Another good point. Just FYI I have the Dimsport ECU installed/tuned by RMW, it was done back in October 08 (2 months prior to the failure ocurred).

 

I would see the head... the valve dont break.. they bend!! if the plug electrode came off.. it could "Bend" the valve.. if the valve hits something , like a piston, more than likely it will bend more!! If the valve BROKE.. you WILL need a piston and possible a cylinder.. I suggest you SEE the head for your self!! Just a thought..

MadMick being a German, I thought he answered the "sodium filled valve " quite well!! You go MadMick

Just me..........................

Thumper

 

[quote=Thumper460;2630262]I would see the head... the valve dont break.. they bend!! if the plug electrode came off.. it could "Bend" the valve.. if the valve hits something , like a piston, more than likely it will bend more!! If the valve BROKE.. you WILL need a piston and possible a cylinder.. I suggest you SEE the head for your self!! Just a thought..

Thumper,
You are right...there is nothing like seeing things with our own eyes...I will go buy the shop on Monday to do my own visual inspection and I will take some photos and post them to get all of your thoughts.

I am also sending PM to get a quote on working on this head.

 

If the valves were bent, then at the very least the rod bearings on the affected pistons are bad and maybe even the adjacent main bearings. If this is under warranty, they need to rebuild your entire engine.

 

OK so now besides the cylinder walls and pistons I need to worry about the rod bearinds and main bearings as well .

Can any body tell me pls what steps to take during my visit/inspection to the shop on Monday??. I'm very surprised that their mechanic has only reported issues with the valves and the head instead of the whole thing. This is supposed to be a certified "mini" mechanic .

 

1st.. look at the head!! visual is a major key!!
2nd.. look at the tops of the pistons for dings and dents.

3rd.. have the shop EXPLAIN their decision.
4th ..AFTER those visual inspections.. call the dealer and ask ( in a generic way) what the warranty is on your year and mileage!! SAY nothing about your pulley ect.. Then casually mention what if there is a pulley on the car, what warranty WILL that void?? dont come out and give all the info in one shot.. Dealers are afraid of being set up by the mfg... cool??

Pm back at you..

Just me.........................

Thumper

 

Thanks Thumper. I got your PM and looking into it.
I will post some pictures o Monday.

 

+1 on everything except the pulley conversation. With the pulley installed , the dealer or mfg can claim that it was causing the a lean mixture that burnt and broke the plugs that bent the valves that dented the pistons and flattenned the bearings etc. If you weren't running the .380 injectors, that would be a valid argument, but since you are....

 

Guys,
Here are the results of my visual inspection:

1 broken valve in cyl. # 4, the other valve seems to be bent.
Also, the valves for cyl. 1 seem to be bent as well.

The cylinder walls do not have visual damage (no cracks, seams, tears, or others).
Pistons have no visual damage either.

Mechanic indicated that a compression and leak down test will be performed after the head would be installed to confirmed there is no problems with either the head, block or components.

See attached photos.

 

See more photos below showing SP's broken ceramic tip, cylinder walls and piston heads.[

ATTACH]39637[/ATTACH]

 

I'm no expert but those pics of the valve kinda look like it might have been melted. Had something similar happen to a mustang of mine a few years back, the spark plug failed and was arcing across to the valve which caused the valve to melt. Again I'm no expert, but I'm just throwing it out there as a possiblity.

 

MELTED!! Man that isnt broken... that is MELTED!!! No spark plug electrode did that.. the heat was so high in that chamber that you "Burned the valve"!! Need to find out WHY that happened.. as that is the result of something else!! too lean?? Too much boost?? I would suggest that if the rings are still good, a water meth system will help . Make sure the shop keeps those rings with oil in the cylinders!! cool??

Just me........................

Thumper

WAIT!! No 4?? that cylinder has an issue with the intake manifold starving the chamber for fuel!! Number 4 is the most often of all the head/cylinder issues!!
Tpr

PPS... looking at the pics of your engine... get some oil on it!! In the cylinders or you WILL need a set of rings and rebuild after all that rust!!!!!

 

Thumper: Number 4 is typically a problem???

 

Yea, looks like a melted valve, but pics are somewhat unclear.
Could be the tune, could be a bad injector.
Have that injector checked now. Make sure you have someone who knows what they are doing to check it as you just don't want someone to assume that its bad.

This is one reason that those who are getting these 'on the edge' tunes need to have the right equipment in their cars to read what's going on. Either a good data acquisition system or a wide band O2 and without a doubt, an EGT sensor with gages of course.

 

That's #1 cylinder that's burned I believe. And yes, #4 is usually the problem

Not sure he wil need rings and rebuild. Not so much rust.

Edit, ... well maybe there is too much rust. Whats up with the mechanic here??

 

sorry, I was mistaken. That was #4 that was missing it's valves.
Now, after I looked very close at the head I could now see that bothe #1 and #4 were way lean.All of this and I never read cucho's mechanic report until now.
Bad tune man! That's really what it looks like. Post # 26 and #35..... what can you say. Someone fried your head.

 

Ouch... sorry to see this...

 

Yeah, you are right...it was melted. And yes, I am disappointed that the mechanic has let the block rust like that .
Things to do:
- Have the mechanic remove that rust and put some oil on the block
- Inspect injectors from cyl 1 and 4 to see if they are faulty..running lean, if they are ok, then the root cause of this issue has been something else.
Thanks for the input

 

Spoke to the mechanic today...he was not very keen to accepting any evidence relating to injector problems, whitish appearance of components, etc.
He is sticking to his initial plan to install the new head and then running the compression and leak down tests .

When I asked him if he could check the injectors he said that there is no specific way of testing them...sounds like BS...just await for the compression test, and if something wrong then he will trouble shoot???.
What is the proper way to check injectors (to make sure they are skirting fuel properly)?.

 

Put in your stock injectors and send your JCW injectors away for testing and servicing. I think Dr. Obnoxs has a link to a shop that can help you out. PM him.

Jeremy

 

I've read as this thread front to back and from what I can tell the shop is going to re build the motor but have no clue as to why it happened in the first place? Have they given you any of there thoughts as to the root cause of the failure or are they just going to supply new parts and take the time to replace everything and just cross their fingers that it doesn't happen again . Usually in a situation like this a mechanic would say something like " we found XYZ bad and have replaced it so you won't have this problem again . " I am not seeing that in this case. They are the ones risking the loss financially if it does happen again and you will be without the services of your car once more . I wish you the best on this as I am sure it is frustrating at the very least. Many have given you sound advice so far and continue to use this resource as you go through the process. Best of luck.

Randy
M7 Tuning

 

cucho,

I can't help but feel even worse for you. Your getting screwed from all ends here. I don't know what to tell you to do. I mean the best thing you can do is get another mechanic, but with your parts sitting all over this guys shop, it's kinda hard. I'm sorry, but did you say this was a dealer or an independent guy? Licensed?
I think there are quite a few here that know what should really happen, but it's not our place.
This is a complete disgrace, from all points, a disgrace.

What's unfortunate is I might bet that you are not such a rare case here. If you had not been curious about the JCW head and posted here then you might have just let this guy bolt your car back together for it to all happen all over again.

Sorry bud.. :(

 

I used Witch Hunter (www.witchhunter.com) in the Portland area (I think) cause of turn around time. A year or so ago it was $60. They test spray patterns and flow rates, change the screen and all seals, ultrasonically clean the pintles (little needles in the valves) and retest pattern and flow rates.

Seeing that your engine is all apart, I'd take the injectors away, and get the testing/cleaning done.

Matt

 

I know you would prefer to have the work covered by your extended warranty, but you may have to do this on your own dime. My first recommendation would be injector reconditioning here http://www.fuelinjection.com/, if the injectors are serviceable they will be returned to as new condition, and you will get a detailed performance evaluation for before and after. I’ve used them for this and other services; they are not an average shop. Or, you could look in the yellow pages for a service provider in your area, I Googled and found a few places in the Houston area, but try for a local reference to begin with.

 

Actually.. you burned a valve!! #4 has issues with running a bit leaner than the rest of the cylinders. I have been told by some killer sources in the UK that it is in the design of the intake manifold.. ( engine builders and racers..NOT the mfg) I feel that you just happend to be unlucky!! I also feel that if they don't correct the rust in your cylinder bores... a ring replacement will be needed!!

Seems like a lot of extra labor to install the head and then feel that an overhaul is needed!! IF there is a doubt... then OH the engine!! It will cost you LESS than if they put it together and then have to do it!! Get their price for the parts and labor and then check the dealership for a long block!!

Also most shops do NOT have anyway to rest an injector!! ( other than making it spray!!)

Also I suggest that you look into a water meth system.. Snow/ Devils Own ect..! Burn valves happen!!

Just me...........................

Thumper