I'm glad to see that I'm not the only one having this problem.

I had the JCW Stage 1 installed last month and they put in new spark plugs at the same time. Since then I've had four or five incidents where I'll be in sixth on the highway, pull over to pass some slow car and the car will start to accelerate, inexplicably bog down (as if it's got an especially chewy bit of gas it's working through) and then go right back to normal acceleration. I haven't checked the rear view any time it's happened so I'm not sure if I'm getting smoke. I'll have to remember to do that next time.

I'm hesitant to take it to the dealer because it's not consistently repeatable. Has anyone gotten any satisfaction from taking it in, or is the DIY SeaFoam the only way to go?

 

When this 'superknock' happens, is there a split second of rapid clicking from the middle of the engine bay? Kind of like a ratcheting sound?

I had my 09 MCS in for service a month or two ago (leaking A/C hose), and they ended up doing the cold start fix as well. For the next week or so, I would be hitting a highway on-ramp or trying to pass someone, and the car wouldn't give me any power… make a rapid clicking noise lasting maybe 1/4 of a second… then give me the power I was asking for. I didn't check the rearview for smoke, but the general effect was it made the car feel like it was an automatic giving that extra delay before it decides to shift into a lower gear (but with a strange clicking noise).

I had my car in just this past Friday to have MINI look at it, and they said they couldn't get it to do it, that there were no engine codes (not sure if they actually checked, or looked close enough), and that it was probably just "bad gas".

-------

QUESTIONS:

1) does this sound like the "superknock" everyone's on about in here?

2) could any part of implementing the cold start fix solution lead to an occasional "superknock"?

3) when I go back to MINI again about this, where do I tell them to look to see record of a "superknock" event?

Any assistance would be *GREATLY* appreciated, as I live about 100 miles away from the nearest dealer (so chances to get it in for service are limited), and I'm very near the milage limit for my warranty (~41k miles… should last only another 2-3 months).

 

Yeah, that's what mine felt like and sounded like. Strangely it stopped doing it, fixed itself...

 

This happened to me the other day in 3rd gear at 3000rpms. I took the car to MINI where they replaced the O2 sensor and suggested I used V-Power Racing from now on. In Greece we have a huge problem on finding reliable gas stations that provide correct octanes. Our manual suggests 95 RON so I used that for a month only to get poor mileage as well as this issue. Now that I've switched to 100 RON much better mileage and no hiccup issues.

 

1) Yes that's a "superknock" event. The clicking noise you hear is pinging/detonation. Makes me cringe... Like most people have said, its very intermittent. My car will go through phases where it does it anytime I accelerate, and then other phases where it runs like a champ...even in 115 degree heat here in AZ. I'm beginning to think the crap 91 octane we get out west is not enough octane for our cars, especially when running higher boost like I am. When you throw some 100+ octane in the tank...car runs like a dream. I would say we need 93 minimum. I'd be interested to know if anyone that lives backeast and uses Sunoco's 94 that they offer at the pump, has pinging issues...I'd think not.

2) No

3) When they hook up your ECU, they will see the stored codes in the DME. These codes do not cause a CEL...so only they will be able to see them. And unless they are completely inept, they should be very familiar with the 'superknock' code...I know my dealer is. (It's extremely common, nearly all of the R56 S's do it)

 

I've been dealing with the new Tempe dealership (slightly less of a drive from Tucson). They tell me there were no codes stored in the computer, even when I specifically asked about the "superknock" code. They won't send me a copy of the printout, though; said it's BMW property or something like that (here I thought it was MY car and MY ECU). I may try Scottsdale instead in the next couple of weeks, though they're probably sick of me with the rattles I had them diagnose over and over and over again (which still aren't gone).

Tell me, will these codes show up if I buy some OBD tool or the fancy Bavarian Technic kit? If so, do you know if there is any value to the Bavarian kit over a standard OBD code reader for MINI owners?

 

They might be right...but who knows. Take it to MNS and see if they say anything different. Not sure what you are trying to accomplish out of them pulling that code though. Nearly all of the Cooper S's do it, and they aren't going to give you a "fix" for it. Just go in there explaining the symptoms...and that its a real concern to you.

As far as the Bavarian kit...I'm not sure as I've never used one, but from what I've heard, I think they can. Normal OBD readers will not pick it up...they only pick up standard OBDII codes which trigger a CEL.

If you really want to be in tune with what is going on with your car, make friends with the techs. Most of the service adviser's do not know first hand what was done to your car when it was in the back. They just relay to you what the tech's typed on the RO. Walk back to the shop and make friends....just don't annoy them with excessive questions. Oh and tech's love gifts...a good piece of wisdom if you want them to remember you.

 

Explaining the symptoms and that it's a concern for me is what I did. And they checked it out (to what degree I don't know), didn't see anything, and threw out "maybe it's bad gas. yeah, sounds like bad gas." Which may be true, but it sure sounded like coming up with some kind of an answer when they otherwise have none. I can't blame them for that, though.

My concern is that I'm pushing 42k miles and will be out of warranty in a couple months. Meanwhile, I'm hearing all these similar descriptions and talk of carbon build up (relatively minor, but nice to know), a faulty high pressure fuel pump, and on and on. Makes me a little nervous about wonder if I should drop the fat stack an extended warranty would require ($2.5-3k) while I have the chance.

Best case scenario: I can determine the root cause and it ends up being something manageable like carbon build up.

Worst case scenario(s): I can't determine the cause and am left wondering if my car is going to behave as expected when entering a crowded freeway… or it turns out to be something serious or costly.

What really makes me wonder (and why I'm having trouble accepting the 'bad gas' pacifier) is that I never experienced anything like this until the day after I got my car back from them implementing the cold start fix (which messes with the timing chain tensioner… another possible culprit)… and then it was happening every single day. If I had known it was going to become so intermittent, I would have taken my car back to them right away so they could have experienced it themselves.

 

Well with 42k miles, I can guarantee you that you have carbon buildup. This certainly contributes to the pinging/detonation "superknock" problems that we all have on here. And I know you were asking about removing the intake manifold to check the valves for carbon in another thread...but I can assure you they are covered in crap. You should buy yourself a can of SeaFoam and run it through the PCV/intake...since it's never been done on your car, I'd recommend using the whole can, but do it in 3 separate treatments. You will see a difference. Or you can physically clean the valves, removing the intake mani, using a brush, mirror, solvent (seafoam). Kind of a pain in the ***, especially if you aren't very technical. Mini North Scottsdale will actually do this for you...I forget how much their carbon cleaning retails for...I want to say $199? But they were having so many carbon related issues with cars coming in, that they decided to offer carbon cleaning as a maintenance service. If you can get them to replicate the pinging issues or bring the car in with misfire codes...I think they will do the cleaning under warranty, but don't quote me on that.

My advice, just keep it easy/simple/cheap and buy a can of Seafoam and run it through. I live right behind Mini NS coincidentally, so if you want someone to help you I'd be more than happy to help you do it.

 

Yeah, that's what they charge (same with Tempe… both Penske-owned). I picked up a Bavarian Technic OBD tool to see for myself about this 'superknock' code (and also because I'm way down in Tucson and nearly out of warranty -- want to be able to diagnose issues to some degree in the future). Haven't used it yet, but if something shows up I'll take it up there and see about a carbon cleaning under warranty.

Do you know what they do to clean the intake valves? The Tempe dealership was a little vague about it… mentioned a gas additive and some other stuff, but none of it really sounded specific to the intakes (since gas additives won't reach them).

I thought I read somewhere recently that water will do the job just as well. Just dripping it in (somebody mentioned using a mister or atomizer bottle) through the PCV hose.

 

They remove the intake manifold and do it with a solvent (I think they actually use SeaFoam), a brush, and a tiny mirror. I know some cars were so bad they've had to send the head out for cleaning. (This was only on cars that had misfire issues)

Water will a little bit actually...it essentially steam cleans the motor. But with how bad the crud is on our cars, you'll need a little stronger solvent than water to help loosen and dissolve it.

 

Well, what do you know… super knock.


Fault codes 2D52 (super knock), 2DCC (which cylinder was affected?), and D904 ("K CAN wire error" in the car access system… probably unrelated).

 

Wow thats awesome that it reads the DME codes...I will have to pick up the Bavarian Technic tool myself.

Will it give you anymore info for the faults? I know on the system the techs use, it will give you specific data as to when the fault occurred and what the conditions were.

 

I don't think it gets that fancy. And I was having problems with it being able to spit out real-time numbers and plots of various ECU data while the car was running. It would start, go for a bit, but then hang and not update any more. I'm hoping it's just a bug in the software… it's a lot of money to pay for something that "kind of" works, in my opinion.

EDIT: I see there's an update now for the BT software (was using 1.7.8.0 -- new version is 1.7.8.1)… maybe that will fix the problems I'm having. I do read on other forums that the BT folks are very responsive to support queries, so I'll give them the benefit of the doubt until I get a chance to play with it again.

 

Let us know if it fixes it...

For me though, just being able to read DME codes and clear them is worth it. My car throws them every few months or so (relating to running high boost pressure) and its annoying having to go to the dealer to have them clear it for me.

 

Still haven't had a chance to play with it again… but the BT website has been updated with the new version info:
I'm hopeful.

 

I have the hesitation and puff of smoke too, surprisingly always happen on the same on-ramp while slightly accelerating. Can't be the carbon build-up as I just had that issue 4000 miles ago and the dealership did the treatment. Also don't think it is the gas as I always use Shell / Texaco / Chevron 93 Octane.

So far - I have had to replace the engine mounts, hood scoop, carbon build-up, basically all the issues I have been reading about the 07 MCS has happened to mine.

 

what did they do for "the treatment", and did you get your spark plugs replaced too?

 

Ok. So my r56 did the same thing- I had Mynes tune my car in April and was very hesitant taking the car to the dealer having been remapped. Here's the scoop: mine was a stretched timing chain. This would be fine, but the warranty bulletin which must be followed to the t specifically states that the car must have a software update after a new chain. Yeah- didn't make sense to me either. Either way- this update would wipe out my awesome and expensive tune. (gasp!) Well Tiffany at Motor City Mini argued it to the warranty dept field rep and got them to agree to replace the timing chain without doing the update! All I had to do was sign a release form. And no- I have NOT voided my warranty. Apparently Mini USA loves the fact that us diehard miniacs customize our cars. They're actually researching the local clubs and events and trying to become more involved. I guess they don't want to scare off potential repeat customers.

Update to follow once I get Gromit back. Cross your fingers folks!

 

That same superknock destroyed piston #3 in my car. It rattled and rattled for 5K miles and finally one of the pistons gave up. That happened after Mynes tuned my car also. Since then I went to the dealer and asked to reflash my car with new OEM software....I don't want to deal with these tunes anymore. Now car runs how it's is suppose to, no more boost drop, rattle or hesitation.

 

Anyone else with these symptoms hear this sound on the highway while accelerating? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FHNxO-2LmSw

 

quit membership

 

The superknock fault code (P2d52) is accompanied by one or two other codes in my MCS (usually P2dcc and P2dcd... going off memory here). I believe these indicate the superknock fault occurred in cylinder 3 (P2dcc) and 4 (P2dcd). Coincidentally, these are the cylinders people seem to most frequently report are the worst with carbon buildup on the intake valves.

That doesn't rule out the HPFP, but I think it counts as a point against.

 

quit membership

 

No, the intake valves handle air *and* crankcase fumes recirculated to the combustion chamber via the PCV system. It's this crud that collects on the back of the intake valves in a direct injection engine (where in a traditional engine the fuel and fuel detergent additives would help wash these).