Thats not Supposed to Happen
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Join Date: Jan 2007
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Thats not Supposed to Happen
Sunday after the RMW Tuning sessions were complete I joined other MM.org members and drug a new person to the BMW-CCA HPDE and Club Races being held at Eagles Canyon Race Way in the no stop light town of Slidel. TX. It's a new track that has had it share of teething pains. My last outing there with the PCA on one of their Club Race weekends had portions of the track braking up and quite bumpy. Over the summer management shut down the track and repaved these areas with great results. The new pavement was nice and grippy, most of the washboard surfaces were gone. Billiard Table smooth? Eh, not quite, but a lot better than previous outings. Track management seems committed to created an excellent venue for DE's and Club Racing.
From the MINI community we had 7 MM.org members with their mounts. The Texas Speedwerks guys were there. From the tune weekend mini_racer was up from Austin for his first track date and Jan stuck around for a late flight to support us and get some rides around the track. Good think so many MINI's and friends were around, I ended up needing some help...
Tire choice was Toyo R888 on Team Dynamics Pro Race 1.0's as one of the Nitto NT-01's had picked up a nail. I has used these Toyos once before in the spring at this track and they also had about 1000 street miles on them too. Moved them front to rear to try and equalize the wear for the this event. We also had planned to performs some brake temperature testing at this outs. The results are in the Let's Talk Track Brakes thread.
The first session went off without a hitch. Since this was my first session with the BMW-CCA at this track even though I am soloed they wanted me to take an instructor along. I have no issue there, I'm always up for learning new tricks. I was a little rusty but a few laps shook that loose and I was doing just fine. Car was a little squirrely but it was a cool morning so I figured it was from that. Before the second session we painted a section of the rotors with the temperature recording paint, For the most part the session went quite well, however, towards the end the tires felt really greasy. After getting back to the paddock and checking pressures I knew why right away. The night before I filled the tires and set the pressure with a different gauge. I also over filled a few pounds knowing it was going to be a lot cooler in the morning. I went way to far. The tires were all over inflated. Adjusted them and went off for lunch and to watch the Club Race Enduro.
Session three was a hoot, the car was working great, I was doing well, even chased down what should be a faster car. One of the instructors was out that session in his spec Miata. This guy is good so after letting him by I tried my best to stick with him. That was going very well for about 1/2 a lap. Turn 3 is a left 1008 degree turn with a slight downhill off camber exit. Right after clipping the apex and with my foot firmly only the floor it happened...
The car lurched to the right, I saw something fly off the front in my peripheral vision and I could not steer. I figured a tire went down. Not much I could do now but just go for the a ride. Put both feet in putting the car in neutral and hitting the ABS far sooner then normal. The car slid over some curbing then a gravel patch, slithered on the grass and finally came to rest just before entering the high grass and directly across from a flag station. I tried to move it but nothing. Good thing there was some rain earlier in the week, I could smell smoldering grass. Let the corner worker know I was ok and I needed a flat bed with hand signals. The red flag was displayed bring the session to stop. The corner worked crossed the now quiet track with a fire bottle in hand. Soon after I saw blcak flags displayed and the everyone made the slow parade to the pits. Being the session was about 3/4 over at this point it was ended. Sorry about that.
I got out of the car after being cleared by the corner worker and he asked me what happened. I said it felt like a tire went down. He was around the car by that point and said it wasn't the tire but the wheel had broken. All kinds if thoughts went through my head. How am I going to get Jan to the airport in time? How much damage did I do? How big a wallet hole is this going to make? and a million others.
The tow crew was quickly at the site and just as quick figured how they were going to get the car back to the paddock. Track Management was there just as quick to give me a ride back and sweep up the mess I made. Good thing it was not much. Almost as quick as I was back in the paddock with no car the tow crew arrived.
Car on the Rollback - Image by Brian Fair of Vorshlag
The tow crew and the assembled MM.org members helped to remove the car from the rollback without inflicting more damage. Cudo's to Motorsport Towing of Denton. TX. These guys were great.
Coming off the Rollback - Image by Brian Fair of Vorshlag
Wheel Center - Image by Brian Fair of Vorshlag
The Wheel - Image by Brian Fair of Vorshlag
The suspension drooped causing the bolt on the bottom of the A Arm to dig into the wheel, splitting the wheel in half.
Wheel Backside - Image by Brian Fair of Vorshlag
Thanks to the MM.org members that were there we moved a back wheel to the front and I was lent a set of wheels to put on the rear. I can't thank these guys enough for the help in getting me back on 4 wheels. One of the members drove the car around a bit to make sure it felt OK. I was still a bit shaky and wanted a 2nd opinion. The exhaust sounded a little off but the car was driveable.
mini_racer followed me back to the house and graciously took Jan to the airport where he barely made his flight. Thanks Terry, I own ya for that.
That evening I sent am email to Team Dynamics letting them know of the issue. I was impressed by the quick reply on Monday. They wanted the wheel back to ship to the factory for the engineers to examine. They offered to replace the wheel as well. The wheel is now on it's way back to them.
I was able to get the car on a lift to look for hidden damages. I must be blessed or have a lot of karma points or something as all damage is cosmetic. An arch is missing. The arch side marker is gone, but the wiring and socket are still there and working. One of the splitter turnbuckles pulled through the bumper cover and the splitter is a little borked. So much for the show car look. Oh yeah the inner fender liner is now "trimmed"
Missing Arch
Underneath the damage was even less. TSW's X-Brace saved a lot of parts and held up perfectly.
X-Brace
Even the A Arm bolt that dug into the wheel came out unscathed. I figured this was going to be a rounded off mess.
A-Arm Bolt
The rotor has no damage at all and the caliper has some scuff marks.
Caliper
I was lucky!! This easily could have been a horrific incident.
Everyone that I've been in contact with about this has been very helpful. I will continue to use Team Dynamic wheels. This is a very rare incident for them. So rare in fact they want the broken wheel for their engineers to inspect and will replace the wheel. I have to admit I am a little gun shy about the rest of the set and have asked for a replacement set. I'll update with the results of their examination.
Thanks to all the MM.org Members, TSW, Vorshalg, the Corner Workers, Tow Crew, Track Crew and all the others I may have forgotten to list. Ya'll helped to make a bad thing into a positive experience.
From the MINI community we had 7 MM.org members with their mounts. The Texas Speedwerks guys were there. From the tune weekend mini_racer was up from Austin for his first track date and Jan stuck around for a late flight to support us and get some rides around the track. Good think so many MINI's and friends were around, I ended up needing some help...
Tire choice was Toyo R888 on Team Dynamics Pro Race 1.0's as one of the Nitto NT-01's had picked up a nail. I has used these Toyos once before in the spring at this track and they also had about 1000 street miles on them too. Moved them front to rear to try and equalize the wear for the this event. We also had planned to performs some brake temperature testing at this outs. The results are in the Let's Talk Track Brakes thread.
The first session went off without a hitch. Since this was my first session with the BMW-CCA at this track even though I am soloed they wanted me to take an instructor along. I have no issue there, I'm always up for learning new tricks. I was a little rusty but a few laps shook that loose and I was doing just fine. Car was a little squirrely but it was a cool morning so I figured it was from that. Before the second session we painted a section of the rotors with the temperature recording paint, For the most part the session went quite well, however, towards the end the tires felt really greasy. After getting back to the paddock and checking pressures I knew why right away. The night before I filled the tires and set the pressure with a different gauge. I also over filled a few pounds knowing it was going to be a lot cooler in the morning. I went way to far. The tires were all over inflated. Adjusted them and went off for lunch and to watch the Club Race Enduro.
Session three was a hoot, the car was working great, I was doing well, even chased down what should be a faster car. One of the instructors was out that session in his spec Miata. This guy is good so after letting him by I tried my best to stick with him. That was going very well for about 1/2 a lap. Turn 3 is a left 1008 degree turn with a slight downhill off camber exit. Right after clipping the apex and with my foot firmly only the floor it happened...
The car lurched to the right, I saw something fly off the front in my peripheral vision and I could not steer. I figured a tire went down. Not much I could do now but just go for the a ride. Put both feet in putting the car in neutral and hitting the ABS far sooner then normal. The car slid over some curbing then a gravel patch, slithered on the grass and finally came to rest just before entering the high grass and directly across from a flag station. I tried to move it but nothing. Good thing there was some rain earlier in the week, I could smell smoldering grass. Let the corner worker know I was ok and I needed a flat bed with hand signals. The red flag was displayed bring the session to stop. The corner worked crossed the now quiet track with a fire bottle in hand. Soon after I saw blcak flags displayed and the everyone made the slow parade to the pits. Being the session was about 3/4 over at this point it was ended. Sorry about that.
I got out of the car after being cleared by the corner worker and he asked me what happened. I said it felt like a tire went down. He was around the car by that point and said it wasn't the tire but the wheel had broken. All kinds if thoughts went through my head. How am I going to get Jan to the airport in time? How much damage did I do? How big a wallet hole is this going to make? and a million others.
The tow crew was quickly at the site and just as quick figured how they were going to get the car back to the paddock. Track Management was there just as quick to give me a ride back and sweep up the mess I made. Good thing it was not much. Almost as quick as I was back in the paddock with no car the tow crew arrived.
Car on the Rollback - Image by Brian Fair of Vorshlag
The tow crew and the assembled MM.org members helped to remove the car from the rollback without inflicting more damage. Cudo's to Motorsport Towing of Denton. TX. These guys were great.
Coming off the Rollback - Image by Brian Fair of Vorshlag
Wheel Center - Image by Brian Fair of Vorshlag
The Wheel - Image by Brian Fair of Vorshlag
The suspension drooped causing the bolt on the bottom of the A Arm to dig into the wheel, splitting the wheel in half.
Wheel Backside - Image by Brian Fair of Vorshlag
Thanks to the MM.org members that were there we moved a back wheel to the front and I was lent a set of wheels to put on the rear. I can't thank these guys enough for the help in getting me back on 4 wheels. One of the members drove the car around a bit to make sure it felt OK. I was still a bit shaky and wanted a 2nd opinion. The exhaust sounded a little off but the car was driveable.
mini_racer followed me back to the house and graciously took Jan to the airport where he barely made his flight. Thanks Terry, I own ya for that.
That evening I sent am email to Team Dynamics letting them know of the issue. I was impressed by the quick reply on Monday. They wanted the wheel back to ship to the factory for the engineers to examine. They offered to replace the wheel as well. The wheel is now on it's way back to them.
I was able to get the car on a lift to look for hidden damages. I must be blessed or have a lot of karma points or something as all damage is cosmetic. An arch is missing. The arch side marker is gone, but the wiring and socket are still there and working. One of the splitter turnbuckles pulled through the bumper cover and the splitter is a little borked. So much for the show car look. Oh yeah the inner fender liner is now "trimmed"
Missing Arch
Underneath the damage was even less. TSW's X-Brace saved a lot of parts and held up perfectly.
X-Brace
Even the A Arm bolt that dug into the wheel came out unscathed. I figured this was going to be a rounded off mess.
A-Arm Bolt
The rotor has no damage at all and the caliper has some scuff marks.
Caliper
I was lucky!! This easily could have been a horrific incident.
Everyone that I've been in contact with about this has been very helpful. I will continue to use Team Dynamic wheels. This is a very rare incident for them. So rare in fact they want the broken wheel for their engineers to inspect and will replace the wheel. I have to admit I am a little gun shy about the rest of the set and have asked for a replacement set. I'll update with the results of their examination.
Thanks to all the MM.org Members, TSW, Vorshalg, the Corner Workers, Tow Crew, Track Crew and all the others I may have forgotten to list. Ya'll helped to make a bad thing into a positive experience.
#2
#4
#5
Thanks for sharing your experience with the NAM clan. Very interesting story with a (thankfully) happy ending wrt your health and well-being.
And I must say, I'm glad that my all-time favorite, bad-a$$ looking MINI escaped more serious damage. Hope it -- and you -- are back in show condition soonest.
And I must say, I'm glad that my all-time favorite, bad-a$$ looking MINI escaped more serious damage. Hope it -- and you -- are back in show condition soonest.
#6
#7
Join Date: Jan 2007
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Well yeah if it happened under braking, but I was at WOT. So it must have been all the new found power Jan added.
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#11
seems like very rarely a wheel is made from a bad set of metal and is much more brittle than the rest. No visual signs just a weak wheel. Glad to hear there were no injuries. I hope tram dynamics will hook you up with a new set. I would be a little nervous of the others as well, I think they will do the right thing.
#12
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#15
Join Date: Dec 2006
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Sorry to see the damage, but it could have been a lot worse. Gives you a new reason to mod; perhaps an entire bottom skid plate for traveling without wheels?
Hope youre too shaken up and it doesnt put you off for too long.
Keep us updated on the wheels. Be interesting to see if they change all of them. I would be worried about the others having the same issues.
Hope youre too shaken up and it doesnt put you off for too long.
Keep us updated on the wheels. Be interesting to see if they change all of them. I would be worried about the others having the same issues.
#16
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Sorry to see the damage, but it could have been a lot worse. Gives you a new reason to mod; perhaps an entire bottom skid plate for traveling without wheels?
Hope youre too shaken up and it doesnt put you off for too long.
Keep us updated on the wheels. Be interesting to see if they change all of them. I would be worried about the others having the same issues.
Hope youre too shaken up and it doesnt put you off for too long.
Keep us updated on the wheels. Be interesting to see if they change all of them. I would be worried about the others having the same issues.
Instead of the skid plate TSW's X-Brace adds stiffness and protects.
#20
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The broken wheel was sent back to the UK for testing, they can find nothing wrong. I don't agree but with the penchant for litigation in the US I can see of they admit to an issue then they open the floodgates. TD has given me a replacement on their dime, paid all the shipping for all parts too and offered a nice discount on a new set if I want.
Being I was on the track when this happened and I take responsibility for my actions I'm going to walk away from this happy.
For Sale - One set TD Pro Race 1, 3 have mild track use scars, 1 brand new... LOL
Being I was on the track when this happened and I take responsibility for my actions I'm going to walk away from this happy.
For Sale - One set TD Pro Race 1, 3 have mild track use scars, 1 brand new... LOL
#24
The broken wheel was sent back to the UK for testing, they can find nothing wrong. I don't agree but with the penchant for litigation in the US I can see of they admit to an issue then they open the floodgates. TD has given me a replacement on their dime, paid all the shipping for all parts too and offered a nice discount on a new set if I want.
Being I was on the track when this happened and I take responsibility for my actions I'm going to walk away from this happy.
For Sale - One set TD Pro Race 1, 3 have mild track use scars, 1 brand new... LOL
Being I was on the track when this happened and I take responsibility for my actions I'm going to walk away from this happy.
For Sale - One set TD Pro Race 1, 3 have mild track use scars, 1 brand new... LOL
#25
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I've been told by a company I have a lot of dealings with they have a line on some lightweight forged wheels that will be affordable. I am waiting to see what they have before I decide. Probably be mid January before this is all nailed down.
I've been asked by them not to give away who they are or what the wheel specifics are at this time. I'm not trying to be coy but I do feel I should honor these requests.
I've been asked by them not to give away who they are or what the wheel specifics are at this time. I'm not trying to be coy but I do feel I should honor these requests.