OK, so how many people here have done these repairs themselves? Our 2008 Cooper S has 39500 miles on it now and has been experiencing the louder start up noise for the past 2k miles roughly. The dealership said by looking in through the valve cover with a mirror that he can see the guide at minimum needs replacing. They suggest doing the whole kit for $2000 installed. I started a claim with Mini North America and they are willing to cover 50% of the repairs. I'm still thinking I can probably do it cheaper myself, assuming I have all the tools needed to do so, but if not I would still rather spend money on tools than someone elses labor. I already have a 12 point bit set from Snap On that I purchased with intent to take apart the wheels for painting.

 

I would certainly try the new tensioner myself prior to opening up the timing chain. I hadn't heard anyone previously say you could see or measure the timing chain guide from valve cover. I would talk to one of the Aftermarket experts like Way Motor Works? I did not do the timing chain on mine, just the new improved tensioner.

 

Just spoke to Way Motor Works, he highly suggests doing the full timing kit. Which runs about $400, plus $26 for the turbo line heat shield, and $300 for the timing tool kit. So its still $250 cheaper than having mini do it at their 50% discount through Mini North America. I would probably just re-sell the timing tool kit afterwards and try to re-coup like $200 of that.

 

Good information! Where all is the timing tool kit available? Could it be a potential eBay item for less. My son has an '07 that is a prime candidate and I have an '08 that will be along too soon I'm afraid. Good investment for me.
What other specialty tools are reuired or "must haves" to do the job? I'm seeing kits out there for under $200.

 

OK, actually Mini quoted me around $650, which isnt terrible but still IDK which route to take. For about the same cost as it would cost me its almost worth it to let them do it and have it come along with a warranty and a loaner car and all.

 

I didn't get a firm quote but "over a grand" is the guesstimate I got, plus I'm sure diagnostic charges on top of that.

 

Since I have a couple of the "long" tensioners in my hand, I can't see anything "improved" about them. They just appear longer. (See my detailed posts earlier.) I suppose they could incorporate a check valve, but I do not believe they do.

See the TSB in my posts that details the slack measuring method.

DOC

 

I would let Mini do it. But if you do it you get ZERO warranty. If Mini does it you get full Mini warranty on the work they did. For the amount you are saving I think the warranty is worth more.

 

Local Mini dealer charges $2200. Local independent Mini shop, Greasy's Garage, charges $1200.

DOC

 

Will the independent repair shop give the same warranty on parts and labor that the Mini dealer will? That would be my biggest concern. What's needed is a firm quote for 1/2 the cost to enable the decision to be made.

 

Doc, isn't the longer length the improvement? I believe they are spring loaded, so maybe the spring is stronger?, less prone to heat damage?, less prone to sticking because of tolerances, etc...??? I'm guessing the real improvement is just the length itself, that takes up the extra slack from a stretched timing chain...

My thoughts are that the "S" model increased HP, torque and increased HEAT (heat does strange things to metal based on quality/makeup), stretches the chain faster than the "Non-S" model, thus less issues with the later. That doesn't mean the Non-S won't also strtch over time.

Seems to me the longer tensioner should be used from the factory since Mini started replacing them, but that may not be the case (?).

IMHO a proper fix should include a higher "quality" timing chain and tensioner.

From what I can tell from posts here, Mini seems to be dealing with it "as is" until the next engine model change...

 

Comparing new tensioners, side by side, the longer one seems to have a slightly lower spring rate. Makes sense, given how much longer the "plunger" is. (Body length is the same.) Check valve would seem to have been a good idea, but apparently is not included.

I believe the problem is not "stretch", but chain/guide wear, dragging until the tensioner pumps up at each cold startup. N14s, on average, tend to be run at lower oil levels. Justas don't tend to lose oil nearly as much, so all the same things happen, just a little slower. Long intervals, cruddy oil does not help either. Have you seen how tiny the oil feed holes in the tensioner are? The longer it takes for the tensioner to fully pump up, the more wear at each cold start.

I'm going with an Accusump.

DOC

 

Just to share my experience - 2007 MCS which rolled over to 50,000 miles today.

I knew about the death rattle but didn't experience it during the warranty period, which expired about two years ago. Last week it hit hard. I immediately took it to my local dealer for diagnosis.

According to the service notes, "Removed valve cover gasket and I found guide chain broke and pieces went down to the guide rails causing them to broke(sic) too."

The engine timing chain, guide rail, chain guide, crankshaft sprocket, tensioners were all replaced. I also had the serpentine belt replaced as a preventative measure. The shop notes said there were lots of cracks in it.

Total $1,600 of which $380 was for parts.

 

That is a good deal by Mini standards. But it is still ridiculous for a chain system to not last at least 200K.

DOC

 

CEL came on, had loss of throttle and death rattle.

Dealer told me $782 for tensioner and possible additional $1000 if the chain is bad. I authorized work and began researching the issue and found this thread.

If there aren't any support for us consumers then I'm going to absorb the cost of pocket.

 

I just bought two of the new long tensioners @ Herb Chambers, Boston for $20 each. It takes no more than 30 minutes to remove the tensioner, install the "dummy", measure the slack and install a new tensioner and seal. Anything more than $200 for this is robbery.


If the slack is UNDER 68mm, this is a perfectly acceptable repair. If it is OVER 68mm, you need the whole system replaced. It is about 9 hours of labor. Our local Mini shop does it for$1200, parts and labor.

DOC

 

Really? MOP quoted us 1300 for the repair.

 

My timing tensioner was just replaced on my 11' MCS N18 engine. The recall was in effect they said for my car and also the temp sensor coolant was replaced. My car is very different now because at cold start I do NOT get the obnoxious rattle anymore. It's smooth and quiet noise from the engine.

 

This whole timing chain thing bugs me a little bit, because one of the reasons I bought a Mini, and my prior Honda Element, was that they both have timing chains instead of belts. Don't like shelling out the $$$'s to replace the belts. As people here are finding out, it's a labor intensive job...

 

Black, I agree w/ you completely. The big difference here is that with a belt,
A. its designed to be serviced and even though its under a cover, it is still "outside" the engine. Chains are inside because they aren't needed to be servicable. They should last longer.
B. It has a designated service interval. My GM 4 cam went over 115K before I swapped mine out (belt), it now has 186K, is 20 yrs old and will still smoke half the cars that line up against it.
My brothers lowly GM Quad4 got over 200K before it finally ate through the tensioner guide and shredded the supports. It sounded like a diesel but was still running when he sold it. This is common for the Quad4s, they are solid as a tank and very durable. In their top iteration they also made 180HP and 155 LB/FT, not bad for a 4 valve w/o a turbo @ only 2.3 litres and designed in the mid 1980s.

My 2008 Clubbie S already was serviced at 38K and seems like it may be getting noisy again at 81K, hard to tell with the clacking the injectors make (normal noise). This is just an unacceptable and unconscionable situation, that a car that costs $30 to 40K loaded up requires 2 timing chain sets before it hits 100K. BMW needs to get off its collective posterior and recall this before a class-action lawsuit is the last & only resort.

 

Yeah this whole timing chain thing is a joke. Mine was replaced under warranty @ 28,000 miles. How long is this one going to last??? My 2002 Dodge Ram with 150,000 still had the original chain and ran just as quiet as the day I bought it. My Wife's 2003 Jeep liberty with 170,000 also original chain and quiet as a mouse.

 

Got my vehicle back. Tensioner was replaced as well as the water pump for friction wheel (?). Total about $1300. After driving it I hear a whirl when accelerating/decelerating like a supercharger. Wonder if it'll go away. Probably not.

 

+1 to this!!

I got sick of shelling out $600 - $800 for timing belt service on my previous vehicles (a couple of Lexus(es), an Acura and others). The MINI was attractive to me for the whole "timing chain" thing, too. Disappointing and frustrating to have to look forward to (possibly) more service for this chain, more $$$ than replacing a rubber belt also.

Since some of you are making comparisons with other vehicles, here's mine. My 1969 MGB - - over 200,000 miles. Many years of "deferred maintenance", spirited driving, never babied or pampered. It has its original double-row timing chain still in place. I had the engine out about 100,000 miles ago for a clutch change, checked the chain, gears etc. at that time. It was still in spec, no wear at all. I replaced the tensioner (about $10) as a precaution (old one looked fine), I've never even thought about the chain since then.

'60's British engineering - they really did do many things right!

So BMW - - what's up with that?

__________________________________________________

 

I just brought my 2008 MCS in for "engine overheated" error message." Just had my chain tensioner replaced in September 2012. Now they tell me the water pump is cracked and need to also charge me for the friction wheel. Is it common to replace the friction wheel when the water pump is replaced or because of the chain tensioner?

 

Well, mine goes in Friday for the repairs. Mini is covering 50% and it will cost me somewhere in the $600-$700 range for the complete chain/guide/tensioner replacement. Thankfully I am employed again and this isnt as much of a financial burden but I am still not happy about it in the least bit and hope that some day in the near future Mini/BMW will recognize the issue more fully and I will get the money back. (At least Ford was nice enough to do that for all of us 4.6 owners with cracked intake manifolds a number of years back.)