>>>>If placing the speedometer behind the steering wheel is such a burden, then why do so many on this post admit to using their tachometers to gauge their speed? Manufacturers spend a great deal of time and money on driver ergonomics and the center dash mounted speedometer hasn’t achieved wide spread accolades for proper instrument placement. If you want to say the center mounted speedometer is quaint I will buy that. But if you want true nostalgia you better ditch the air conditioning, power windows, locks, cruise, tilt, heated seats, automatic transmission, CD player etc. And while you are at it, inform the manufacturer that you new MINI is lacking in all the squeaks and rattles that were prevalent in the original. The speedometer was mounted in the center on the original Cooper to facilitate building cars for export to left hand drive markets. Center mounted speedometers will never be the norm either now or in the future.
>>>>
>>
>>Wow. Why do you even have a MINI? If placing the speedometer in the center is so "wrong," why do so many of us love it there? Did you get the navigation system just to have the speedo in the normal location?
>>
>>You can have your personal preferences, but to make sweeping statements (e.g. the speedo belongs behind the steering wheel) seems a bit arrogant. I guess the MINI needs a trunk, right? If we wanted normal, we wouldn't be here. There's something about an impractical and abnormal car that appeals to us. Otherwise, we wouldn't have bought $20,000 go-karts. Here's a site that should appeal to you: http://forums.clubfocus.net/
>>
>>
Yes, as a matter of fact I did get the Nav so as to get the speedo placed in front of the driver, or as you say the "normal location", inferring that the center location is abnormal. I never said that the center placement was “wrong”, only that the manufacturers didn’t mount it there for a reason, ergonomics and I’m sure focus groups. When all the other manufacturers start placing their speedos in the center of the dash then I guess I will be proved wrong. Until then, the speedo placement on the MC is merely a quaint idea that does have its charm. Name for me just two other automobile models in current production for sale in the US that have their speedo in the center of the dash. If you like it there, fine. I don’t. And as to why I got a MINI? The fun factor. If I could not have gotten the speedo in front of the driver that would not have stopped me from buying a MCS, but I’m glad I had the choice.
_________________
2003 MINI Cooper S, Chili Red/white top & wheels, black leather, anthracite dash, Cold Weather Pack, Sport Pack, DVD based Navigation system w/OBC, PDC, HK, MFSW, sensing wipers & auto dim mirror.

 

>>If locating the speedometer in the middle of the dash is such a great idea, why don’t all the automobile manufacturers locate their speedometers there?

Some mfgrs are starting to do this. Keep your eyes open on the new cars coming out soon!

 

Jerry, I don't know of current production cars that have the speedo in the correct, center position - 'cause I don't look that closely at other cars (i guess ...)
... but there have been a number of sporty cars in the past that did that: an Alfa from the seventies (Alfetta GT?) did the race-car-thing of putting the tach dirrectly in front of the driver and relegated the speedo to the side(center) of the dash.

... and, has been mentioned, the original speedo position was for right of left hand drive cars - but No original Mini (even the 'S') had a tach at att - they were all installed by their owners ...

 

>>>>If locating the speedometer in the middle of the dash is such a great idea, why don’t all the automobile manufacturers locate their speedometers there?
>>
>>Some mfgrs are starting to do this. Keep your eyes open on the new cars coming out soon!

Let’s see if the center mounted speedo stands the test of time. I think it is just a passing trend that will soon run its course. If it is the norm in say ten years then you have proved me wrong. Like I have said, it is quaint and if you like there I’m happy for you. That being say, I like the speedo in its traditional location.

 

>>
>>Let’s see if the center mounted speedo stands the test of time. I think it is just a passing trend that will soon run its course. If it is the norm in say ten years then you have proved me wrong. Like I have said, it is quaint and if you like there I’m happy for you. That being say, I like the speedo in its traditional location.

Traditional location? not only did the Mini and Morris Minor have it in the middle, but I think even American cars did too .... was it the Ford 'T' or 'A'?
... and 'test of time' is kinda relative - but Minors were built from '49 to '71 and Mini's from '59 to 2000 ... that's a lot of time for a 'fad' ...

 

Quaint, unusual, non-standard, all true. Just one more reason I like my MINI's interior so much more than any other affordable (and most un-affordable) cars. I find that seeing the tach first does keep me more in touch w/ what the car is up to. Just a thought, perhaps a bit of a benefit to the placement after all.

 

>>>>
>>>>Let’s see if the center mounted speedo stands the test of time. I think it is just a passing trend that will soon run its course. If it is the norm in say ten years then you have proved me wrong. Like I have said, it is quaint and if you like there I’m happy for you. That being say, I like the speedo in its traditional location.
>>
>>Traditional location? not only did the Mini and Morris Minor have it in the middle, but I think even American cars did too .... was it the Ford 'T' or 'A'?
>>... and 'test of time' is kinda relative - but Minors were built from '49 to '71 and Mini's from '59 to 2000 ... that's a lot of time for a 'fad' ...
>>
I don’t understand the animosity in all your tones for my not liking the center mounted speedo. Is it main stream? No. Is it a “retro” look? Yes. Is it quaint? Yes. To say that the Model “A’ had it located there; they didn’t even have hydraulic brakes yet. Should we go back to cable actuated brakes for “nostalgia” purposes? All I am saying is that the center mounted speedo is quaint and “retro” but I don’t feel it will ever be main stream. I’m glad that the MINI offered me an option.

 

The Toyota Echo also has a center speedo.

If MINI stops making the center speedo, I'd probably get a Miata next time around. I have no problem if they offer a choice, but not having at least the option of the center speedo would be akin to only offering CVTs. Power to the people!

As a side, has the MINI received any widespread praise for the tiny boot? It sounds like a passing fad to me! I think the 2006 MINI will be at least 2 feet longer. And the contrasting roof must go! It has no ergonomic value!

 

Sorry, Jerry, ... no 'animosity' ... but i thought you asked the question about other examples ... just trying to provide a little historical perspective ....

... so go have fun and Motor for awhile ... and ignore the Speedo! ( i would but i'm stuck in the office today ...)

 

>> That being say, I like the speedo in its traditional location.

Being that the Morris Mini was the first FWD car that earned popular approval, and that it had its speedo centrally located, doesn't that make that the tradition location for a speedo in a FWD car, yes?

 

>>All I am saying is that the center mounted speedo is quaint and “retro” but I don’t feel it will ever be main stream. I’m glad that the MINI offered me an option.

Man, the MINI itself will never be main stream! Most people want their cars to have trunks!

I'm glad that you were able to get your MINI the way you wanted it. I don't think we have a problem with the fact that you don't like the center speedo. It's the way you call it "quaint" and a "fad" that bothers me, at least. It's almost like you're calling the MINI itself a fad. The MINI will stand the test of time just fine. It will never sell as well as the Focus, but who wants to be seen in a Ford, anyway?!

 

>>Is that where it "belongs"?

It seriously only takes a day or two to get used to it. Within a few weeks when you're in a different car, you'll be glancing at the center of the dash looking for the speedo and at the ceiling looking for the time!!!!

 

I like the center speedo, or I should say I don't mind it. It took me a day to get used to it.

I definitely like the tach right behind the wheel, and as big as it can be fit there. To me, often times the tach is more important than the speedo. I do like the cool and classic mini looks of the center speedo.

All that said, I do have a suggestion for MINI division:

The OBC is IMHO largely useless, except for the outside temp. The mpg, and range figures are so inaccurate as to be useless.

The cruise control is ok, but not nearly as well adjusted as in my former suby. One feature of cruise contrl I really miss from my suby, is the up/down (or +/-) buttons by means of which in the suby one could click the set speed up/down in 1/2 mph increments.

Here's my suggestion for MINI:

modify Cruise Control and OBC, to:

1) Display actual (as in current) speed digitally in the OBC panel of the tach - at least as one of the selectable display parameters in addition to the current ones (temp, mpg, avg speed, range). If you want to go really fancy, make this digitally displayed speed adjustable by a correction factor to deal with the speedo reading low as frequently posted.

2) when pressing set, or +/- buttons on cruise control, briefly display the SET speed for cruise control, and allow for 1/2 or 1 mph increments in SET speed to be selected by +/- buttons.

Any thoughts by y'all on this idea?
IMHO this would make the OBC much more useful.

Cheers,
Markus

 

>>>>All I am saying is that the center mounted speedo is quaint and “retro” but I don’t feel it will ever be main stream. I’m glad that the MINI offered me an option.
>>
>>Man, the MINI itself will never be main stream! Most people want their cars to have trunks!
>>
>>I'm glad that you were able to get your MINI the way you wanted it. I don't think we have a problem with the fact that you don't like the center speedo. It's the way you call it "quaint" and a "fad" that bothers me, at least. It's almost like you're calling the MINI itself a fad. The MINI will stand the test of time just fine. It will never sell as well as the Focus, but who wants to be seen in a Ford, anyway?!
I don’t remember using the word “fad”. I used the word “trend”. There is a difference. According to Webster’s New World Dictionary, Third College Edition, trend is “a vogue, or current style, as in fashions”. Fad is “a custom, style, etc. that many people are interested in for a short time: passing fashion, craze”. So please, don’t misquote me. And as for the use of the word “quaint”. Again from the above referenced dictionary, does “clever or skilled”, or “wrought with skill”, or “ingenious, and unusual or old-fashioned in a pleasing way” offend you? I bought my MCS for all those “quaint” reasons and more. And as for most people wanting their cars to have trunks, I guess that's why the mini-van and SUV never caught on.

_________________
2003 MINI Cooper S, Chili Red/white top & wheels, black leather, anthracite dash, Cold Weather Pack, Sport Pack, DVD based Navigation system w/OBC, PDC, HK, MFSW, sensing wipers & auto dim mirror.

 

oh gosh, i am so sorry for the misunderstanding!

i had no idea there was that big a difference between a "fad" and a "passing trend." i definitely won't make that mistake again! :smile:

 

>>>>>>I never said that the center placement was “wrong”, only that the manufacturers didn’t mount it there for a reason, ergonomics and I’m sure focus groups. When all the other manufacturers start placing their speedos in the center of the dash then I guess I will be proved wrong.

Does this mean that people actually preferred the horrific interiors available in every domestic car basically until Ford and Chrysler began to copy their Japanese subsidiaries? Knowing the Detroit mindset, they decided what we would like and rammed it down the public's collective throat until people became used to it. The rest of us broke ranks and bought metric toolsets.

 

Glad I could help. :smile:

 

>> And as for most people wanting their cars to have trunks, I guess that's why the mini-van and SUV never caught on.

Wow, you're really into semantics, aren't you!?

This is from edmunds.com :

2003 Mercedes-Benz ML 320
Luggage Capacity: 34.7 cubic feet
Maximum Cargo Capacity: 81 cubic feet

2003 Ford Focus SVT 2dr Hatchback
Luggage Capacity: 18.6 cubic feet
Maximum Cargo Capacity: 43 cubic feet

2003 MINI Cooper
Luggage Capacity: 5.3 cubic feet
Maximum Cargo Capacity: 24 cubic feet

Why do I have the feeling that you knew what I meant?

 

>>>>>>>>I never said that the center placement was “wrong”, only that the manufacturers didn’t mount it there for a reason, ergonomics and I’m sure focus groups. When all the other manufacturers start placing their speedos in the center of the dash then I guess I will be proved wrong.
>>
>>Does this mean that people actually preferred the horrific interiors available in every domestic car basically until Ford and Chrysler began to copy their Japanese subsidiaries? Knowing the Detroit mindset, they decided what we would like and rammed it down the public's collective throat until people became used to it. The rest of us broke ranks and bought metric toolsets.
>>


I don’t think it was the “horrific interiors” that got Ford and Chrysler to start to emulate the Japanese and Europeans for that matter. It was pure economics, they were losing market share. The Japanese and Europeans were offering a higher quality product than was currently being offered by domestic manufacturers.







_________________
2003 MINI Cooper S, Chili Red/white top & wheels, black leather, anthracite dash, Cold Weather Pack, Sport Pack, DVD based Navigation system w/OBC, PDC, HK, MFSW, sensing wipers & auto dim mirror.

 

>>>> And as for most people wanting their cars to have trunks, I guess that's why the mini-van and SUV never caught on.
>>
>>Wow, you're really into semantics, aren't you!?
>>
>>This is from edmunds.com :
>>
>>2003 Mercedes-Benz ML 320
>>Luggage Capacity: 34.7 cubic feet
>>Maximum Cargo Capacity: 81 cubic feet
>>
>>2003 Ford Focus SVT 2dr Hatchback
>>Luggage Capacity: 18.6 cubic feet
>>Maximum Cargo Capacity: 43 cubic feet
>>
>>2003 MINI Cooper
>>Luggage Capacity: 5.3 cubic feet
>>Maximum Cargo Capacity: 24 cubic feet
>>
>>Why do I have the feeling that you knew what I meant?

Yes, I am into the meaning of words and I try to weigh my words carefully before using them.

 

>>Yes, I am into the meaning of words and I try to weigh my words carefully before using them.

You weigh your words!? Cool!! Do you use metric or imperial units?

Haha, just kidding! I say we call a truce.


_________________
2003 MCS (EB/W) w/white stripes, Sport & Cold Packages, Sensing Wipers & Auto Dim Mirror, Magnesium Door Casing, Space Cloth Seats, Park Distance Control

 

Being 6'4" the MINI speedo is the first one I've been able to use comfortably. Official 'propaganda' has the central speedo decision on the original Mini being based on access to it by a navigator, if I recall correctly.

Love it, wouldn't change it!

js

 

>>>>Yes, I am into the meaning of words and I try to weigh my words carefully before using them.
>>
>>You weigh your words!? Cool!! Do you use metric or imperial units?
>>
>>Haha, just kidding! I say we call a truce.
>> :smile:

_________________
2003 MINI Cooper S, Chili Red/white top & wheels, black leather, anthracite dash, Cold Weather Pack, Sport Pack, DVD based Navigation system w/OBC, PDC, HK, MFSW, sensing wipers & auto dim mirror.

 

>>Being 6'4" the MINI speedo is the first one I've been able to use comfortably. Official 'propaganda' has the central speedo decision on the original Mini being based on access to it by a navigator, if I recall correctly.
>>

... forget the 'navigator' stuff .... it was solely for manufacturing reasons: they could make right and left-hand drive cars without changing more than the steering gear (ok ... and brake cylinders and stuff ...)
Alec Issigonas was actually appaled that his "peoples' car" creation was being sported-up and used for racing (... at first...)

 

>>At any point, enjoy your MCS. Regardless of where you mount the speedo it’s still a car that wants to put a smile on your face! :smile:

AMEN to that!