Drivetrain (Cooper S) MINI Cooper S (R53) intakes, exhausts, pulleys, headers, throttle bodies, and any other modifications to the Cooper S drivetrain.

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  #376  
Old 11-06-2011, 02:25 PM
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Its a 4-1 manifold, which has 40 mm primary's and a 57 mm collector.
Al straight tubes, equal length 430 mm, Normal cat is 200 cpi, but it's a clog now

So a decat wouldn't necessarily mean I would lose BHP's?

Thanks for the info, have you got an ebay link for the cat..?

Cheers!
 
  #377  
Old 11-06-2011, 03:11 PM
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Here's the link to Magnaflow's product page for that cat

http://www.magnaflow.com/02catalytic...niversal=59956

Kevin
 
  #378  
Old 11-06-2011, 03:11 PM
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Originally Posted by daveke
Its a 4-1 manifold, which has 40 mm primary's and a 57 mm collector.
Al straight tubes, equal length 430 mm, Normal cat is 200 cpi, but it's a clog now

So a decat wouldn't necessarily mean I would lose BHP's?

Thanks for the info, have you got an ebay link for the cat..?

Cheers!
That's 2.25" collector, what is your current cat size and cat-back size? Although not as nice as your header in build quality mine has a 2.5" collector and the 59956 2.5" cat, into a 2.5" cat-back. At 15+ psi on a Eaton and definately in your case the twin screw, I'd be using a full 2.5" system. Also a 4-1 header design and 200cell cat will create all the backpressure you'll need.

http://item.ebay.com/viewitem?itemId...id=48908951305
 
  #379  
Old 11-06-2011, 03:21 PM
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My current cat is 2,25 and the Milltek is 2,5 all the way down.
I bought the Janspeed purely because it is a manifold which has 4 equal tubes, which has a step up in diameter.

The primary's are 1.57 inch, the collector is 2.25, cat is 2,25 and the catback is 2,5

I could go for a 2,5 cat which creates and even nicer flow from the cat to the exhaust and a better flow into the collector.. Choices..
 
  #380  
Old 11-06-2011, 06:35 PM
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I see, then that link above has what you need
 
  #381  
Old 11-07-2011, 10:11 AM
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You could also just have a test pipe fabed up with flanges, and go catless. Then have a cat made with the same size and flanges for inspections.

I never had a cat on mine since before the Sprintex, and dont plan on ever running one again. Got to love having a house in a NON- emissions controlled area.
 
  #382  
Old 11-08-2011, 11:20 AM
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GOOD LUCK TO daveke s PROBLEM.
Back to the Sprintex.
I was google-ing a lot, Nam and other Forums ...but i don´t find any information or thread what will be the smallest,drivable,Pulleysize...below 60- ok.
But what happens exactly to the compi.- ...the same like with the Eaton when you go below a ~53,54 (but there s no mechanical waterpump behind !!??)
Merci
 

Last edited by Mad Maxxx; 11-09-2011 at 01:06 PM.
  #383  
Old 11-09-2011, 09:35 AM
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Mine is going decat and is running A-OK.

Waiting on the decat-pipe, but that should arrive fairly soon!

No idea.. I'm not planning on running smaller then the 60.. Or the IAT should stay really cold with W/M. What would be my best option? 50/50 mixed with water, 100 Meth, or 100 Water, or some other mixture?

Will be using Aquamist HFS3 Kit early next year
 
  #384  
Old 11-09-2011, 10:47 AM
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Unless you are running E85 stay with either a 50/50 or 60/40 Meth on the high end. Also dont be afraid to try different alcohols I found that denatured alcohol has the best bang for the buck.

People will tell you 100% meth is best, theese are under informed people. Water has far greater cooling properties and heat absorbtion factors than alcohol can provide. The alcohol still serves a big purpose in anomization and resistance to freezing, so find a good mix that controlls the temp but dosent richen the AFR more than .2.

If you ever tune to run E85, you will find that you can run A LOT more water in your mix, and scale down your nozzle size. On E-gas I was running 10% denatured alcohol, 90% water. And as a kicker I would fill my 3 gallon tank with crushed ice then add my mix, only when I was going to be running the car HARD though.
 
  #385  
Old 11-09-2011, 11:28 AM
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As far as exact smallest pulley size, anything under 60mm and you have to be really careful with your engine rpm, the S/C does have a rev. limit.
 
  #386  
Old 11-09-2011, 11:35 AM
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Will try 50/50 and 60/40 then

We have Octane 98 here at the pumps, so E85 is not an option for me
 
  #387  
Old 11-09-2011, 11:47 AM
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98...you lucky s.o.b.
 
  #388  
Old 11-09-2011, 01:19 PM
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I could get 100oct here at a local station in Denver but, the $7.00 per gallon is a deal breaker.

When I get the motor rebuilt I will be going back to gas for a while, so I can get a good base / travel map going on 91 + meth. I might do a tank of 100oct to tune the secondary timing map a little further when it's time.

For us here in the states, E-gas is an option but has its ups and downs. It does make more power, it is cheaper than 85oct normally is, and you are running so much of it that it will actually cool the intake charge. On the other hand, it needs a lot of tuning to get the mapping nailed down, you will end up paying more fo a week worth of driving than you would using premium, and the gains are not as substantial as they are in other cars (EVO's STi's). You will still see some good gains (15-20 HP) but not the 60HP you will get out of an EVO set up to run it.

There is one thing that running E85 in your MINI will get you, BRAGGING RIGHTS! Not manny people can get the tune for E85 right, and if you can, that says you know what you are doing.
 
  #389  
Old 11-09-2011, 01:43 PM
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Originally Posted by DICKS GARAGE R53
I could get 100oct here at a local station in Denver but, the $7.00 per gallon is a deal breaker.

When I get the motor rebuilt I will be going back to gas for a while, so I can get a good base / travel map going on 91 + meth. I might do a tank of 100oct to tune the secondary timing map a little further when it's time.

For us here in the states, E-gas is an option but has its ups and downs. It does make more power, it is cheaper than 85oct normally is, and you are running so much of it that it will actually cool the intake charge. On the other hand, it needs a lot of tuning to get the mapping nailed down, you will end up paying more fo a week worth of driving than you would using premium, and the gains are not as substantial as they are in other cars (EVO's STi's). You will still see some good gains (15-20 HP) but not the 60HP you will get out of an EVO set up to run it.

There is one thing that running E85 in your MINI will get you, BRAGGING RIGHTS! Not manny people can get the tune for E85 right, and if you can, that says you know what you are doing.
You were just running Meth to cool the intake charge on you MINI right? Just asking because on E85 alone you can max your timing out way past MBT. Running Meth on top of e85 is pointless if you are doing it for power and not just cooling the charge down.

The reason that the EVO's STi's, turbo Hondas, or Turbo anything make a ton of power on E85 is they can up the boost a lot easier then a charged mini can. So they bring the boost up and then run the timing out the top at around 20+ degrees.
 
  #390  
Old 11-09-2011, 01:56 PM
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I live only half an hour away from Germany and the famous Autobahn
They have oct 100 & 102 there..

I wont bother with running E85 here, as it is not as common as it is in the US. Plus, Oct98 does the job pretty well here! That combined with a good meth setup will be awesome I guess. When I'm installing a fresh set of mods next year and the car is going to be set up at 1320 again, I'll make sure I'm bringing a full can of Oct98 with me so they can tune it with my home-gas in it together with the W/M
 
  #391  
Old 11-09-2011, 02:01 PM
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I just read that E85 will be available in Holland in some time.. Might be worth getting a tune for it at 1320

Would that mean I need even bigger injectors than the 550's that are in the car now?
 
  #392  
Old 11-09-2011, 02:12 PM
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Originally Posted by daveke
I just read that E85 will be available in Holland in some time.. Might be worth getting a tune for it at 1320

Would that mean I need even bigger injectors than the 550's that are in the car now?
Honestly you need a bigger fuel pump and depending on your power goals i would go with bigger injectors.
 
  #393  
Old 11-09-2011, 02:16 PM
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Never mind, 350 on the crank is also available without E85
I'll stick to high octane gas then, haha
 
  #394  
Old 11-09-2011, 04:02 PM
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Originally Posted by llabmik2
You were just running Meth to cool the intake charge on you MINI right? Just asking because on E85 alone you can max your timing out way past MBT. Running Meth on top of e85 is pointless if you are doing it for power and not just cooling the charge down.

The reason that the EVO's STi's, turbo Hondas, or Turbo anything make a ton of power on E85 is they can up the boost a lot easier then a charged mini can. So they bring the boost up and then run the timing out the top at around 20+ degrees.

See the bottom of post #384. And yes I know, but this isn't an E85 thread.

You also dont necessarly need a new fuel pump, the factory pump does OK at keeping up. The 550's are pretty much at max running E-gas.
 
  #395  
Old 11-09-2011, 04:03 PM
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Originally Posted by daveke
Never mind, 350 on the crank is also available without E85
I'll stick to high octane gas then, haha
For 99% of people that's the way to go.
 
  #396  
Old 11-09-2011, 04:54 PM
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Originally Posted by DICKS GARAGE R53
Unless you are running E85 stay with either a 50/50 or 60/40 Meth on the high end. Also dont be afraid to try different alcohols I found that denatured alcohol has the best bang for the buck.

People will tell you 100% meth is best, theese are under informed people. Water has far greater cooling properties and heat absorbtion factors than alcohol can provide. The alcohol still serves a big purpose in anomization and resistance to freezing, so find a good mix that controlls the temp but dosent richen the AFR more than .2.

If you ever tune to run E85, you will find that you can run A LOT more water in your mix, and scale down your nozzle size. On E-gas I was running 10% denatured alcohol, 90% water. And as a kicker I would fill my 3 gallon tank with crushed ice then add my mix, only when I was going to be running the car HARD though.
Ummm, I beg your pardon? Water has better cooling properties than methanol? Please go and run data logs with 100% water and 100% meth, and go see which one cools your IATs more. Water is better at cooling your cylinders, but NOT your IATs.

You think people pay through the teeth to add meth to the mix just because it's a good anti freeze and aids atomisation?
 

Last edited by etalj; 11-09-2011 at 05:00 PM.
  #397  
Old 11-09-2011, 05:25 PM
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Originally Posted by DICKS GARAGE R53
See the bottom of post #384. And yes I know, but this isn't an E85 thread.

You also dont necessarly need a new fuel pump, the factory pump does OK at keeping up. The 550's are pretty much at max running E-gas.
I love how you say this isnt a E85 thread but you talk about it in here, and meth. The bottom of that post says nothing about if you are using it to make power or just to cool your charge.

You do need a pump, you do need injectors you HAVE TO HAVE 34% more flow...why does flexfuel use a different fuel pump then cars that are non flex? I dont care that you ran it on your car just fine. You need a bigger pump and injectors. Hell even use LB's method to get 350 or Jans method to get 400 on the stock pump. If you dont know what that is without asking anybody you really should not be self tuning or giving anybody else advice.

The moral of the story is you knock the bearings out of the bottom of the motor because you have no idea what you are doing and then you are trying to help people out giving out wrong information.

Did you tune the E85 on a dyno? If you didnt you failed there. You have to tune it on a dyno you have to tune by how much power it makes per degrees of timing aka MBT. If you ran it any richer then 11.8 at any time you fail there. It needs to be at 12.1 or leaner. Remember kids rich knock is the worse of all knock.

Post up your tune and ill tell you everything you did wrong. Post up your text logs and ill tell you everything you did wrong. Post up your AFRs on E85 and ill tell you what you did wrong. Post up your timing map and ill tell you where you went wrong. How much timing were you running out the top?

Now if we want to keep this on topic the sprintrex is still making less power then my M45 and im still running 115+ in the 1/4 with a stock intercooler and no meth. So lets talk about the flame thrower known as the sprintrex. If it was such a awesome supercharger why didnt you run that fast on it? I did this in Grand Junction so the elevation isnt that much different from Denver.
 
  #398  
Old 11-09-2011, 05:39 PM
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Taken off of one of the best information sites that I have found on the subject.

[SIZE=4]1. Maximum Torque occurs at a 13.2:1 Air Fuel Ratio.
2. Transitional Fueling and Maximum Boost Air Fuel Ratios are about 12.5:1.
3. Water Injection is most efficient with a 50/50 water alcohol (or methanol) mixture.
4. Methanol, as an additive, is not a practical choice as it is prone to pre-ignition in higher than 50/50 percentages, is not safe to handle, and is not readily available. It's a good choice, but not necessarily the most practical one when you need some in a hurry. Methanol is usually found where racing fuels are sold.
5. Denatured (ethanol) alcohol, typically 95% pure, is available in paint, hardware, and Home Depot type stores in gallon containers for about $10.00. Expensive but available everywhere. Isopropyl alcohol can be used but it is often 30% or more water by content.
6. Water Injection allows ignition timing to be more aggressive or closer to stock. In other words boost does not automatically mean retard your timing.
7. Excessive amounts of ignition retard will cause a loss of power and overheating.
8. Water to Fuel ratios should be based on weight and not volume.
9 . Water weighs 8.33 lb per gallon.
10. Alcohol weighs 6.63 lb per gallon.
11. Air weighs .080645 lb per cubic foot. It takes about 150 cubic feet of air per 100 horsepower. It takes about 12 lb of air per 100 horsepower.
12. Water or Water / Alcohol to Fuel Ratios are between 12.5% to 25%. This means Air to Fluid Ratios are between 11.1:1 and 10.0:1 with water injection.
13. Maximum water delivery should be in higher load low to mid rpm ranges tapering somewhat at peak rpms where load is less.
14. Atomization of the water mixture is directly related to it effectiveness. Finer droplets cool the inlet charge better and with less mass they navigate the inlet plenum easier for more equal water distribution.
15. Don’t flow water through an intercooler.
16. Atomized water, just like fuel , does not like to make turns thus making accurate distribution something to think about. This is why port fuel injection is the norm. Water is a fluid just like your fuel. Using two staged nozzles at high pressure is the best practical solution. Using individual port nozzles is a bit complicated for a large # of cylinders and makes control difficult.
17. The introduction of water will allow higher boost pressures to be run without detonation. Higher pressures will increase torque. It’s always about torque.
18. Racing high octane gasoline should be used for all forms of competition and for higher than normal boost levels. Water injection as well as charge cooling should be used with racing gas. 91/92 Octane pump gas simply will not cut it. Water spray cooling of the intercooler is a good idea.
19. Fuel Injectors operate in the 1 Millisecond range (.001 second) and are not capable of long term usage for H20 as they will corrode or rust shut in a very short period of time. Unless a solenoid can open as fast as a fuel injector it should not be used to "pulse" water injection events as flow is not directly related to "duty cycle".
20. Varying voltage to water injection pumps or using similar schemes is a recipe for disaster. You have to eliminate the variables, not increase them.
21. Fuel Injection pumps cannot be used for water injection. Water is conductive. Gasoline is not. Water will corrode an efi pump shut in a very short period of time.
22. Water injection has a cooling effect on the engine head, valves, and cylinder. Exhaust temperatures (EGT) are largely unaffected at recommended water / fuel ratios.
23. The cooling of potential hot spots in the combustion chamber defeats pre-ignition, the most destructive form of uncontrolled or unplanned combustion.
24. Higher static compression ratios will require a higher percentage of water or water / alcohol.
25. No, water does not burn. We are not combusting the hydrogen in the H2O.
26. At around 13.2:1 or fuel air ratios of .75, EGT’s will peak.
27. People will try to selectively edit their way to get you to use water injection by stating "One can basically double the power output of an engine using water/methanol" and "It was used effectively in Formula 1 before being banned for adding too much power". This is pure bunk. Water or water/alcohol/methanol does not make power...superchargers and turbochargers make power. The cooling effect of the water injection only allows you to run higher boost pressures and leaner mixtures without engine damage. The increased density or higher pressure ratio is what makes the power, not the water. The last time we checked water wasn't a very good fuel. Water Injection definitely does not give "a 5-15% increase in fuel economy" as some marketers clain.[/SIZE]
[SIZE=4]28. Ferrari suspended water in their fuel during their 1980’s Formula1 period. We don’t recommend that you try this...although Acetone will mix with water.
[/SIZE]
Sometimes you need to have the experiance of finding what works best for you and your application. Water has a higher mass, and higher heat absorbtion. It does absorb the heat in the intake air better than alcohol alone without messing up your AFR. Running anything over a 70% alcohol mix can throw your AFR off a substantial amount, to the point of needing to retune the fuel maps. I know this from experiance and exparimentation. If you want to run 100% alcohol, thats fine you can **** your money away, but it's not needed.
 
  #399  
Old 11-09-2011, 05:51 PM
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Originally Posted by llabmik2
I love how you say this isnt a E85 thread but you talk about it in here, and meth. The bottom of that post says nothing about if you are using it to make power or just to cool your charge.

You do need a pump, you do need injectors you HAVE TO HAVE 34% more flow...why does flexfuel use a different fuel pump then cars that are non flex? I dont care that you ran it on your car just fine. You need a bigger pump and injectors. Hell even use LB's method to get 350 or Jans method to get 400 on the stock pump. If you dont know what that is without asking anybody you really should not be self tuning or giving anybody else advice.

The moral of the story is you knock the bearings out of the bottom of the motor because you have no idea what you are doing and then you are trying to help people out giving out wrong information.

Did you tune the E85 on a dyno? If you didnt you failed there. You have to tune it on a dyno you have to tune by how much power it makes per degrees of timing aka MBT. If you ran it any richer then 11.8 at any time you fail there. It needs to be at 12.1 or leaner. Remember kids rich knock is the worse of all knock.

Post up your tune and ill tell you everything you did wrong. Post up your text logs and ill tell you everything you did wrong. Post up your AFRs on E85 and ill tell you what you did wrong. Post up your timing map and ill tell you where you went wrong. How much timing were you running out the top?

Now if we want to keep this on topic the sprintrex is still making less power then my M45 and im still running 115+ in the 1/4 with a stock intercooler and no meth. So lets talk about the flame thrower known as the sprintrex. If it was such a awesome supercharger why didnt you run that fast on it? I did this in Grand Junction so the elevation isnt that much different from Denver.
Thanks, sounds like good advice!

Without discussing the Sprintex or it's merits good or bad, this thread deserves a very big *READER BEWARE* on the tuning advice being given by some on this thread. So:

*READER BEWARE OF TUNING ADVICE ON THIS THREAD, IT MAY OR MAY NOT BE DETRIMENTAL TO THE HEALTH OF YOUR MOTOR.*

Just my 2 cents.
 
  #400  
Old 11-09-2011, 05:55 PM
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Yes I agree Minimarks it should have a warning.
 


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