I have a Justa Cooper and don't feel it is slow at all. Zips around pretty well when required and very efficient.

As far as the Golf goes, nice car in its own right, but not for me, except maybe the Golf TDI with the DSG transmission.

If its a choice between R56 MC and the Golf, its the Cooper!!

If its a choice between R56 MC and the Golf TDI with DSG, then well that's a tossup and could go to the TDI!!

 

Very good thing, the old (ZF?) VW automatics were crap.

 

There probably isn't a huge difference in acceleration between your Rabbit and a Cooper auto, but there will be a big difference in ride, handling and cabin space. If you value room and ride more than handling and character, you might be better off with the VW. The Cooper will ride more harshly but be far more rewarding to drive spiritedly!

 

I test drove a 2009 Rabbit (170PS inline 5/2.5L) automatic for my friends. Very much to my surprise, the engine felt weak at low-mid rev and lazy to rev (not an gearbox issue as I am already in manual mode), along with a lot of vibration and industrial grade noise. The power is there on paper but it's difficult to access them in normal driving condition, and really it is NOT FUN .

Get a Cooper or Cooper S!

 

Thank you all so much for your comments! I find them very useful!

I suppose it is hard to compare the Mini to other cars, if only due to its unique handling abilities - or so I hear!

I will remember to use the Sport button, oh Master! And I take this opportunity to leave you with insight that could be of relevance to some of you:

"Size matters not. Look at me. Judge me by my size, do you? Hmm? Hmm. And well you should not. For my ally is the Force, and a powerful ally it is. Life creates it, makes it grow. Its energy surrounds us and binds us. Luminous beings are we, not this crude matter. You must feel the Force around you; here, between you, me, the tree, the rock, everywhere, yes. Even between the land and the ship."

Meaning: Energy is everywhere. We are made of energy (scientifically proven, by the way). And energy can not be created, nor can it be destroyed. Thoughts are also energy. Learn to use the energy that is within you and around you.

Does this means that since I'm made of energy, and if think it strongly enough, the Mini Cooper would feel as fast as light?

 

I've been following your thread and I'm kinda thinking you're playing with us, and that's Ok, we love to share what we believe are our fair opinions and experiences. Good luck in purchasing your next car. VW makes a number of great ones.

 

Yes, the 2007 Rabbit was before the 20 hp increase. So if I find my car peppy and responsive enough for my taste, then maybe the Mini Cooper Hardtop would please me hands down?!

The 2010 GTI is great but could be a tad too expensive for my budget.

 

Thanks! Your input hits home since you were in the VW family before - even if with a different car than the Rabbit.

 

Wow!!! Such great teachers we have here! I will read, and re-read these technical informations a few times over, and I'm sure at some point they will make more sense to me!

 

Another great post. Thank you for this info. As I've said, I will of course make an opinion when I'll actually get the chance to test-drive a Mini Cooper, but I do value Mini enthusiasts' input and experiences they have had with cars, past and present!

 

LOL yes, I speak from experience padawan. That is to say, I drove a Cooper (non-S) for a good 3 days straight as a loaner. In the Cooper, I felt the low HP rating mattered not, due not only to the smaller size and weight of the vehicle, but also due to my feeling of oneness with the for--, I mean, MINI. There is a connectedness there when you're driving a Cooper that is unlike any other driving experience. Power was more than adequate as well, but the Cooper is just so damn tossable it's not even funny.

Seriously, though, I kid you not, and I really do speak from experience. My sister recently took delivery of one of the first 2010 Golf TDIs to hit the States and I had the pleasure of driving it exclusively for 3 days while she was away in MD. Whlie I enjoyed the driving experience and the higher HP, higher torque of the TDI engine, it still felt sluggish to me compared even to the Cooper. The whole experience felt "heavy" to me. There is a "directness" associated with driving a MINI Cooper that no other car can come close to. The closest thing I can think of to the Cooper/MCS is, well, "driving" a Lotus Elise in GT5 Prologue on my now un-borked PS3.

 

You're entitled to your opinion.

 

I had a base cooper loaner for 4 days and loved it. If you put your foot down, it's more than quick enough for everyday driving and gets great mileage if you drive it easy. The ride is also amazing thanks to the 15" wheels and tall tires. The handling was also much better than I expected considering how skinny the tires are. All in all, it's a great commuter car. Compared to a Rabbit, it's so much more refined, I'm sure you won't be disappointed! Only thing I'm not happy with is the styling compared to the S, but that's just me.

 

Torque is rotational force.

This is the force being applied multiplied by the radius of the turning object.

Are your eyes glazing over yet?

If you have a 6-inch wrench and you're trying to loosen a bolt, the torque you're applying to that bolt is the amount of energy you can generate by pulling on the wrench, multiplied by the length of the wrench, which is the radius.

Can't loosen that bolt? A 12-inch wrench will double the torque, even though you pull with the same force. This is because your doubled the radius.

So, in very unscientific terms, torque is the amount of "oomph" being generated by the available power.

 

Adding to that, horsepower is directly based on the amount of torque a given engine generates at peak RPM (I'll spare you the formula or a dissertation). So Torque is actually the more important of the two numbers.

As someone said earlier, what you want is a car where the the torque comes in at low RPMs and continues across a wide rev band.

 

You can also think of horsepower as the amount of energy available, but torque as the amount of energy being delivered.

 

A couple of years ago, I had a great test drive of the 200hp VW GTI (w/ stick shift). Although solid feeling, and a good performer, I felt the extra weight, compared to the 2006 MiniCooperS (s]also w/ stick shift). From the first time a drove a Copper S, it put a smile on my face. The VW was good, but didn't "do it"for me like Cooper did. When my left knee went bad, and I needed and Automatic, I got a '10 CooperS. Still smiling!!

 

I actually drove both (both American versions) before I bought the Cooper. The VW is a very nice smooth car and, at the risk of getting flamed here, I think its probably just a bit faster overall.

But it is a pickup truck compared to the Mini in the corners. To my way of thinking, its a miniature Buick.

I suspect that if you looked at the actual power and torque curves of both cars, you would find them to be very close in the RPM ranges that we all drive in. Let's face it, in traffic we don't spend a lot of time at 6000 RPM, nor do we spend a lot of time at optimum torque RPM in either car. The Volksie is a lot mor "trendy" looking on the inside, and the sound deadening is better as well. But it is not a "driver's car".

If you actually like to drive, buy the Mini. If you are looking for generic transportation, -- heck, you should still buy the Mini cause its just more fun. The fact that you are on this board shows that you are not old enough to be a Volkswagen fan yet. Live a little, and look forward to the drive home (no one who is totally honest actually looks forward to the drive TO work).

And I'd bet that your husband will be trying to take it away from you after the first week. I betcha he will.

 

I've owned many VWs, including 4 GTIs and a Mk4 .:R32. To call any of them "miniature Buicks" is crazy. In fact, in stock form, I'll bet a GTI will absolutely smoke a Mini in any sort of handling contest, with the runflats and crummy stock suspension causing the Mini to be at a huge disadvantage. Upgrade the suspension and lose the runflats, and the game changes completely.

 

I feel way more confident in my MINI with base suspension (and no runflats) than my portly MK V R, but I agree that GTI's are getting a bad rap here. They're a little heavy, but they're a much larger car than a MINI and for the money can't be beat. In stock trim despite what any official numbers say, they're way quicker and handling is great, despite the body roll. It's just a different car and any deficiencies found can be corrected easily in the aftermarket for much less typically than on the MINI. Just my opinion.

 

"I'll bet a GTI will absolutely smoke a Mini"

1. I thought we had established that she was not interested in a GTI.

2. Let's compare apples to apples. The issue was, which might be better, a garden variety VW Rabbit compared to a garden variety Mini. In that context, I stand by my statement, the standard garden variety Rabbit is a Buick compared to a Mini. I'm sure that you will find lots of data to support that, i.e., look at skid pad data which often puts the Rabbit in almost exactly the same category as a Buick. Sorry.

Now if we want to coompare things to the GTI, then lets go get in a stock JCW. I suspect the numbers will still favor the Mini.

 

Handling NUMBER contest (17/18inch summer tire GTI) with a Mini (15 inch wheel)? Let's be fair here.

MCS stock VS VW GTI/VW Scirocco TSI
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2c72J9gLYJA

 

Thank you very much for your post! I actually read it last night, when I came home after test-driving a Mini Cooper, and felt it summarized everything I had just came to realize! I can now honestly say that I relate with a lot of what everyone has been sharing with me on this forum.

Yes I had reservations on the Mini Cooper's engine abilities (non S), simply based on numbers, and also on my own (somewhat limited) experience with cars. However, I was fully aware that a test drive was mandatory to make an informed opinion.

While I was waiting for the salesman to get the car ready, I was in the showroom gushing over the Camden model. It's actually when I saw this car a few weeks back that my curiosity about the Mini was peeked. Sure, I always thought Minis were nice cars, original, infinitely customizable, etc... But I had never considered one before today, for various reasons; one being that 4 years ago, when I got my VW Rabbit, I could not have afforded a Mini Cooper, and moreover, because I probably could not overlook its size.

My test drive was short, but I will go back tomorrow to drive a base and S model back-to-back. But with that said, I was impressed with the base engine – I really was. Did not felt sluggish by any means, and the sports mode did add a very noticeable oomph to the overall performance sensation.

I must say that I was quite lost trying to understand the disposition of the main control buttons, as the ergonomics is like nothing I’ve seen before, but I’m sure I’d get use to it after a while.

I was also wondering if I’d be bothered by the funky interior. I’m sure it’s not for everyone. But the only thing I can say is that after sitting in the Camden for a few minutes, I was like: I could totally see myself getting a kick out of being in this car day in and day out! It just made me smile! And it looked very well-built. I really noticed and appreciated the little touches that, to me, make this car feel luxurious, without being obnoxious about it!

So overall, I got some very good answers to the main interrogations I was having. Ok, I'll admit it... When I drove home in my Rabbit after driving the Mini (even if only for a brief moment), I sort of felt like I was floating on the road. In the Mini, I felt like the car and I were "one", if that makes any sense. Sure, sure, this rambling is probably so obvious for all you Mini owners, but until you experience it for yourself, you can’t truly know what you're missing I suppose. I will still look back fondly on my VW Rabbit, but I suspect that if I drive a Mini for a few years, I'll probably never go back to any "A to B" type of car! I’ll try to take a longer test drive on Saturday, to confirm my first impression, but you may just have a future Mini Cooper owner on your hands!

 

you forgot to insert >IMO< before "10000000000000000000." IMO, I'm glad I don't have the headache of crappy and fragile oem clutches to deal with... IMO.

And what if the OP is disabled, and cannot drive a stick, like a few other MINI automatic owners I've met??

Your comment comes off as crass and completely irrelevant to the original post.

 

Yes, we could say that I've seen the light... @ 7:00 pm on March 4, 2010! ("When you can't make them see the light, make them feel the heat." Ronald Reagan).