Just saw this......Conti's coming out with a new 200TW tire. Had no idea they and Hoosier were in cahoots At first glance it looks like one more ZIII/RE71R/RT660 knockoff......

https://rennlist.com/forums/racing-a...rack-tire.html

 

Great info, I'm sure Eddie 07 will be all over this. For the rest of this season, I'm 'sticking' with my Nitto NT01s 225/45/17. They are extremely grippy and very predictable, and not that pricy when you consider how long they last. Anything with a Hoosier name in the development story is going to cost big $$, I'm sure! Actually, with the spare set I've got in the basement, I'm set til the '23 season

The one advantage these have is that you can bring 'em to Watkins Glen in September/October and you'll be fine when the temps dip down into the 30s. I didn't see anything in that writeup about how they do in snow, tho...

 

It seems that this has become a very hot market. Why not. Can’t sell a lot 60k mile tires, but you can sell a lot of tires that will be worn out in a month.

It is great to see a tire aimed at the track market vs the autocross market.

Cooper has a new tire in this market too.

It sounds like the Continental tire is expensive. If it on par with the Hoosiers, then what I buy for $135 will be in the $235 range for the Continentals. The Coopers are in the same ball park as the Continentals. Too rich for me...

But I am always interested in info...

 

Four arrived y-day and four today......having them "in hand" vs a photo makes a big difference. First, they are noticeably lighter in weight than the RE71R--TR lists them @ 18# vs 21 for the 'Stone. That is a BIG difference! Feel faster already They also do have two good-sized longitudinal channels for the water, and what tread it does have looks deep enough for the wet; again, TR lists it at 7/32". What I did NOT notice at all when looking at these is that they are NOT asymmetrical like the 'Stone i.e. no rotational arrows. They are directional with inside/outside markings so I can move them from the left side of the car to the right and v-v without flipping them. Of course I'm sure I'll end up doing that anyway when needed but a nice surprise anyway

BTW I just checked and TR is now showing "back order" for these so the other dealers can't be far behind--glad I got' em now.

 

GRM got to these already......https://grassrootsmotorsports.com/ne...ndurance-tire/

Took a quick look and saw Phil's Tire Service pricing a 205/50-15 at $155, about the same as what I paid for the A052s. Not cheap, but not crazy either IMO.

 

gbuff - I can’t wait to hear about your impressions of the A052s...

As for the new Conti. I also run the 215/45R17. The closest the Conti will come to that is the 225/45R17... That size is ~$200 in the A052 and $240 in the Conti. In the Falken they are $138. They would have to last twice as long at that price. Even if they did, I would still wonder if they would heat cycle out. This happened with my Dunlop ZIIs. I never wore the tread off them. They just got slower. The Conti tire may be made to run 8 hrs or so, but that is a single heat cycle. For us track rats, that isn’ t the same as running 16 half hour sessions as that is 16 heat cycles.

It is interesting that the Conti also comes in 225/40R17, which no one else makes. That could be an interesting tire my JCW.

As for running tires “backward”, yes the A052s are nice in that respect, so you can flip them side to side. However, you should note that event the “directional” tires like the RE71Rs and the ZIIIs can be run backwards. They are backwards in tread alone. If it is dry out, the tread doesn’t matter... I do this at LRP because of the wear on the left front.

 

Likewise, Eddie, I started out my last event at Mid-O with 4 "rights" on the car! Car felt fine.....that Conti doesn't sound like a tire I'd buy, being an "endurance" tire......my feeling is that you buy what you believe is the fastest tire you can afford for your particular car and manner of driving--at day's end, if you don't have grip you don't have anything.

Speaking of tires, just saw Lance Stroll hit the concrete wall HARD at the Azerbijian (sp?) GP. Cause: tire failure

 

And with 5 laps to go and Max Verstappen leading comfortably his l/r tire let go at 200mph on the main straight, same as Stroll.

Pirelli's got a problem here.

 

Loosing a tire at 200 mph must make one’s heart skip a beat...

Kinda makes our tire discussions look a bit passé.

 

After the race I think Pirelli claimed debris but it's a story worth following this week. The closeup picture of Stroll's tire didn't look like debris to me.
I have a set of Falkens in the basement that I will put on before WGI in August even if the Hankooks aren't totally worn yet.

 

I watch the R1 race highlights. There were also 2 cases of locked up brakes, which took out Louis Hamilton. That could have been tires too, just bad driving or both... But no mention of cut tires in the highlights...

This past weekend:

Not the best day for MINI and the new TC class MINI “GP” race car...

I have read that Mark Pombo had a broken shoulder as a result.

The back story is, LAP Motor worked with MINI to bulid and race 3 or 4 Gen 3 MINIs. They started as “S” then acquired JCW parts when that hit the market. These cars raced in IMSA until they dropped that class of car. They went on to GT America and raced in TCA. The next class up is TC and when the GP 3 came out they then had MINI parts necessary for that class. This was the second race of a brand new car. Don’t know why it wound up cartwheeling off track...

 

They do think it's something other than debris--Stroll had been out there the longest on those "hard" tires. As it turned out, maybe TOO long......and with Max it was the left rear as with Stroll. Coincidence? Pirelli went one level softer with all of their tires for this race and perhaps all of this occurred because of that.

As for Lewis, he simply screwed up and apologized to the team. Even 7-time World Champions are not immune

Pombo's crash looks awful--the shoulder will be painful enough and I hope he has no other issues down the road.

A few years ago all three of the cars they were racing at that time were in the shop at my dealer in Buffalo (Towne) being serviced (two of the three cars had experienced cooling issues at their last race). I don't recall if they were coming from or going to the Glen. I took a good look and other than the safety equip and aero bits they didn't look all that outrageous--I do recall the suspension being KW Var.3 which I was told had custom settings. Not much else was done to the cars.

A while back when I was looking into adding front camber (again) I "talked" to LAP on their FB page (they answered! ); I asked them how much front camber they ran and was told -3.7 to -4.0 depending on the track. I then asked if they dialed it back at all for rain and they basically said "nope, we just put the rains on and go".

I know these are race cars (and, more importantly, race car DRIVERS) but that seems like a TON of camber to run in the wet (and the dry for that matter). But they know much better than I do

 

Interesting info about the cars. I want to talk to LAP about what they use for brake caliper pistons. The MINI ones are made with a ceramic or sintered metal face that presses up against the pad and over time on the track it will crumble and fall apart...

The other thing that people tend to miss on their suspension setup is the big fat front and rear swaybars... My favorite!

As for rain... I wonder if that amount of camber may actually help. Less tread on the pavement, which would be less chance for hydroplaning. Just a guess. But, resetting camber isn’t easy and it pushes the toe in to the wrong direction. Also, if they start on slicks and switch to wets, there is no chance to reset the suspension. Drive what you got...

But, wow, that is a lot of camber...

 

My thought exactly, which is why I asked.....but, again, they're pros and we're schmoes

 

This phrase has been added to my everyday speech. I doubt a day will go by that I can't use it.

 

Hey, I resemble that remark...

 

On the other hand, MINIs are really good in the rain and that is why it doesn’t make a difference... Just a thought... OK, they are Pros....

 

WOW, that MINI caught a lot of air! If only a broken shoulder, that says a lot about the solidness of the car. I never got multi-class racing; just didn't make sense to me to have cars of such different capabilities on the track simultaneously.

Minus 4 camber seems extreme to me, another schmo, not a pro. I would think at that angle you would lose some grip on the straights as you'd have at least a few mms of tire not in contact with the track. Just my simple mind; I'm sure they've worked out why it is -4 and not -4.5 or -3.5. I think I ran -3 or 3.25 up front for a while when I wasn't doing much driving on the street, and it did make a huge difference at a track like Lime Rock. I noticed it even more when I dialed it back to -2, where it is now.

GKP, what is that little thing with the golf cart wheels next to your track beast in your signature pic? It looks like it would be a blast to drive... Can't wait to see that run the Glen!

 

most of those pro's are simply pay to drive. Buddy paid to drive the hyundai car 2 years ago pre covid, it's less than 10K per race if you wanna do it! I have a fb friend that has a audi team he moved up from nasa porsche GT racing to gt4 then a audi a8.

These gt cars have a lot of CF that gets broken off and it's like running over razorblades

 

Very stout cars indeed!

Having multi class racing does make the races interest. Much like Le Mans. That has aways had a variety of cars in the race. But it does mean that the racers have to pay attention, much like, at LRP, the GT3 cars have to watch out for me when I am passing them.

However, I think that restart was a mess and I am surprised there weren’t more problems. But, I think in Mark Pombo’s case that wasn’t a factor. He was clearly having problems with the MINI from the start of the race. He qualified 3rd, but during the race he couldn’t keep up a 3rd place pace and was dropping through the ranks quickly. Maybe he had car problems that played into that crash. Not sure what actually happened as nothing seems to have been published.

I think they run much lower tire pressures than what we run and that would put more rubber on the track in straight line. In that Conti tires test that GrassRoots did, they were running something like 29 psi with -3 deg camber. Plus, they are the pros...

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It is a very cute full bodied go kart...

 

Good points, Eddie. 29 psi cold? That's not that far from some of my starting pressures. Anyway, we can talk this over on Thursday....I'm off the waiting list and onto the driving list!

 

Hope all of you have a great time--I'll be thinking of you as I'm behind ANOTHER big truck on I-71 on the way to Mid-O Thurs morning....
But once I get there it's all forgotten--this "hobby" is extremely therapeutic.

 

It really says it all, at least in my case

 

I am glad you are doing your best to keep them and TR financially in the black...

Enjoy your therapy... I am sure we will. Weather is looking to be ideal. VV - will be glad to meet up with you. Meet up at our usual spot by the T2 - T3 flag station gate?

As for that tire pressure, I believe that the 29 psi was Hot... Long ways from what I run...

 

GBUFF, have a blast!
Eddie, 29 hot is almost as insane as -4 camber! See you at T2/3 Thursday AM.

When I see my first 18 wheeler on the track, I'm done with this whole thing! 😉