Drivetrain JCW test drive impressions
Thread Starter
|
1st Gear
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 39
Likes: 0
From: SC
Hi,
I went and drove the dealers JCW equipped S yesterday, and I thought I'd post some impressions.
When the dealer drove me off the lot, he did a drag race style acceleration run and the car felt absolutely incredible! Much faster than My S has ever felt. Then, when I got behind the wheel, my impressions were much more subdued. The car seemed marginally more powerful based on my driving style - shifting around 5K RPM. I dipped into the throttle a few times and got up towards readline - then it seemed to be more noticibly powerful. Off idle (like when starting at an intersection), I didn't really think it was any different than a stock S.
The kit is very well integrated - we went on a fairly thorough drive and it was very well mannered. Exhaust didn't seem any louder than stock, but we had the windows open most of the drive so I didn't get a good impression of "boominess".
Overall, I wish the stock S was the JCW and the JCW something more. BTW, the test car was heavy - with sunroof, R90 wheels and every option I knew of. On to price - my dealer was quoting $5600 installed. The price of the test car was $34k!!!!
The only noticible differences to stock are the badges and the exhaust tips.
I can't decide if it's worth it - I'm leaning towards buying a bunch of parts and messing with the car myself to experience the fun of modifiying.
Hope this helps someone!
I went and drove the dealers JCW equipped S yesterday, and I thought I'd post some impressions.
When the dealer drove me off the lot, he did a drag race style acceleration run and the car felt absolutely incredible! Much faster than My S has ever felt. Then, when I got behind the wheel, my impressions were much more subdued. The car seemed marginally more powerful based on my driving style - shifting around 5K RPM. I dipped into the throttle a few times and got up towards readline - then it seemed to be more noticibly powerful. Off idle (like when starting at an intersection), I didn't really think it was any different than a stock S.
The kit is very well integrated - we went on a fairly thorough drive and it was very well mannered. Exhaust didn't seem any louder than stock, but we had the windows open most of the drive so I didn't get a good impression of "boominess".
Overall, I wish the stock S was the JCW and the JCW something more. BTW, the test car was heavy - with sunroof, R90 wheels and every option I knew of. On to price - my dealer was quoting $5600 installed. The price of the test car was $34k!!!!
The only noticible differences to stock are the badges and the exhaust tips.
I can't decide if it's worth it - I'm leaning towards buying a bunch of parts and messing with the car myself to experience the fun of modifiying.
Hope this helps someone!
6th Gear
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 3,359
Likes: 1
From: New Jersey
Yeah me too. 
I have the pulley from Helix and madness intake from Randy. I love it but this is how it should have came stock, IMO. I'm going to be getting an exhaust and chip next, that'll be better than the JCW and how the JCW should be.
I have the pulley from Helix and madness intake from Randy. I love it but this is how it should have came stock, IMO. I'm going to be getting an exhaust and chip next, that'll be better than the JCW and how the JCW should be.
6th Gear
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 4,831
Likes: 1
From: Phoenix, AZ
During my lunch hour, I'm headed over there to check one out. I did this last Thursday and one of the exec's had the JCW out for the day, so the salespeople couldn't give test drives in it. They only have the one car for test drives.
2nd Gear
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 137
Likes: 0
From: Lexington Park, MD
That's ridiculous!
For that price (maybe a little more) you could get an Evo VII or maybe even the new STi coming out.
I like my Cooper S a lot. It performs VERY well. But, I couldn't justify paying that much for a JCW equipped car. The Cooper S is painfully outclassed horsepower wise, but at least it makes up for it with its handling.
my 2 cents...
For that price (maybe a little more) you could get an Evo VII or maybe even the new STi coming out.
I like my Cooper S a lot. It performs VERY well. But, I couldn't justify paying that much for a JCW equipped car. The Cooper S is painfully outclassed horsepower wise, but at least it makes up for it with its handling.
my 2 cents...
6th Gear
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 4,831
Likes: 1
From: Phoenix, AZ
Trending Topics
6th Gear
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 4,831
Likes: 1
From: Phoenix, AZ
OK, got back from my appt. Whew! I think I'd get into toooo much trouble with that much HP. There's a HUGE difference between the JCW 200 HP and my MCS's measly 163HP. I couldn't believe how much better it felt. Pully Intake and Exhaust mods HERE I COME!
1st Gear
Joined: Mar 2003
Posts: 12
Likes: 0
From: Zurich / Switzerland
Yesterday evening I had the chance to test the JCW 'S' and we compared it with my stock MCS. We made various acceleration races.
In lower RPM ranges.. 2K - 4K there is much more power in the JCW 'S'. We both startet in the 2nd gear at 2K RPM and the JCW 'S' was really much faster than my MCS! BUT.. when we both startet in the 2nd gear at 4K RPM the JCW 'S' was not faster than my stock MCS!!! If I want to drive my MCS fast, I drive it anyway far above 4K! So the JCW kit would be almost useless for me.
We drove various small curving streets and he was not faster than I was! But we couldn't test it at high speed levels.. so maybe the big advantage is at top speed level.. but is this really important for a Mini??
Acceleration in the 1st gear at 4K RPM up to the 3rd gear -> the JCW 'S' was only half a car length ahead!
We both had the impression that the JCW 'S' is more a MCS for somebody who like a bit more power in the lower RPM ranges what results in more fun in everyday use. But for the Mini enthusiast who will more power at top RPM levels to be as fast as possible and to burn every competitor on the courses.. it's a waist of money!
So I totally agree with Dave.. the stock MCS should perform like the JCW does..
In lower RPM ranges.. 2K - 4K there is much more power in the JCW 'S'. We both startet in the 2nd gear at 2K RPM and the JCW 'S' was really much faster than my MCS! BUT.. when we both startet in the 2nd gear at 4K RPM the JCW 'S' was not faster than my stock MCS!!! If I want to drive my MCS fast, I drive it anyway far above 4K! So the JCW kit would be almost useless for me.
We drove various small curving streets and he was not faster than I was! But we couldn't test it at high speed levels.. so maybe the big advantage is at top speed level.. but is this really important for a Mini??
Acceleration in the 1st gear at 4K RPM up to the 3rd gear -> the JCW 'S' was only half a car length ahead!
We both had the impression that the JCW 'S' is more a MCS for somebody who like a bit more power in the lower RPM ranges what results in more fun in everyday use. But for the Mini enthusiast who will more power at top RPM levels to be as fast as possible and to burn every competitor on the courses.. it's a waist of money!
So I totally agree with Dave.. the stock MCS should perform like the JCW does..
6th Gear
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 1,656
Likes: 0
From: Cooper City, Fl
IMHO it is not worth it at all. I have the Alta pulley, BMP Intake Evotech ECU and a Borla exhaust. Mine is just as fast if not a bit faster then the JCW and I spent half of what the JCW costs. The only two items I really liked about the JCW was the exhaust tips are engraved and the cool emblems. Otherwise JCW can keep his over priced upgrade. $34K for a MINI is outrageous. I love my car but I would never spend that much for a MINI. Sorry.... 
4th Gear
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 529
Likes: 0
From: Sarasota, FL
>>IMHO it is not worth it at all. I have the Alta pulley, BMP Intake Evotech ECU and a Borla exhaust. Mine is just as fast if not a bit faster then the JCW and I spent half of what the JCW costs. The only two items I really liked about the JCW was the exhaust tips are engraved and the cool emblems. Otherwise JCW can keep his over priced upgrade. $34K for a MINI is outrageous. I love my car but I would never spend that much for a MINI. Sorry....
I think alot of people tend to forget the head modification that the JCW has. It seems to me that while alot of people on here rightfully feel good about the effect of their mods that they have taken the shortcut routes to power, but a bigger this and a smaller that on and bang-zoom you're going faster. The JCW seems to make signficicant improvement to the engine and supercharger itself. I don't know if it's wise to so cavalierly discount those upgrades.
After lots of debate, I am going with the pulley and ecu for now over the JCW. From the dealer, I'll save around $3,500. I have no doubt that throw in an intake for $250 and I'll be just as fast as a JCW (like that matters in the big picture) but they will always have a better engine.
I think alot of people tend to forget the head modification that the JCW has. It seems to me that while alot of people on here rightfully feel good about the effect of their mods that they have taken the shortcut routes to power, but a bigger this and a smaller that on and bang-zoom you're going faster. The JCW seems to make signficicant improvement to the engine and supercharger itself. I don't know if it's wise to so cavalierly discount those upgrades.
After lots of debate, I am going with the pulley and ecu for now over the JCW. From the dealer, I'll save around $3,500. I have no doubt that throw in an intake for $250 and I'll be just as fast as a JCW (like that matters in the big picture) but they will always have a better engine.
2nd Gear
Joined: Dec 2002
Posts: 76
Likes: 0
From: Lake Village, IN
There is only one thing unique about the JCW option. Very much like the
67' thru 69' Z28, few people bought the upgrade for the dual quad setup.
It was cheaper to go to the after market. The same with the COPO Camaro's
or the first L-88 Corvettes.
To have one of those today!
If you were planning to keep your MCS flor a long time, in the future,
this upgrade will be very unique to have on a MCS. I'm planning on
getting the upgrade soon, and I hope they don''t sell more than a
dozen units in the USA.
Just food for thought.
67' thru 69' Z28, few people bought the upgrade for the dual quad setup.
It was cheaper to go to the after market. The same with the COPO Camaro's
or the first L-88 Corvettes.
To have one of those today!
If you were planning to keep your MCS flor a long time, in the future,
this upgrade will be very unique to have on a MCS. I'm planning on
getting the upgrade soon, and I hope they don''t sell more than a
dozen units in the USA.
Just food for thought.
4th Gear
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 529
Likes: 0
From: Sarasota, FL
>>There is only one thing unique about the JCW option. Very much like the
>>67' thru 69' Z28, few people bought the upgrade for the dual quad setup.
>>It was cheaper to go to the after market. The same with the COPO Camaro's
>>or the first L-88 Corvettes.
>>
>>To have one of those today!
>>
>>If you were planning to keep your MCS flor a long time, in the future,
>>this upgrade will be very unique to have on a MCS. I'm planning on
>>getting the upgrade soon, and I hope they don''t sell more than a
>>dozen units in the USA.
>>
>>Just food for thought.
I think the flip side to the JCW becoming a collector's choice is the effect that the mods might have on your overall resale value. Certainly there might be a market for people who want a modified Mini but in the general marketplace I would suspect that the value goes down along with the suspicion that the car had been abused.
>>67' thru 69' Z28, few people bought the upgrade for the dual quad setup.
>>It was cheaper to go to the after market. The same with the COPO Camaro's
>>or the first L-88 Corvettes.
>>
>>To have one of those today!
>>
>>If you were planning to keep your MCS flor a long time, in the future,
>>this upgrade will be very unique to have on a MCS. I'm planning on
>>getting the upgrade soon, and I hope they don''t sell more than a
>>dozen units in the USA.
>>
>>Just food for thought.
I think the flip side to the JCW becoming a collector's choice is the effect that the mods might have on your overall resale value. Certainly there might be a market for people who want a modified Mini but in the general marketplace I would suspect that the value goes down along with the suspicion that the car had been abused.
4th Gear
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 444
Likes: 0
I understand the production run for the JCW is currently 1,500 units only. I have reservation number three at the Hartford Dealership who has completed one JCW install to date.
As far as why one should purchase the JCW versus the aftermarket options, its different for everyone and not one solution fits all. There are convincing pro's and con's for both scenarios.
I recently sold a very rare 1956 Austin Healey 100m. My 100m was the oldest registered 100m in the world. Only 642 were ever made at the factory in England, I had number 3 and the car was in decent drivable condition, not a show car by any means.
Now there are many, many more 1956 100m's on the road today because there are actually three different types of 100m's.
1. The most rare and valuable 100m is the one converted at the factory in England, 2. The second most desireble 100m are those that were converted at the dealership.
3. The third and least valuable are the ones that were converted through the aftermarket.
Now don't get me wrong, just because the least valuable one's converted by an aftermarket dealer do not necessarily mean the conversion or what was done was of poor quality, this is not a quality issue. Its a collector value issue and if you have never been financially involved in this part of the automotive world you wouldn't understand any of this anyway.
If you plan on keeping your Mini for a long time and see some potential in a JCW collecotr value, the history in the 'automotive collecotr market' will prove this to be the correct way to go, correct if you are doing it for future collecotr value and that's all. If you don't care about the future collectable value than by all means spending the money on the JCW is a waist. Purchase your upgrades from one of the fine purvayors on the MCO site and you will do just fine.
That said, I found my 100m froma farmer in Iowa (yup, sometimes those stories are true). I bought the car in 1996 for a very fair, lower than market value. The owner didn't care about the car's significant lineage. I kept the car for five years and spent only an extra $1,000 on maintenance and repairs in the five years I owned the car. In year number six I sold the car for twice what I paid for it. I had a wonderful piece of automotive history for six years and made almost 100% on the sale, you can't beat that with a stick!
Sorry for the long post but I felt my experience speaks for itself. The most important factor is that you don't spend more than you can afford and the amount you spend returns a 1000% of driving fun and only you can determine what that means to you. Drive it like you stole it!
As far as why one should purchase the JCW versus the aftermarket options, its different for everyone and not one solution fits all. There are convincing pro's and con's for both scenarios.
I recently sold a very rare 1956 Austin Healey 100m. My 100m was the oldest registered 100m in the world. Only 642 were ever made at the factory in England, I had number 3 and the car was in decent drivable condition, not a show car by any means.
Now there are many, many more 1956 100m's on the road today because there are actually three different types of 100m's.
1. The most rare and valuable 100m is the one converted at the factory in England, 2. The second most desireble 100m are those that were converted at the dealership.
3. The third and least valuable are the ones that were converted through the aftermarket.
Now don't get me wrong, just because the least valuable one's converted by an aftermarket dealer do not necessarily mean the conversion or what was done was of poor quality, this is not a quality issue. Its a collector value issue and if you have never been financially involved in this part of the automotive world you wouldn't understand any of this anyway.
If you plan on keeping your Mini for a long time and see some potential in a JCW collecotr value, the history in the 'automotive collecotr market' will prove this to be the correct way to go, correct if you are doing it for future collecotr value and that's all. If you don't care about the future collectable value than by all means spending the money on the JCW is a waist. Purchase your upgrades from one of the fine purvayors on the MCO site and you will do just fine.
That said, I found my 100m froma farmer in Iowa (yup, sometimes those stories are true). I bought the car in 1996 for a very fair, lower than market value. The owner didn't care about the car's significant lineage. I kept the car for five years and spent only an extra $1,000 on maintenance and repairs in the five years I owned the car. In year number six I sold the car for twice what I paid for it. I had a wonderful piece of automotive history for six years and made almost 100% on the sale, you can't beat that with a stick!
Sorry for the long post but I felt my experience speaks for itself. The most important factor is that you don't spend more than you can afford and the amount you spend returns a 1000% of driving fun and only you can determine what that means to you. Drive it like you stole it!
Banned
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 7,756
Likes: 0
I test drove a JCW S last week. Very nice but was not super impressed. Other than for future collectible value, as stated by Hank, I am not sure if the JCW package is worth $4.5K plus labor. At least it is good to know that it can be installed at any given point in time if MINI decides to reduce the price and make it more competitive.
4th Gear
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 530
Likes: 0
>>There is only one thing unique about the JCW option. Very much like the
>>67' thru 69' Z28, few people bought the upgrade for the dual quad setup.
>>It was cheaper to go to the after market. The same with the COPO Camaro's
>>or the first L-88 Corvettes.
>>
>>To have one of those today!
>>
>>If you were planning to keep your MCS flor a long time, in the future,
>>this upgrade will be very unique to have on a MCS. I'm planning on
>>getting the upgrade soon, and I hope they don''t sell more than a
>>dozen units in the USA.
>>
>>Just food for thought.
I agree with you!!!!!........the resale value of a mcs with the kit will be much higher,years from now,than those with aftermarket upgrades.If you read all the reviews of the "WORKS KIT",in the car mags,every person that tested the kit was very impressed by it....(100 people can't be wrong,all at same time....!)
>>67' thru 69' Z28, few people bought the upgrade for the dual quad setup.
>>It was cheaper to go to the after market. The same with the COPO Camaro's
>>or the first L-88 Corvettes.
>>
>>To have one of those today!
>>
>>If you were planning to keep your MCS flor a long time, in the future,
>>this upgrade will be very unique to have on a MCS. I'm planning on
>>getting the upgrade soon, and I hope they don''t sell more than a
>>dozen units in the USA.
>>
>>Just food for thought.
I agree with you!!!!!........the resale value of a mcs with the kit will be much higher,years from now,than those with aftermarket upgrades.If you read all the reviews of the "WORKS KIT",in the car mags,every person that tested the kit was very impressed by it....(100 people can't be wrong,all at same time....!)
2nd Gear
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 112
Likes: 0
From: Chula Vista, California
Hey Hank,
Cool signature, is that a still from a Star Wars clip?? My dealer mechanic told me after driving my car that it had more "lower-end" pull than their "Works" car and his personal opinion was that the kit was "over-priced". I love my Mini to death but have never considered it an investment, I have a classic Vette that sits in the garage (entirely too much) for that ballgame, as you said...Drive it like you stole it!
My two cents nobody asked for.
Kevin
Cool signature, is that a still from a Star Wars clip?? My dealer mechanic told me after driving my car that it had more "lower-end" pull than their "Works" car and his personal opinion was that the kit was "over-priced". I love my Mini to death but have never considered it an investment, I have a classic Vette that sits in the garage (entirely too much) for that ballgame, as you said...Drive it like you stole it!
My two cents nobody asked for.
Kevin
4th Gear
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 529
Likes: 0
From: Sarasota, FL
>>I test drove a JCW S last week. Very nice but was not super impressed. Other than for future collectible value, as stated by Hank, I am not sure if the JCW package is worth $4.5K plus labor. At least it is good to know that it can be installed at any given point in time if MINI decides to reduce the price and make it more competitive.
That's a good point. I've been debating between getting the pulley and ecu mod with the car or just getting the JCW outright. However, I think I want to get a feel for exactly how "underpowered" this car really is. Not being able to drive it day in and day out and reading for the past 6 months about how tuners are convinced that the car is so shortchanged has to some degree warped my perspective and I want to get a chance to make my own evaluation.
That said, I am increasingly convinced that the best way to mod if you can afford it is to spend the extra money and get the JCW. No one is offering the modified head that I have seen and there remains the mystery of the upgraded supercharger components. I continuously wonder if there wasn't a very good reason for why Cooper made those changes that could translate into long term problems for hi-perf Minis without them.
That's a good point. I've been debating between getting the pulley and ecu mod with the car or just getting the JCW outright. However, I think I want to get a feel for exactly how "underpowered" this car really is. Not being able to drive it day in and day out and reading for the past 6 months about how tuners are convinced that the car is so shortchanged has to some degree warped my perspective and I want to get a chance to make my own evaluation.
That said, I am increasingly convinced that the best way to mod if you can afford it is to spend the extra money and get the JCW. No one is offering the modified head that I have seen and there remains the mystery of the upgraded supercharger components. I continuously wonder if there wasn't a very good reason for why Cooper made those changes that could translate into long term problems for hi-perf Minis without them.
4th Gear
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 434
Likes: 0
The car seemed marginally more powerful based on my driving style - shifting around 5K RPM. I dipped into the throttle a few times and got up towards readline - then it seemed to be more noticibly powerful. Off idle (like when starting at an intersection), I didn't really think it was any different than a stock S.
yep...agree 100%...finally drove it and no big deal, no difference from a standing start than my S, but I have light 16" alloys and yokos which have improved my low end over the dreadful 17" superlights and goodyear runflats....there is modest performance gains IMO at 4 to 7K, but at $34K...bimmer is taking drugs from the 60's...lol ! I have had a modified MC beat my S over a 2 block run, not till I get to the upper end do I pull away and not by as much as would have thought....220hp and torque over 200 + ft lbs seems to me where the MCS should be based on all the latest engine upgrades from other 4 bangers....mini started the engine design back when many other 4 bangers were under 150 hp, by the time they finally got to market, they were a couple years behind unfortunately and late to the party in terms of what performance drivers now want and it appears the supercharger was an after thought to get the S to market, especially in the US...that's why the stumble seems only to be related to the S and not the MC....but that said, no other car handles like the minis, except the original minis, laugh !
yep...agree 100%...finally drove it and no big deal, no difference from a standing start than my S, but I have light 16" alloys and yokos which have improved my low end over the dreadful 17" superlights and goodyear runflats....there is modest performance gains IMO at 4 to 7K, but at $34K...bimmer is taking drugs from the 60's...lol ! I have had a modified MC beat my S over a 2 block run, not till I get to the upper end do I pull away and not by as much as would have thought....220hp and torque over 200 + ft lbs seems to me where the MCS should be based on all the latest engine upgrades from other 4 bangers....mini started the engine design back when many other 4 bangers were under 150 hp, by the time they finally got to market, they were a couple years behind unfortunately and late to the party in terms of what performance drivers now want and it appears the supercharger was an after thought to get the S to market, especially in the US...that's why the stumble seems only to be related to the S and not the MC....but that said, no other car handles like the minis, except the original minis, laugh !
4th Gear
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 529
Likes: 0
From: Sarasota, FL
I don't understand this kind of thinking. If you want a 68 Hemi, then buy a 68 Hemi. If you want some riced out, window rattling car that has bears no relation to the factory version then buy a Honda and get the megaphone exhaust and alteezas and cheesy bodywork and do it right. The notion that a Mini Cooper S that stock does 60 in the mid 7's and the Works which does it in the mid 6's (R&T measured the stock at 7.7 and the Works at 6.7) is a shortcoming is laughable. So it's not as fast as the fastest cars other manufacturers are making. Does that make your car less desirable?
If you're driving a Works package and you don't notice any difference over the stock either the mechanics did a miserable job or more likely you entered the evaluation so biased against the Works that there was no possibility of it ever getting a fair shake. There is a massive difference between the two versions. Everyone who has reviewed this has said as much. I drove it and thought it was night and day.
The much quoted $34k is a phantom number created by dealer-add ons. If I added the Works package to my nicely equipped S with the premium, winter, fogs, xenons, and wiper/mirrors only gets to $28,300. Not cheap but not unreasonable.
Why is there so much hostility towards the Works? Is it infighting from the Tuners and disciples or just anger over the price? I can understand the anger over the price. I know I am struggling with the decision. I can get a pulley package under warranty from my dealer for thousands less than the Work package. It doesn't have the Works Supercharger or the Works head modifications. It also doesn't have a certificate that will add $5k to the resale of my car instead of a minus $2k.
>>yep...agree 100%...finally drove it and no big deal, no difference from a standing start than my S, but I have light 16" alloys and yokos which have improved my low end over the dreadful 17" superlights and goodyear runflats....there is modest performance gains IMO at 4 to 7K, but at $34K...bimmer is taking drugs from the 60's...lol ! I have had a modified MC beat my S over a 2 block run, not till I get to the upper end do I pull away and not by as much as would have thought....220hp and torque over 200 + ft lbs seems to me where the MCS should be based on all the latest engine upgrades from other 4 bangers....mini started the engine design back when many other 4 bangers were under 150 hp, by the time they finally got to market, they were a couple years behind unfortunately and late to the party in terms of what performance drivers now want and it appears the supercharger was an after thought to get the S to market, especially in the US...that's why the stumble seems only to be related to the S and not the MC....but that said, no other car handles like the minis, except the original minis, laugh !
_________________
If you're driving a Works package and you don't notice any difference over the stock either the mechanics did a miserable job or more likely you entered the evaluation so biased against the Works that there was no possibility of it ever getting a fair shake. There is a massive difference between the two versions. Everyone who has reviewed this has said as much. I drove it and thought it was night and day.
The much quoted $34k is a phantom number created by dealer-add ons. If I added the Works package to my nicely equipped S with the premium, winter, fogs, xenons, and wiper/mirrors only gets to $28,300. Not cheap but not unreasonable.
Why is there so much hostility towards the Works? Is it infighting from the Tuners and disciples or just anger over the price? I can understand the anger over the price. I know I am struggling with the decision. I can get a pulley package under warranty from my dealer for thousands less than the Work package. It doesn't have the Works Supercharger or the Works head modifications. It also doesn't have a certificate that will add $5k to the resale of my car instead of a minus $2k.
>>yep...agree 100%...finally drove it and no big deal, no difference from a standing start than my S, but I have light 16" alloys and yokos which have improved my low end over the dreadful 17" superlights and goodyear runflats....there is modest performance gains IMO at 4 to 7K, but at $34K...bimmer is taking drugs from the 60's...lol ! I have had a modified MC beat my S over a 2 block run, not till I get to the upper end do I pull away and not by as much as would have thought....220hp and torque over 200 + ft lbs seems to me where the MCS should be based on all the latest engine upgrades from other 4 bangers....mini started the engine design back when many other 4 bangers were under 150 hp, by the time they finally got to market, they were a couple years behind unfortunately and late to the party in terms of what performance drivers now want and it appears the supercharger was an after thought to get the S to market, especially in the US...that's why the stumble seems only to be related to the S and not the MC....but that said, no other car handles like the minis, except the original minis, laugh !
_________________
6th Gear
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 3,359
Likes: 1
From: New Jersey
>>I agree with you!!!!!........the resale value of a mcs with the kit will be much higher,years from now,than those with aftermarket upgrades.If you read all the reviews of the "WORKS KIT",in the car mags,every person that tested the kit was very impressed by it....(100 people can't be wrong,all at same time....!) >>
I'm not sure about that. I just read one review in I believe some Euro mag and although they did say it was an improvement and a good one, they mentioned made several "subtle" remarks to the effect that it is totally NOT worth it.
>>I'm not sure about that. I just read one review in I believe some Euro mag and although they did say it was an improvement and a good one, they mentioned made several "subtle" remarks to the effect that it is totally NOT worth it.
3rd Gear
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 283
Likes: 0
From: Montreal, Canada
It would be interesting to see a full comparison review of the JCW car and evotech ecu/pully car. Maybe one of you owners here can put something together. I for one am going for the ecu/pully as soon as i can get enough people to gather for a pully party with Randy.
I will be driving a friend's JCW car this weekend so i'll give a full report. The JCW car, without a doubt, will become a collectors cars in the future. 10 years from now their resale value will probably be double to triple a stock MCS and from 10-25 years the value will begin to climb as they begin to disappear (sad to say but, get stolen, totaled, etc). Holding a JCW kept in good shape will be like holding a gem especially if, god forbid, Chris Bangle steps in and tries to design the next MINI. I'll cry, no seriously i'll cry
Amit
I will be driving a friend's JCW car this weekend so i'll give a full report. The JCW car, without a doubt, will become a collectors cars in the future. 10 years from now their resale value will probably be double to triple a stock MCS and from 10-25 years the value will begin to climb as they begin to disappear (sad to say but, get stolen, totaled, etc). Holding a JCW kept in good shape will be like holding a gem especially if, god forbid, Chris Bangle steps in and tries to design the next MINI. I'll cry, no seriously i'll cry
Amit
4th Gear
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 434
Likes: 0
"If you're driving a Works package and you don't notice any difference over the stock either the mechanics did a miserable job or more likely you entered the evaluation so biased against the Works that there was no possibility of it ever getting a fair shake."
Well, guess it's possible the mechanics at North Scottsdale Mini did a miserable job as I certainly couldn't see that much difference, but one should go drive it and not just rely on the hype of some here that have not even driven it or those who did drive it came away from the test drive with a little too much seat of the pants wishful longing, laugh ! Obvious from many who have driven it, it's no big deal from their posts...
"There is a massive difference between the two versions. Everyone who has reviewed this has said as much. I drove it and thought it was night and day."
As from above, obviously not 100% accurate, especially from many posters who have driven it, myself included as it might be the difference between night and a very very early dawn, laugh !
"The much quoted $34k is a phantom number created by dealer-add ons. If I added the Works package to my nicely equipped S with the premium, winter, fogs, xenons, and wiper/mirrors only gets to $28,300"
well maybe somewhat milder drugs they are on then, laugh !
You missed my point.....the S is fine, the HP is fine for me and the car is OK performance wise, but obviously that is not what many buyers are opting for, IE the WRX, EVO, SRT etc and why do you think there is so much business out there for the tuners out there, because buyers want more performance and they are getting bombarded by the ads for the new hot 4 bangers every month...is this good or bad, who knows, but the market I guess says it is at least in the States, not that big a deal in Europe or Japan....this performance hype for 4 bangers was not there when the MC pentagon engine was on the drawing board
I know one thing, if I got the JCW, I would leave off the works badge and try to stay stealth, otherwise it could be a little humiliating....bottom line, go drive it, it's only money and if it floats your boat, go for it, but I'll take a pass...cheers !
Well, guess it's possible the mechanics at North Scottsdale Mini did a miserable job as I certainly couldn't see that much difference, but one should go drive it and not just rely on the hype of some here that have not even driven it or those who did drive it came away from the test drive with a little too much seat of the pants wishful longing, laugh ! Obvious from many who have driven it, it's no big deal from their posts...
"There is a massive difference between the two versions. Everyone who has reviewed this has said as much. I drove it and thought it was night and day."
As from above, obviously not 100% accurate, especially from many posters who have driven it, myself included as it might be the difference between night and a very very early dawn, laugh !
"The much quoted $34k is a phantom number created by dealer-add ons. If I added the Works package to my nicely equipped S with the premium, winter, fogs, xenons, and wiper/mirrors only gets to $28,300"
well maybe somewhat milder drugs they are on then, laugh !
You missed my point.....the S is fine, the HP is fine for me and the car is OK performance wise, but obviously that is not what many buyers are opting for, IE the WRX, EVO, SRT etc and why do you think there is so much business out there for the tuners out there, because buyers want more performance and they are getting bombarded by the ads for the new hot 4 bangers every month...is this good or bad, who knows, but the market I guess says it is at least in the States, not that big a deal in Europe or Japan....this performance hype for 4 bangers was not there when the MC pentagon engine was on the drawing board
I know one thing, if I got the JCW, I would leave off the works badge and try to stay stealth, otherwise it could be a little humiliating....bottom line, go drive it, it's only money and if it floats your boat, go for it, but I'll take a pass...cheers !