Tks for everyone's insight, my CMS4 will arrive next month, now I am debating to not buy the vehicle. This is a pretty huge problem and MINI have not setup a recall on it yet...hmmm

 

You are assuming there is actually a problem with currently produced cars. In fact it is not at all clear that the clutches that have failed are due to a design problem. Failures could easily be due to a batch of slightly out-of-spec parts and/or assembly errors. 2011 was the first year the cars were built, and the first year the Graz factory assembled Minis. No one other than BMW knows the percentage of cars that have had problems, or if the percentage has decreased for the 2012 model year. I suspect it has based on a cursory reading of the forums and experience with a 2012.

So far we are enjoying our 2012 All4 manual. The three drivers who have driven our car, with a combined experience of 140 years driving manuals, all think the clutch and gearbox work fine. Not a single stall, difficult start, or odor detected by any of us in the first 2600 miles.

 

My 2012 All4 maunal works well for me. I do live in the moutains. Never any issues with stalling or a smelly clutch. A manual AWD will always feel different than a front or rear drive only car.

 

True, but it makes me worry, hopefully my car doesn't have any problems.
I'll find out next month I guess

 

Our CMSA4 is 10 days/ 500 miles old. With all the comments here (and elsewhere) I was very concerned and ready for a fight with Mini on the issue. But thus far I've detected no issues at all. We have some very steep hills in our area, and I purposely tested the clutch with repeated starts on the steepest one I could find, and everything was perfectly normal, and that was with 4 people totalling more than 700 lbs. in the car. I will say the clutch action is far lighter than in our R53. I originally thought it was too light for my liking, but I must say I quickly got used to it. I find it easier to drive smoothly versus the R53, although the R53 has a sportier overall set up. And the throttle mapping is very different too. With all the testing any vehicle manufacturer does, it would be surprising if it's a design issue. I agree that it might very well be a supplier or assembly issue. Unfortunately knowing BMW they will never fess up to what the problem is, and we may never know exactly. I continue to be on the lookout for any clutch issue at all.

 

As an FYI- If your clutch has failed report it to the NHTSA using this link-

https://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/ivoq/

If enough appear it may force BMW to be proactive.

 

Great post Rockland

 

Done. No selection available for All4 model so had to select Countryman S.

 

I am a distributor for 7 clutch companies. I am in communication with 1 now for an aftermarket CLutch Kit to be developed for the CM4S.
These cars are originally equipped with a Dual Mass Flywheel set up. It's a horrible design (I went over this in another post). Upgraded clutch kits convert to a solid mass FW & sprung disc clutch. Available stages range from 1-4. (full face/various materials to 4/6 puck types).
The manufacturer is looking to source a vehicle or damaged parts R&D. The MINI dealer in their area is unresponsive.
If anyone happens to be able to obtain a factory unit, please LMK. MSRP would likely be around $1300 for the conversion kit. They currently have kits avail for the Copper Turbo S models. The CM clutch is larger 228 vs 235mm.

 

Do all CM's use the same clutch?

 

[Autoblog] Long Term Test: 2011 Mini Countryman: June 2012 Update

"While the too-stiff suspension issue is likely an easy enough remedy (order the standard suspension and replace those run-flats), other issues began to pile up pretty quickly. Like the clutch. Perhaps the expected take rate on a manual Countryman was so low that Mini didn't feel the need to do a better job here, but I have never stalled a vehicle so often as I did the Countryman during my first week in it. Between the power-robbing all-wheel-drive system, the lag of the turbocharger and a friction point that's both vague and brief, our Countryman can make even experienced drivers look like 15-year-olds."

 

The manual is the most common CM transmission sold outside the US. Again, this test is an early 2011 model, first year in production. It is untrue for the 2012's that I and others have driven. Still zero stalls with 3 drivers at 3200 miles on our car. A 15 year old could easily learn on this car.

 

Stalling has not been the issue, at least not for us. However, we did experience premature clutch wear and failure. And the issue may not be relegated to just the 2011 model year. I was recently sent a private messages by an owner of a 2012 CM that is also experiencing premature clutch wear. I referenced the article simply because it noted dissatisfaction with the clutch.

I'm happy for you that your clutch has held up and I hope it gives you no trouble through your period of ownership. There are simply too many reported cases to ignore the clutch issue. And the 2012 clutch is the same as the 2011, according to my service advisor. Same part number. No changes. My failed clutch was inspected and determined NOT to be defective, just worn out. At 4965 miles.

 

Wrong.
My 2012 is a complete POS! And I have had three other people try and drive my car, and each one of them stalled it, burned it due to having to drag it to keep it from stalling!!

 

That's strange my 2012 makes me look like a 15 year old learning the clutch all the time. All I have ever owned are manuals and I'm 39 years old. Clutch and e-brake the only things I don't like about my countryman

 

After 9k miles on a 2012 All4,I feel MINI should definitely have done a better job with the clutch feel. IMO it's the worst part of anotherwise brilliant little car. The take up can be tricky, particularly on steep hills and driveways which is likelty why so many are being replaced at such low mileage. In normal driving conditions, I am OK with it, but the other half positively hates it. Mom disliked it too when parents visited for extended period. It's disappointing because the availability of a manual was a big selling point over some nice CPO X3's.

I have never had a clutch replaced even on high mileage cars. Hoping the CM does not break that trend.

 

my biggest dislike of the clutch is the totally vague feel of engagement. I've owned & driven manual cars consistently since 1990. I havent stalled mine yet but will def. be upgrading when it prematurely wears.

 

Yes, but many are diesels which have more torque and therefore don't have the same issues.

 

If by vague you mean the engagement point and rev matching point seem to vary as the car warms up and the uptake is quite brief, then I agree.

 

After having the CM for several weeks, I've learned that the clutch action (taking off after being stopped, especially with the A/C on) seems to be much less of a issue (at least for me) in Sport Mode due to the different throttle mapping, and I now hit the Sport button as soon as I start the car. Maybe the different throttle mapping offsets the turbo lag somewhat? If I don't hit the Sport Button, I found myself occasionally not giving the engine enough gas when starting off and lugging the engine a bit. To a lesser extent, I had the same issue with the R53 when the A/C was on. It just had no power coming off idle with the A/C on (I assume this was because there was no supercharger boost at idle), but since it was a lighter car, overall it was less finicky than the CM. Part of the issue might be that I'm also used to our other car with a stick. It's a Porsche Carrera, and it has such a flat torque band, even at idle, that it's near impossible to stall.

 

Yes, the engagement point is a bit soft & difficult to actual get a feel for.
I'm not sure if i felt a varied point, but I've only had it a few days.
Speaking with an aftermarket clutch manufacturer, (I sent them exploded diagrams of the OEM unit) I've learned that the clutch disc is a very weak design, similar to the earlier Minis. It will flex under load & the DM FW design doesnt help much either.

 

I just came back from another dealer after the clutch failed for the [B]2nd[B] time! The first time was at 25000 miles and now only 3800 miles later again!! Of course they blamed me...by saying this can happen when you don't know how to use a clutch....I have been driving clutches for 40 years and never had a problem...i don't ride it and drive smoothly thru the gears.

The real kicker is the first dealer that repaired it said it wasn't under warranty and made a big deal of getting it approved through a regional manager. Then this dealer that it was towed too, told me that it is covered under warranty for the first time...but they covered it this time. Something is amiss and I believe the actual product installed or made is defective in some way.

Does anyone know who I can write too as I want to find out more info and share with them my experience? Thanks,

 

Previously posted-

As an FYI- If your clutch has failed report it to the NHTSA using this link-

https://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/ivoq/

If enough appear it may force BMW to be proactive.
__________________


I happened to be on vacation this week and ran into 2 CM owners while having ice cream. All three of us agreed that it is a great car- but something is horribly inadequate with the clutch. I think we are just seeing the tip of the iceberg. Need to keep reporting the failures.

 

Had a redo during parallel parking on super steep incline in the City yesterday and got a good whiff of strained clutch. In 30 years of driving a stick and parking San Francisco it's the first time I experience this (the smell, not the redo part...)
Yeah, that can't be good for clutch longevity.

 

I think I saw your car yesterday - it was a coffee color one. I am in SF for work and went running up Telegraph Hill to Coit Tower after work. I kept thinking these hills are so steep I wouldn't want to drive my manual All4 CM here with its weak clutch.