I just think you can't accuse based on one data point, in science, engineering, any factual profession conclusions are derived from repeatability and consistency.

I don't think you should bad mouth people unless you have evidence based on repeatable results.

On the communication hand however, I agree poor show - but a little respect and gratitude go a long way in getting someones help.

 

It's simply amazing how much assumptions are being made here without anyone having the full context. I rest my case as I seem to have gone into a RMW fanboy territory that's willing to suck ***** for him. Giving feedback on a poor experience does not equate to bad mouthing, it's being fair to others that are evaluating a tuner. Whether it may have been possible or not, my take is as a so call reputable tuner the undeliverable results at the end of the day should have never been passed on to the customer. You can't do it, don't blame every other component on the car till the cows come home, suck it up and admit you can't do it and give a full refund. I would have been more than happy if that was the case, unfortunately it wasn't.

 

Your original comment was that you flashed your ECU and then your fuel pump died, but the tuner wasn't the one who manufactured the fuel pump. So if you feel the need to blame someone, why not BMW / MINI? You're absolutely right, we don't have the full context, only you and the tuner knows the real story. But you came here and posted up an extremely vague statement that doesn't make logical sense... I'm not sure what you expected to happen. Classy move with the signature too.

 

My fuel pump blew as a result of a sequence of events after my tune. The car didn't run smoothly, was jerking, and huge clouds of smoke was emitting from the exhaust the first time I floored it.
Until someone can convince me that the jerkiness and black smoke was somehow NOT caused by the tune (which I think it's absolutely as clear cut as it can get), which consequently blew my fuel pump, I'm all ears.
Putting a blame on mini or BMW after something fails due to an aftermarket modification...i suppose mini wouldn't put that disclaimer on the warranty policy if that was the case huh

 

Well it was a classy move that the tuner had me pay for restocking fee, so I'm returning the favor

 

This thread seems to describe that he did try to help you troubleshoot your issue (suggested a failing HPFP and sent you a few other maps to try). You finally discovered the root cause (cracked fuel pump) and got everything "back to normal"...then you went back to him for a new tune? So if you thought the tune caused your fuel pump to crack, first of all 1) you're on crack and 2) why would you even go back to him for another tune?

https://www.northamericanmotoring.co...ml#post3212186

 

Simple because I have paid for it and gave him a chance to send me a proper tune which he couldn't

 

How could he send you a "proper tune" with a malfunctioning fuel pump, which, by the looks of things, more likely than not was not at 100% before the tune?

 

Omg I am really lost for words, I just don't know how much clearer I can put this. The fuel pump blew, was replaced, he had three months to give me a proper tune, could not and did not provide a full refund for all the troubles.
Stop thinking it can't be his fault just because he has done good work before, open up and accept there are customers out there like me that did not get their end of the deal.
This thread was started to get recommendations for tuners and I'm sharing my experience.
But obviously we can see there are way too many fan club members here that can't accept their guru's shortcomings.

 

You missed the point. If you said he didn't respond after three months and any other complaint no one would have said anything. My posts have to do only with a tune (any tune) hurting a fuel pump. It is impossible and I was just trying to explain way.

You can say anything you like about RMW and I can not dispute that. The fuel pump thing though is very simple to dispute and I owe it to anyone else who has no clues how cars work to try and bring them up to speed.

Posting problems you had with a tuner isn't the same thing as posting physically impossible things.

 

I believe if it's such a simple device, it would not have suddenly
Gave way. I mean how many of us here have that fuel pump cracked? Unless I missed that it's a common problem on every other car like the hpfp.

 

To me it sounds likely that your LPFP was dying to begin with - probably a manufacturing fault of some kind.

Bad timing meant that it failed at the same time as your RMW tune. Possibly as you went out for your first "spirited" drive; I don't know. Obviously it's a really tough one to judge without having been the one driving the car as it died.

The symptoms you described - the stuttering, jerking and black smoke are all symptoms of the pump failing. That is to say they were caused BY the pump failing, they didn't make the pump fail.

The pump is a very simple device - when the car is turned on it receives a constant voltage from the battery. It is in no way connected to the ECU, so the tune couldn't have affected it. It would be like - and I know this is a hyperbole - one of your headlights blowing the next day, and you making the same connection. I know that's not really what you want to hear, but that's how it is.

The long story short - you had one of those awful one in a million coincidences. A manufacturing defect at the same time as your tune.

I'm not saying forgive and forget, or change your opinion of him mind you - it sounds like you got some fairly rough customer service. But that's all he's done wrong - the fuel pump is something you should be getting angry at BMW for.

 

Fuel pump going early, check.

Power steering pump going early, check (more of a question of when, not if).

CV boots leaking early, check.

Hyrdaulic engine mounts going way early, check.

Granted, these are mostly R53 issues, but the R56 has a number of things known to go prematurely, and the fuel pump is on that list.

Your other issues may be legitimate, but like HRM said, the faulty fuel pump, and the initial tune, those are coincidental, not causative. Just like my rear trailing arm going dangerously loose after my tune. The tune had nothing to do with it, but they happened at roughly the same time.

 

I have the RMW tune and also a pet cat. am i at risk of the same problem??? if so im gonna have to un install the tune.

 

You should know better...our cars make way more power when you're catless!

 

 

When it comes to tuning your going to want to weigh in a few factors that really get compared among their own individual groups. Figure out what you like the best among those and you should have a good foundation for deciding what to go with.

The three things I like to look at are:
1) What is being used to tune the car
2) Who is tuning the car
3) The type of support offered before and after tuning the car

So say we were to look at those.

1)What is being used to tune the car?
For the R56 your limited to a few options right now that make practical sense. Dimsport ,AccessPort ,Evolve Remote tuner, and Bench flashing.

Bench Flashing: Not really all that practical since the ECU has to be removed, but is relevant for 2011+ owners since it's the only available tuning option on the market. If you own an 07-10 R56 this should not be considered an option given what else is available.
Retail cost: roughly $500-$700

Evolve Remote Tuning: There hasn't been a whole lot of discussion on this. Kinda the new kid in town as far as R56 tuning tools goes, but for what ever it's worth I've only heard good responses from users that have it. The owner can load and unload maps as well as return to stock mapping via the OBD II port. This is a plus over bench flashing as it allows the end user more freedom and control. Maps are provided based on the customers request and are provided with in the cost of the package. The unit it self is justan adapter cable, so a lap top is required. This may not be a problem for some, but it can limit it's portability for those that do not wish to have the lap top with them at all times. Affordability can be an issue for those that do not have a lap top.
Retail cost is listed at $800 w/ one map

Dimsport: Like the Evolve, the Dimsport can load and unload maps as well as flash back to stock using the OBD II port. The improvement over the Evolve unit is that it is a hand held unit. All the maps (total of 10 )can be stored on the device rather then a lap top. It is a little bulky, but can fit in the glove box. It is just a re-flash tool and comes with no map support from Dimsport. Maps are provided by the company or person selling/tuning the device so there is that added cost to consider. The handheld unit can be bothersome to use. Since this is not a MINI specific device, there are a number of menus to navigate through just to reflash a map.
Retail cost: $500 w/ no mapping

Access Port: Again like the Dimpsort and Evolve units, this device can load, unload maps and reflash to stock via the OBD II. Like the Dimpsort it is a hand held device, but much smaller ( about the size of a smart phone, but a little thicker ). It also can store more maps and has a color LCD screen. Although the device it self is used for multiple applications, it is sold application specific. This means it will come pre-programed, for the MINI in this case, with any where from 10-15 pre set up maps covering most of the common after market set ups available as well as various pump gasses. This makes navigation and flashing very simple as well as eliminating the absolute need to contact the seller for new maps. Custom maps can also be loaded at the owners leisure. With the AP the end user will also have the ability to data log and view live data. This is extremely help full for all sorts of reasons ranging from remote tuning to simply a free gauge to monitor any number of sensor out puts. There is also code scanner built into the device. Owners can read and clear fault codes just like a handheld code reader. Probably not as important as the other 2, but still cool, the AP has a build in 0-60 calculator.
Retail cost: $900 w/ 10-15 maps

2)Who is tuning the car?
Ok this one I don't want to get into too much detail. It's touchy and hard to express opinions with out seeming unbiased and derailing the thread.
Basicly there are small hand full of tuners that are commonly brought up. I'm sure there are plenty more, but lets focus on the ones with more notoriety.

1)NM Engineering, Dinan, and Precision Auto Works:
These three got lumped together since they all do about the same thing with very similar claimed results. These three companies offer bench flashes. As I mentioned earlier this is about the only option currently out for the N18 or 2011+ owners. All three have a decent reputation it seems like, but very little feed back from actual users at this time. Again not really a practical solution for owners with 07-10 models. Tune out come is questionable with the limited user responses available, but the few out there seem positive.

2)Evolve: Based out of the UK. They offer remote tuning using their cable/sofware package. User feed back seems good and they have a good reputation in the UK. Remote tuning can be a draw back since it can be time consuming. A responsible tuner can get some decent power out of the car, but will usualy not take it to it's limit with out physically having it on the dyno. So canned tunes tend to be conservative, but safe. I'm not sure how many trusted shops they have here in the states that will do remote dyno tuning for them, so availability is uncertian at this time. Tune out come is questionable with the limited user responses available, but the few out there seem positive.

3)RMW: Based out of So Cal.Probably the most recognizable name for MINI tuning at this time. Most of their success can be attributed to the R53 market though with R56 tuning not as favored. They seem to favor the Dimsport for tuning the R56 and offer remote tuning as well as on site dyno tuning. Very well known for "tuning parties". These are scheduled tuning events at various shops across the country. This is nice since it allows people to have a little better access to a dyno tune. Tunes outcomes very from good and reliable to poor based on user responses leaning on the good side.

4)WMW: Based out of Atlanta. Not known for tuning alone, but has a pretty good reputation among the community non the less. Tunes using the Dimpsort as well. Offers remote tuning with on site tuning available as well. May do off site tuning, but is not known for it. User feed back not as overwhelming as others, but is pretty good. it to can very though.

5)Mynes Tuning: Based out of SoCal. Like RMW, probably more well known for R53 tuning. Uses the Dimpsort for tuning the R56. Not really that active anymore on forums so R56 user feedback is low. R53 owners either love them or hate them.

6)Alta Performance and Cobb Tuning: These two pretty much go hand in hand when it comes to R56 tuning. Use the Alta AccesPort for tuning the R56. Combined they form an network of 5 shops and 7 -10 tuners. User response is pretty good with some negative feed back.

3)The type of support offered before and after tuning the car
This like the previous section can lead to some heated discussions so I'l do my best not to offend any one. Again I'll focus on the companies and tuners I previously listed.

1)NM Engineering, Dinan, and Precision Auto Works: These got lumped together again since they share a similar service with similar user response. Since there is not really enough people chiming in on tunes from these companies it's really difficult to gauge how customer support really is for the R56. Best any one can do at this time is trust the claims of each company and look into feed back for other platforms they support.

2) Evolve: Again this is a hard one to gauge since so little feedback has been posted by actual users of their R56 tuning options. User feed back from the most relocatable community, BMW has been pretty good.

3)Dimsport: Can offer support, but for the device not the tune. They seem pretty good at helping, but generally MyGenis owners should not need to contact them.

4)RMW: Like their tune feed back, their customer support is all over the place. More feed back can be found from R53 owners, but it still translates. Basically some claim awesome support others claim horrible support. Most agree it can be hard to get support though.

5)Mynes Tuning: Again, this is tough since they and their customers keep to themselves. Not really a lot of R56 owners with tunes from them. Best case is to review R53 owner responses.

6)Alta Performance and Cobb Tuning: These two again go hand in hand, but more of the customer support end falls on Alta. Customer support feed back is pretty possessive with some negative, more on the positive side though. Alta does a great job with updates and responding to customers. Cobb and it's tuners / engineers are available as well to provide them with support as needed.


FWIW I hope this helps. Sorry if some things sound bias, I tried to be fair though in my assessment of things.

 

Nice write up Mike. (You even did a great job of keeping things equal)

From your professional standpoint, is it possible to have a tune blow a LPFP (Low Pressure Fuel Pump) in the tank of an R56? Much less have the tune somehow be strong enough to "Crack" it?

 

Please make #68 a sticky! Useful info!

 

If some one came to me and said a flash or tune killed the pump then I could see it being possible. I've seen some issues happen like this after a tune. I've even killed my front speakers after a series of flashes. Since most of the electrical in the R56 runs one way or another through the ECU there is the chance to electrically damage some thing unrelated to the engine. Although it's a slim chance it's still a chance.

To actually crack it though? I'd be completely dumfounded to find out that a tune or reflash could do that. I mean I guess it could be possible, but I find it close to extremely improbable.

 

Makes sence. Thanks Mike

 

Thanks Mike for the very well structured feedback.
That was what exactly I was trying to point out, it's a possibility. But everyone here got really defensive about it which lead to a pointless discussion.

 

I watched my tech reset my service indicator, not sure if that's what u mean. Unfortunately, he did it so fast I only caught him hold the start button and the odometer **** on the left I think. Not sure if that'll help for resetting any fault code though.

 

one of the best write ups ive seen mike!

 

"I mean I guess it could be possible, but I find it close to extremely improbable."