of the Airtec i don't notice any power loss. However with it i felt a more consistent top end power (most noticeable in higher gears)
08-17-2012, 12:36 AM
