Thumper did you swap out the map sensors to the JCW ones when you swapped that turbo in?

 

I have not yet...but I was going to pick up a set this week actually.

I was told it will cause a code though...I just need the proper mapping to bypass that.

 

Oh OK nice.

That should take care of the boost cut issue. When you said the ECM started to freak at 22 psi that's the first thing that came to mind.

 

I hope that would be the case but so far it seems there is something hardcoded into the ECU to make the S models go into limp mode when they hit 22psi. This problem has been around for awhile.

 

Mine doesn't go into limp mode, it just will dump all boost.

Just lift my foot real quick and floor it again and it will get right back up to full boost. I def want that extra 1.5 to 2 psi though!

 

Mine used to just dump boost from 22psi to 9psi without limp modes and cels.
However, now that I lowered the boost pressure overall to 19psi (22psi was way too much for the stock turbo to handle) I realize that when I lift off and floor it again really quickly, the boost pressure drops to 9psi as well!!!
This is not reproduced repeatedly but I could say that it has a 70% reoccurrence.
Could you please try this and let me know what you come out with?

Thanks.

 

Your issue sounds like a diverter valve issue.

Why are you lifting off and flooring it again quickly? I was referring to what I do currently when the boost cuts happen...

 

This problem seems to be popping up quite a bit as more R56's have started to lay down more power. We started doing some testing with Cobb because we had customers getting boost cuts at the track. Data logs were showing the cars hitting the load limiter and then cutting boost. On the street it is not usually an issue. It seems to most commonly happen when the engine is under a lot of load, like 3rd to 4rth gear shifts at 7000 rpm or very hard acceleration up hill and shifting.

Like you said it's pretty easy to get the car to boost up again, but it is very annoying when you are trying pass some one and the car falls on its face.

We are still waiting to hear back from Cobb since our last round of test, for now though I found easing into gears even at high RPM's will prevent this issue most of the time.

 

Diverter valve is not an issue cause it is brand new.

The car is used eventually as a safety car in rallying so when you are sideways you need instant power to correct your nose which is pointing in the wrong direction! But this is not the time or the place to explain my driving techniques...
I am very well aware of what you were referring to, because for a long period of time I myself was dealing with the boost cuts the same way.

It seems that when immediate movements of the throttle (all the way) are made, regardless of the 22psi boost cuts, the ECU reverts to it's stock settings and produces the stock boost pressure.
This is my conclusion and I would be very interested if anyone can second that as well.

Thanks.

 

this is definitely a map sensor issue right? has any one tried a boost cut defender? basically a zenir diode that blocks off the voltage from going above a certain level so it doesnt allow it to hit the dump.

Im not sure whats happening for certain, but It sounds as if the MAF is and tuned, the boost is being turned up, but the hard cut limiter that is supplied by the MAP is being left alone. or the boost cut limit is being turned up by the tuner. However the physical limits of the map sensor still hinder higher levels.

Again if this is the case it could be as easy as running a fuel/boost cut defender. Or you could just run a higher map sensor.

But dont how your brethe because The mini runs a crazy advanced check sum system that can make "playing" with a sensor a bit.... dificult....

any input from someone with some insight?

 

In most cases, that I have seen this issue on the R56, it's not actually hitting the boost limit of the map sensor but actually hitting the load limit set by the ECU.

If the car is tuned right you will not hit this limit in most cases with the car on the street. We ran into it at the track when drivers were pushing the car hard and going to or near redline. Fast shifts at this kind of RPM and load cause a drop and then spike in the load on the engine. Typically this will exceed the load parameters of the ECU and it will cut boost until load is let off the engine ( letting of the gas ).

I can get almost every R56 with an AP and an aggressive tune to do this
and from what I understand the dimsport guys are having the same issue too (That's not a slam on Jan BTW just an observation). Some automatics will run into this problem as well, but it's hard to duplicate and seems to not be as much an issue as the manuals.

Like I said earlier the easiest way to avoid this is to not shift fast. You can still go to redline and push the **** out of the car. Just have to let the RPM drop for a sec before letting off the clutch. Lame fix i know. Definitely not good for making fast times around the track, but it's the best thing I have found until some one gets the tuning right.

 

Alright, NOW I know what my acceleration/boost problem is! I'll just have to wait to see what you and Cobb come up with to modify my current Cobb AP tune. It's also abundantly clear that I need to stop driving like I'm at the track, because this happens to me too often on the highway.

 

I thought I would let you guys know my 09 JCW is set now where it hits 30 + psi in 6th between 3-4000 psi. I'm running forged pistons, rods, & meth injection. BTW I'm not from Orlando but I am on the quest for 300 whp. I just got a specially prepared turbo that should flow 34 lbs/min & it's twin scroll. Hopefully I'll install it in the next couple weeks.

Ray

 

Sorry everyone. I saw these posts were from 4/11. On my phone I thought is was 4/12

Ray

 

LOL yeah zombie thread.

It's all good though Ray. Hows the car doing? You have a chance to get on the dyno with that Alta turbo or did you move right into testing with your new one?

 

As per the OP, I have to add some info...

Evolve does remote tuning through their own obd Evolve-R cable via a laptop. You install the software to your laptop, read the ECU, email the file to Evolve, they do their magic and send you back the modified file, you then load this file to the ECU (2minutes max) and off you go...

Now, some interesting notes about their tunes...

For those who own an S, the tune is boost-cut free. There is no dump in boost pressure whatever you do (fast gear changes, boosting over 22psi etc.)

AFR, and EGTs are great and smooth.

No knocking, no misfires. The engine runs like a charm.

And a little info about my car as a proof for my writings.
I own a 2007 MCS with modified JCW turbo and manifold, Akrapovic DP, Evolve FMIC, 2,5' catback with JCW kit back box etc and Evolve tune of course...
Currently I run their tune and boosting well over 22psi...(27,5psi in some extreme cases, when doing some hill climb rallying the other day)
So, from my personal experience, the Evolve tuning service should be a top priority for everyone that needs a problem-free tune...

If anyone wants more info/proof/details feel free to check my project thread at: http://www.minitorque.com/forum/f272...nls-r56-25947/

 

The only real feasible way to do this on our cars with out affecting power is to eliminate the safety protocalls meant to be present. I can make an AP map do this too by having it ignore the boost and load limits. With correct AFR it should run ok, but the margarine for error is much smaller and the risk of damaging the engine is much greater. What some may get away with may not always be true for others. Those limiters are there for a very good reason. They protect the engine from the tuners inability to write a map to cover every variable. Sure they hinder the ability to make power, but they also help save the engine from being destroyed. Please don't take this as a bash on Evolve or some sort of vendor rivalry. In general I think they do good work, just saying certain things are the way they are for a very good reason.

 

Old thread but since it’s been brought up, the problem has been fixed. It’s unfortunate I couldn’t get Jan to fix something so simple for me but I managed to have that part of the computer to not look for the cat code.

Now I can run either the AP or RMW tune.


Mark

 

If it is possible with the AP, then why didn't you release a fix for boost cuts when so many customers of the AP have been experiencing them?

You say that these limits protect the engine from the tuners inability to write a proper map... Why does anyone call himshelf a tuner if he can't produce a proper functional map?

Evolve is a very reputable European tuner and provide quality services to customers all over the world. I have been searching for a proper tune the last five years and they are the only one who are capable to offer a very well structured map without the worldwide known issues other tuners have. I don't "think in general" that they do good work...I know by first hand that their products mean serious business.

If the malfuctional maps all over the world with boost cuts are there for a very good reason, I personally being so sick and tired of these defects, don't want to be a part of this tuning philosophy... I prefer to move on and feel the joy this wonderful Evolve map has offered me which is what all the Mini community should have had from the beggining.

I have been an active member of this community for half a decade now and this is my personal experience. I have all the data to back up my writings should anyone wants proof. For me, Evolve is a very good option for those that are ready to move on...

Honestly.
Themis P.

 

Just out of curiosity, has Evolve tuned anyone’s car from the US that has to pass inspections? I ask because a few “over the pond” tuners told me that they couldn’t meet the protocol’s needed to ensure emission control compatibility that we have in the US.... thus the reason our choices are limited.


Mark

 

Did you even read his post?

 

No problem with inspections and emission control all over the world. (Europe, Japan, South Africa etc.)
I doubt US inspections and controls will be a problem. Plus the fact that Evolve is officially in the US market.
So they should meet the protocols to start with.

I am just saying that they are honest, have top quality service and offer premium products. It is up to you to find out for yourself what's what...

 

I really was not trying to put down you, your choice of tune or the tuner them selves. I was totally sincere the first time I said I have nothing against their work. Please don't take what I'm saying as anything more then friendly advice meant to educate you or other readers.

No one on the planet can hand you map that will make your engine fail proof. There is always a risk to increasing power through tuning. This is why boost and load limiters exist. They help limit the chance of failure. With out them or setting them to high the chance an engine will fail greatly increases and teeters on the edge of not if it will fail but when. I was not saying Alta or any other tuner could not remove or alter these functions, but rather they choose not to for good reason. One should really only call them selves a tuner if they can recognize and act on the fact that the customers need for power should come second to protecting that customer from destroying their engine.

Alta has this responsibility to its customers to first and for most provided a safe map. The standard maps available on the AP are meant to be loaded and run with out any assistance from Alta or a tuner. To make this possible canned tunes or Etunes are slightly conservative and left with all the safety protocols in tact. For most of their customers this provides a welcomed increase in power that is trouble free. For those that want more, Access Flash MINI was created so localized tuners can do a safer job of pushing the engine's power further or tailor the tune to mods or driving conditions the majority of users are not worried about.

Now in terms of what constitutes the majority of users, you will not find people with the need to go over 23 PSI or load the engine enough to worry about exceeding the target load. For the most part any problems for the majority of users have been eliminated through software updates that still keep the factory boost and load safety protocalls.

For those with modded turbo's or cars that see the track frequently, despite what the forums may reflects, this is a small percentage and not the common user. For those people direct assistance from Alta or a tuner should be sought as intended by the creation of Access Flash MINI. This is the safest way to provide power to cars with these sort of mods or driving conditions.

It's with one on one assistance only that hard boost limits or load limits should be altered and not from a general canned tune. This is why it's not a "fix" for a product like this nor should it ever be.

 

i love my accesport so much! i do agree i wish it was a tad bit more aggressive but it turned the car into a completely different monster, i just wish their were more options for more aggressive custom maps for my AP, but i still love it never the less, best bang for your buck

 

I love my RMW tune, I run 19psi and have hit 21.5 with overboost, I never boost cut and almost never drive in sport mode because I don't need to. I just got tuned for my Meth injection kit and the car feels even better. I even got 35mpg driving home from the Dragon.