Yep. Yep.

Dunno why.

I know I am talking about small differences here but strangely enough, when I first got into the car with the new springs and struts it felt very different.

Then I realized that the seat was pumped up and back from my usual settings.

But even after getting the seat back to the usual settings the car felt higher and considerably smoother. Felt like I was driving a different MINI. I've since acclimated but there is a real difference in the ride. Much smoother over small and moderate bumps and no jarring over bigger stuff like RR tracks (taken at reasonable speed of course). Handling is very good...I believe cornering is slightly improved. I could tell better if I had gone from stock to this set-up but I already had the USS, swaybar, and the H-Sports before this.

Ralph at Miniwerks, where I had them installed, was also surprised the front lowered slightly and he said the H&R were a softer spring.

I was hoping for less drop but will leave it be for a few weeks and see how much it settles before changing anything.

 

Could you tell us exactly what model h&r springs you are using? I might just change in the spring as I would like alittle softer ride than what the hsports are giving me

 

Model 50416-2. Got them from the Tire Rack. H&R has another sping that lowerers more (specs say 1 1/4 " on the Cabrio).

 

Did you still use spacers or bumpstops with the H&R's?

 

This isn't what I expected to hear, so I looked for posts on H&R springs. https://www.northamericanmotoring.co...+coast+Coopers To summarize, with the H&R's on a hardtop it was 7/16" higher in front than with the H-sports (~1/2" drop from stock) and 3/8" higher in the rear (~9/16" net drop). This makes the findings on the cabrio perplexing, since I thought the added bracing/weight is in the rear.

It almost sounds like you were shipped front H&R Sport Springs and rear H&R OE Sport Springs. In the above post the H&R springs were notably taller and measured .525" front/.410" rear on a dial caliper. The shorter H-Sports measured .480" and .440" front/rear.

So if the goal is still to run the FSDs, you might have an issue with your front drop since you're already over 1" and your springs haven't settled. With shorter bumpstops (H-Sports or cut down the stockers) and modest springs (H&R OE Sports? ) the hope is to come close to the ideal stock travel the FSD's were designed for.

 

The bumpstops from the H-Sports were used with the H&R springs. I guess there is a possibility that two different types of springs were shipped, but frankly, I would be very surprised.

Not sure how to explain the drop. Perhaps there is more at work here than simply the added weight. I am not sure how much the suspension set-up was altered in the design of the Cabrio.

I've put on a few hundred more miles with no additional drop. The ride is improved overall and the handling appears as good as with the lower drop. I am undecided where I will now go with this, although I am curious how the ride would be using the stock springs with the FSDs. Unfotunately, I am not set up to change the springs out myself and there is a cost issue involved (including an alignment if I go back to stock).

Perhaps at the next club meet I can check out a cabrio with stock suspension and see how it feels. I really can't remember after all of the changes I have made!

 

So, does using the stock springs with the KONI FSD's still lower the car more than stock or do the springs have to be changed to lower it?

 

I don't think the FSDs will lower it any, just the springs. Of course, I'm not too sure about any of this any more!

 

Lowering springs lower the car, the FSDs do not.

 

DS, you may be right. But I find it troubling that the same brand springs would yield such differences between the two cars at the front. I'm perplexed that the taller front springs with thicker diameter would result in a bigger drop than the shorter/thinner ones with the advertised lower drop. (Again on one car and not the other). Manufacturing flaws/variances? We'll probably never figure it out and I'm not sure what direction to go in now.

But on a positive note, your ride is better and the car performs at least as well as it did with the H-Sports. That's encouraging! BTW, I don't think you'll be happy with stock linear springs again - stance or ride, FSDs or not.

 

Of course you could grab a pair of calipers and check the diameters of the front springs...

 

If I haven't altered my stock suspension by then you can take mine for a ride. I doubt I'll put the FSDs on with the stock springs though as I was hoping to get this all sorted out and done in one shot.

 

Thanks for the offer, I'll take the opportunity.

Just got back from a little motoring, and I can say that there is a definite improvement over rough roads (did a little driving on brick pavement). I'm getting more appreciative of the improvement, my only concern is how things will hold up over a longer period of time.

I done this suspension change, 17% pulley, USS, JCW intake, Milltek exhaust and colder plugs all in the past few weeks. I think it is time to take a break from the mods and just enjoy motoring. Of course, an ipod and DICE for the MINI might be nice for Xmas!

 

I don't know why it didn't turn up when I first searched for H&R's site, but here it is with their approximate drop on a MCS for part# 50416-2 (not OE Sports BTW). http://www.hrsprings.com/site/index.html

Stated drop for a MCS is 1" front, .75" rear - in line with your findings, DS. The .6" front drop mentioned must be for the lighter MC. Anyway, with shorter bumpstops there should be adequate travel for the FSDs.

If your H&R springs settle in well, I'll likely install them with FSDs, H-Sport bumpstops, Ireland Engineering Fixed Camber Plates, H-Sport Comp rear sway bar and links. It's hard to believe I delayed installing my rear bar this long - my 06 MCSC just had its first birthday.

 

Just an update. I was driving on brick streets a lot this past weekend and scraping in the front frequently. In addition, it appears I am bumpstopping more and have developed a nasty squeak and am unsure of the exact location or cause. It occurs on any significant bump and is from the rear.

I have not detected any more drop due to settling.

I will be re-installing the stock springs on Tuesday given my displeasure with the aftermarket springs on the cabrio and chalk this experiment up to experience. If anyone finds some success with thie endeavor, please post. I'd be interested in hearing about other options.

Dave

 

Anybody in here that doesn't have a lower cabrio? I need a quick measurement number from an MCSC running on 17" run flats. Can anybody give me the distance from ground to the bottom of the driver's side mirror.

Thanks, much appreciated...

 

I have that exact set-up and the distance on mine is 34 and 3/4 inches from the ground to the bottom of the drivers side mirror.

 

Thanks robsreef!!

 

Just as a reference...I run 205/16/50 (not runflats) and get 33 1/4 inches for the same measurement with the H&R springs.

 

Dave, thanks for posting your findings and sorry to hear the H&R's didn't work out. I'm looking in a new direction... https://www.northamericanmotoring.co...ad.php?t=84628 I'll likely try Texas Speedwerks' springs after the holidays and post back.

 

Ds, so your wheel/tire combo has a height difference of only 3mm less than 205/45/17. This means that the H&R dropped your car about 1 3/8". Not taking into account any additonal options on the car which adds more weight thus difference in ride height. That's quite a drop on the cabrio...

Here's what I've been working on: After a number of months, Megan racing finally distributed the new front springs for their coilovers. This solved the issue of little to no damper travel up front. Here is the thread for your enjoyment.
https://www.northamericanmotoring.co...t=77257&page=9

The only draw back is that because of the increased rate, the coilovers only provide a max drop of 1 1/8" on the cabrio. I was testing full drop on the coilovers and that's why the need for the measurements. It is much less on the regular cooper due to it's lighter weight. This to me, as an owner of a cabrio, is no issue at all since I don't want to go any lower than 1", and from the reading on this thread, most other cabrio onwers feel the same way. I will add that at full drop I'm crazy low, IMO and for my taste. But it does looks Bad AS*.

I did the install on the new springs a few days ago and I must tell you. It rides absolutely superb. The main reason for going with the megan coils was because it allows ride height adjustment w/o loosing damper travel. It has 2 separate adjustments for these. Now that the issue with the damper travel seems to have been fixed, this is a definite contender for those who want to lower their cabrio.

Now because I've done so many changes with suspension set up, I need an objective assesment of the ride quality. Honestly, I don't remember how the stock set up rode and I'm not about to put the stock set up just to test this. So, is there anybody that owns a cabrio who lives near the north bay area that I could meet up with to test this? I live in Solano County in Fairfield Ca. Napa is really close by as well as Concord, walnut creek etc. or even Sacramento.

I must point out that this set up is not quite track ready for those that are looking for something for track use. Megan is still working on a few tweeks to make it track wrothy.

Any help will be appreciated.

 

Brownflyer,
How would describe the ride "cushiness" as opposed to stock or h sport springs. I originally had FSD's with h sport springs, now I went back to the stock springs, and I am sorry I did so as the springs are alittle firmer and i feel every little bump. Unless a better solution comes along I am going to put FSD's back in in the spring. I am willing to trade some handling for a smoother ride at this point. Any thoughts on your megans?

 

Idoc, here is my take on the "cushinesss" factor or lets call it MCF (Mini Cushiness Factor)... You must keep in mind that this is a very subjective assesment and it is based on and only on my previous experiences (as remembered) to other set ups I've had.

My biggest concern in any system I've looked into has been the retention of damper travel. As has been posted in this thread before, anytime you lower the mini via lowering springs you will loose damper travel and depending on the amount of drop the MCF will suffer accordingly due to the limited damper travel, hence, you will bottom out frequently. Also, the shorter the spring. The higher the rate. This is an issue for most systems including H-sport, H&R, FSD and PSS9. The later will give you ride height adjustability via the spring pretensioning adjustment which has the same effect as reducing damper travel and again MCF will suffer. Notice how I'm trying to throw the MCF word as much as possible... Again, this is all based on and for the MCSC and I'm not refering to any other application.

The change that Megan has done is gone from a 5kg spring up front to an 8kg which is considerably higher rate. In the megan thread, it was sugested that this change had stiffen the suspension significanlty and thus reduced MCF. Here are my findings, the original spring of 5kg was way too soft for the cabrio and therefore too compliant on road imperfections to the point of feeling spongy. Meaning that it would not settle after hitting the imperfection but would oscillate one or two more times before settling. This is due to a mismatch weight to rate ratio (being that the cabrio is heavier than the regular MCS). The new spring is more balanced (in regards to shock absortion capabilities) and a better match for the weight of the Cabrio.

This was the same issues I had felt with the H-sport in addition to significant loss of travel.

For Thanksgiving, I drove down to Sacramento-Elk Grove (about 55 miles from where I live). Mostly freeway but a variety of road surfaces from very good to extremly poor (unfortunately that's my neck of the woods ). The ride felt absolutely controlled. Settling down after the impact and very smooth throughout the entire ride. I did bottom out once but this was not a regular bump but a bump on steroids. As I was approaching the bump, I could see the suspension on cars infront of me compress so I just closed my mouth and prepared for the worst. I felt the bottoming out was not as severe because the spring was able to react almost instantly where as the softer spring would of had me looking for my fillings in the back of my throat.

I did came up to some traffic and had to slow down below 30mph. Interesing suff happened here, because of the higher rate of the spring I was able to feel the road imperfections. Not an uncomfortable jarring feeling, but more like ondulations. This only happened on some freeway surfaces and not on side roads. On the street roads, the ride becomes very compliant and smooth and takes the imperfections extremely well. Also, I went over a couple of water channel overpasses and for whatever reason in this area, they have some long ondulations. The closest I can equate this to would be the kiddie rides where you put $.50 and it rocks back and forth. Again, no roughness, no bottoming out, just that rocking feeling.

If I can put it in other words, before this change of springs I would literally cring at having to take my mini on long trips and running into that unannounced bump that would just have me looking for my eyeballs on the floor boards. This was by far one of the most pleasant top down trips at 60f I've taken w/o having to swerve all over trying to avoid every little imperfection. I was again enjoying motoring and not just observing the road. The MCF is back!!

I have never ridden in a mini with lower springs and FSD, nor do I remember what the stock MCSC feels like. So, I cannot give you an honest comparison other than my personal experiences and thus the call for assitance. My personal tastes and feelings are just that "personal" and I'm sure differ from everyone here. So, just take this as a subjective view of this system until I have done some more adequate comparisons.

Sorry, Idoc, all this for the simple answer of "I don't know"... I suppose I should have started with this first.

 

Idoc,

I am easily confused Are you running stock spings with the FSD's now or with the stock dampers?

Dave

 

Interesting, both Megan and Texas Speedwerks have gone to higher rate springs.