I agree

 

You keep wasting time and energy putting together a letter that WILL NOT RESOLVE YOUR ISSUES ALONE. You need to contact a Lemon Law attorney to handle your case and do the whole enchilada properly if you are to expect favorable results.

Sorry dude, but the way to handle product defects in a $25K+ automobile is very different from your garden variety $1,500 laptop computer at Best Buy.

 

I disagree with not sending the letter. I think it is a very powerful tool especially in the electronic age in which people don't take the time to write anymore.

My father was big into writing letters to heads of companies and it worked everytime!

He sent a letter to the head of Sony in Japan about a bad receiver that was out of warranty. About 6 weeks later he received a call from the assitant to the head in Japan! they gave him the information of where to send it and they took care of everything.

A similar situation happened with a camera company that he sent a letter to. Again they fixed his issues well out of warranty!

I think it is a prudent measure to send the letter. Give them the benefit of the doubt to try and fix the problems. Then you can start the legal process.

Starting the legal process now will only make it more costly and take more time than may be needed.

Good luck!

 

I did notice that you neglected to include anybody from Crown in your CC's. In my opinion, they are at fault here as well.

Besides from my experience with Jim Bartanowicz, including him as an CC isn't worth the effort it took to spell his name correctly. And that opinion is from speaking with him in person...

 

That approach may work with cameras, TVs and toasters but not with cars. Car manufacturers could care less about complaint letters and that is if the letters ever reach the intended recepients, which often do not.

This is why there are established procedures to deal with defective vehicles and that include BBB arbitration and state lemon laws. If you can't resolve your problems with the service manager and dealership owner and on top of it all they tell you your car is "unfixable" then pretty much the car manufacturer is 1)Not willing to address/resolve the complaints 2)Is in breach of manufacturer warranty contract.

Howard can send all the letters he wants to BMW corporate and I guarantee you he will never get a reply and if he does, they'll give him a $200 accessory certificate for all "his troubles".

The picture and outcome changes radically when you bring a lemon law attorney on board. These individuals are trained and are knowledgeable on the laws and how to deal with car manufacturers because this is what they do day in and day out. We consumers seldom if ever have to deal with a defective new car.

I think most people are not acquinted with the laws and how to proceed against a car manufacturer when a vehicle proves to have a defect that substantially impairs its value and safety.

Let the Lemon Law attorney wirte the letters that need to be including in the process of lemon law claim, but if you are taking up on this task "Solo" and without the required knowledge, you will soon hit a tall brick wall.

Often Lemon Law attorney first consultations are free when they review your case. If you meet all the requirements of your state's lemon laws then he can proceed, if not he will tell you before wasting time and money. There is nothing to lose by seeking legal counsel.

Is this soo hard to understand?

 

MINI is one of the better car companies out there, but when it comes to the handling of defective vehicles (Repurchase/Replacement settlements) They pretty much operate like any other car manufacturer.

Automarkers have very powerful and savvy attorneys working for them because they are in the business of making money, first and foremost, and they'll do everything they can to "scare" away any complaints regarding a defective vehicle of thiers.

 

Also, most car manufacturers cringe at the idea of having thier cars titled as "Lemons", hence they will try to settle with you outside of Lemon Law proceedings to avoid such label affixed to one of thier products.

This is why hiring a lemon law attorney can get you where you want to go quicker than by going "solo" at it.

 

CustomAV is correct. These days most people send an email and it gets deleted. Most companies figure if you took time to write a letter and actually mail it, your not ..... around. For instance my last car was a Pontiac. I built it on line and it said 2 years free onstar, but when I purchased it they said only one year. After numerous calls and emails to Pontiac with unacceptable answers, I sent a 3 page letter to the CEo, VP Pres, and a few other important people at GM. Needless to say they couldn't give me my year free of onstar which really was only worth 200 bucks but they gave me a year free of scheduled maintence which Im sure was worth a lot more then 200 bucks. As well as I had multiple people call to apologize to me.

Howard

 

GM? LOL!

Look, GM has what they call "Business Call Centers" (I have dealt with them many times before) and basically they have people in place trained to "get rid of" pesky customers that won't go away. Trust me the "Free year of maintenance" wasn't because Richard Wagooner GM's CEO saw your letter and he felt bad for you. Those letters that you sent to Renaissance Center in Detroit (GM's headquarters) were never received by the intended recepients and probably were tossed away in a remote room somewhere in thier corporate complex. They gave you that "perk" because a "Customer retention specialist" saw one of your long letters and decided that in order to get rid of you a frebbie like that will be enough bone to chew on.

Car executives don't read letters from disgruntled customers and much less have the time and willingness to do so. Your efforts and intentions are commendable and noble, no doubt about that, but to TRULY believe that the way to seek relief for a defective vehicle is to write a 20 page letter by yourself, well that is simply wishful thinking.

I really symphatize with you and your problems, because I would also be pissed off if after dumping $30K on a new auto, I am faced with quality problems in the vehicle and abysmal service from the dealer(s).

It is up to you if you choose the hard way or the proper way to seek satisfaction to your problems. May be you need to hit a brick wall, so you can come back to reality. I hope that is not the case.

Signing off.

 

A year of "free maintenance" in GM speak is basically a card with 12-15 little GM Goodwrench stickers for free oil changes. That perk costs them nothing, that's why they gave it to you.

Don't get me started on GM as I have pleeeeenty of experience dealing with them

 

I have read this thread with great interest as I too had problems with MINI and was able to resolve them via letter writing. Of course, this process was long and drawn out as most automakers will hope you will give up somewhere in the process or capitulate with the thought of some freebies.

One thing to remember is to send the letter Via Certified Mail with Return Receipt and included that in the line between the address and salutation. Your return receipt will serve as proof that the letter was received.

I'm not sure about what action you will get writing the letter to Mr. Purves, but as others have said, he will never see the letter. However, you will get a response from some underling stating they are sorry for your troubles with the MINI... They will then tell you they have contacted the MINI Regional Manager of your area who will get in touch with you.

This is the beginning of the negotiation process with MINI. You will end up going back and forth with the MINI RM and Dealership Service Manager where they will ask you to bring in your car to be evaluated. Don't forget this will also count as a dealer visit regarding repair of the problem and will also add to your out of service days, so get a R.O. when you take the car in!

From there they will again apologize for the inconvenience and say they will make it right by you and offer you a certificate for accessories. They are hoping it will end there as it is costly for the MINI RM to fly out to your dealer to meet with you. You just have to keep pushing it and never give up.

One of my friends was ready to give up after getting the run around for 4 months regarding her car. I told her she must come up with a plan of action and stick with it as this is similar to waging war. You must learn all you can about your enemy, especially their weaknesses.

She felt she wasn't getting her side of the story heard by the dealership GM, so I got her the home addresses of the GM and the company directors. She never took it this far.

However, all companies do not like bad publicity as that can spread like wildfire! My friend being computer savvy found out that lots of URLs with derogatory MINI names were already owned by BMW AG via a WHOIS query. Brainstorming commenced and www.MINI-Pooper.com was born. At first it took a long time to do the research and get it sorted, but once it was operational, the dealership took notice! Just by checking the IPs and doing research on them revealed that the local dealer and MINIUSA was viewing the website and keeping track of events. Things still did not progress fast enough, so one had to take advantage of every opportunity available. It just so happened that Motor Trend's International Auto Show was coming to town as were MINI execs. The next step was to make lots of bumper stickers for the site and to distribute them. The MINI execs caught wind of the bumper stickers just before the Auto Show and the rest is history.

Another resource is NAM itself as Mark has developed a relationship with MINI USA during the whole MINI.com changeover to NAM.

We must all fight our battles, but only you can decide how far to take it. As for my friend, she felt it was worth it.

 

I can't imagine any logical reason not to send the letter. Also, the $49 dollar progamming may seem minor compared to the other problems but please don't pay for programming. If the dealer did not mention programming when you picked up the car then you are owed this free of charge. My dealer gave me the "you should have had it done at pickup excuse" also. To paraphrase what I said, "this isn't satisfactory". They immediately did the programming and have done re-programming, (that they, of course, didn't have to), free since then.

Nice is good but be very firm and definitive, they generally understand much better then.

I'd try to get my money back for the alarm, which isn't needed. Of course, if the car did get stolen, that'd solve the problem.:smile:

 

sorry to hear about the leaking problem you have with your car. I guess I'm just lucky enough to decide not to get the CVT/Auto that my dad wanted me to get. It just rains way too much in my area and I guess it's to my best interest to simply get a hatchback mini.:smile:

 

5 Copies of my letter went out yeserday. 1 the General Manager of BMW/Mini of Sterling. 1 to the general Manager of Crown Mini of Richmond. 1 to the BMW/Mini of Sterling Service Manager. 1 to The CEO of BMW North America and 1 to the President of Mini USA. Will see what happens. I had a call on Thursday from Mini of Sterling from their customer service manager basically telling me, I need to get Richmond involved as most of my issues are their problems. I stated if you all can't fix the leak what makes you think they can. He didn't seem to have an answer for that. I did call the service manager for richmond on Friday, but like calls to Sterling I ended up with a voicemail and no return call.

Howard

 

When talking to the Service Manager, did you suggest replacing the top, instead of him looking in the "what to do" guide and not immediately seeing anything and crying he "can't" do anything. Sometimes, no matter how much they hate it, but you have to do their job for them. I've had to do this many times for the SM at MCM; basically tell him what to replace because him and his monkeys can't figure it out on their own.

I'm sure you've heard that saying: "If you want something done [right], you have to do it yourself"

 

With customer service and repair issues you need to have more than one strategy, this goes for unresolved complaints for all consumer goods:

1. Write, write, write. Send each letter with a proof of delivery receipt. Everyone is correct, your letter will probably not reach a member of BMW/MINI leadership in a timely fashion, nor will they give it the weight you would like unless there are a certain percentage of customers writing in about the same issue.

2. Document every call and conversation. If you have a phone or in person conversation get the name and title of the person you spoke with, document the date and time of the interaction. Most state lemon laws will need this information to determine if you have a viable case for arbitration or a lawsuit. It also shows what you went through to have your issue resolved.

3. Contact your state's attorney general, the Better Business Bureau and your local consumer affairs editors for the news channels and local papers. Send them copies of your letters and documentation.

4. Take pictures. You need to have a visual record of the damage to your vehicle.

5.Be consistent and persistent. The squeaky wheel does get the grease when it comes to resolving complaints. The mishandling of a problem isn't out of malice. It's about attention fatique and it's about cost. If companies did the right thing all of the time based on the customer's perception they would go out of business. Make sure you have the facts you need about the problem. Be well organized and don't quit until you have an equitable resolution.

Letters do not have to be spelled perfectly, there is no perfect length, format or syntax. Make the effort to be clearly understood. Best not to write a complaint letter in the heat of the moment. Most customer service organizations are not allowed to dismiss your legitimate complaint simply because there are spelling and/or grammatical errors.

What counts is the reasonableness of your request, that you express that the situation is intolerable to you and that there is clear indication (documented) that you have tried to resolve the issue by all reasonable means and are willing to take whatever action will bring about the best resolution.

Note: Foul language, bullying and threatening will make it harder to get resolution but should not preclude it if you have a documented case. Coming across as rational rather than alarmist will help customer service help you. Generally you don't want to be "yelling"at the person who can help you.

Using this format I have never had an issue go unresolved, not a big one or a small one.

You always hope that a manufacturer will do the right thing when it comes to a complication with a product. Customer service is the defining difference when it comes to choosing a product or service. As a new brand I hope BMW/MINI pays close attention to service issues as an overall poor service record will be the death knell of the brand if a larger percentage of MINI customers log in complaints about the disinterested service provided by the dealerships.

 

I agree with all you had to say with the exception of those two points. Spelling does count. No matter what you want all of your communications to be accurate and professional, sending a letter with spelling or grammer errors will definately have an impact on how serious they take your letter. ALWAYS proofread your letter and make sure the spelling and grammer are both correct!

Foul language, documented or not should NEVER be used by the customer/complaintant. There's no easier way to get the company you're trying to work with to shut down on you than to start cussing at them. Avoid it like the plague.

 

I amended my advice to take your concerns into account. I disagree about how seriously a letter is taken because it is not perfect. Money spent and publicity are the defining factors over grammar. If I have a customer who has purchased two cars from me and who has access to media to advertise his complaint that is going to compell my attention. That is not the way it should be, but that's the way it is.

Namaste.

 

It's simple, which statement says more to you:

Statement 1: I have put 30,000 miles on my car and have only had one serious problem. Thankfully it was fixed quickly and hasn't returned.

or...

Statement 2: I've gots lot miles on my ride. It's broked once but I got it fix.

Granted that's an exageration, but which of those two statements are going to have more of an effect on you? Who are your going to take more seriously, the writer of statement 1 or the writer of statement 2?

Read any letter coming from a lawyer, there's a reason they sound so professional...

 

I'd get it down to an opening and closing paragraph, and two or three paragraphs of substance, each dealing with a specific problem. I'd even put a header on each: Disappointing Dealership Service, Unacceptable Product Quality, Suggested Remedy.

A roof that leaks is just plain unacceptable and should be covered under your warranty, you don't need pages of text to make the point. A fact-based letter is more likely to get attention and respect than one that rants. You might note in the closing paragraph that your next step will be to contact an attorney and/or your state's consumer/automotive watchdog agency, assuming that you're ready to go the next step.

Good luck! :smile:

 

I don't know about Virginia, but where I live, your problem will be a case for a car to be Lemoned. It not only has to do with safety issue but if it causes you lose significant value because of the problem, then you can start the lemon procedure. I have done it. It takes a number of attempts to fix and a lot of paper to be filled out and procedures followed..
I had a 2002 Mini S and it was taken back by MINI in 2004, because of a Cut in a leather seat that they didn't repair after a number of attempts.
So, yes. If you want to make a case out and you are disatified just follow the rules in your state. Don't need a lawyer if you can read and follow the rules.

 

The lemon Law program falls under the State Attorney Generals jurisdiction
Consumer rights are one of his primary duties. You need to go to the website of your State Attorney General and do a little reading to educate yourself! So you will be better prepared, informed, and able to defend yourself if a situation like this ever occurs to you.

 

Was there ever a resolution?

 

Yeah..really. What happened here?

 

Yeh, c'mon! After all this hullabuloo, please have the sensitivity to let us know what you decided to do and how it played or is still playing out.

I settled a Lemon Law suit with BMW regarding the 'stumble' I had for the first thirteen months I had my Mini. The lawyer told me not to write any letters. He asked me to send him documented evidence that I had tried to have the problem fixed at least three or more times (the more the better) and that he would then write a letter to BMW himself. I let them do the work.

Even though the 'stumble' was eventually fixed, the attourney was still able to negotiate a $$$$ settlement for the aggravation caused during the period of time I had to live with it. Also, my situation involved what was considered to be a safety issue.
Anyhow, what's goin' on?