My wife's Saab 9-3 lease is ending in 30 days so we've spent the last 2 days test driving a number of cars.

GTI (5 door) w/ DSG
Jetta GLI w/ DGS
Jetta 2.5
A3 w/ DSG
9-3
9-3 Aero
Legacy GT

I'm really, really, impressed with the DSG. I wish my MINI had DSG! My favorite cars so far are the A3 and the GLI. The 5 door GTI was nice but the pumped up exhaust note would probably start to bother me after a few weeks.

Strangely I'm a little disappointed in the Legacy GT - I was expecting to really like car.

And the Saab... It's fast and turbo is great but its fit and finish is abysmal.

I'd really appreciate any insight, experience, or comments on these cars. I'm especially interested in general A3 and Jetta comments.

Thanks, Paul

 

I too will be in the market for a sedan in the next few months and I have looked around some and here are my experiences and thoughts.

I have looked closely at the VW products and I like them. But the quality issues of VW concern me.

I have an 2003 A4 that my GF drives and this thing has been in the shop many times for stupid little problems like with the windows, or there was an oil sludge problem and currently an ignition cylinder problem. There have been many other problems, too many to remember. Each time everything has been covered by the warranty, but it gets to be a pain in the neck to have to bring it in every couple of months or so.

I have only had my MINI for a year and a half but have not had it in for anything other than regular service (which was just once so far).

When I replace one of my other cars, it will probably be a BMW 3 or 5 series. But I do frequently change my mind so I am not 100% sure yet.

I don't know much about Saab. I took a quick look once and something left me unimpressed. The interior or something.

The Subaru had the same affect on me.

I did kind of like the Infiniti G35 but I don't know. I have not looked at the Acuras but feel I should. Lexus sedans are as ugly as the Toyotas in my opinion.

Each time I look at a sedans it seems that no matter what I look at the money is the same or close to 3 series and I have tended to like the 3 series better than all the others. But I know a lot of people don't like the new 3 series.

The BMW dealer near me also sells VW. I keep looking and am impressed with the GLI and GTI and I like the cost. Someone needs to convince me that quality is not a major issue.

All in all, I have no idea. Glad I could be so helpful.

 

A3 DSG for the wife, perfecto

 

Have you thought about the E46 3series? Those things are pretty classy and sporty. Compare to the new E90 which is but* ugly! I think the E46 are really good sedans, I have driven the 325i before. It's a really nice car, really good finish for the interior (not as pretty as say an Audi tho), powerful engine good enough for everyday.

The A3 DSG is nice too~ I was just trying to give you another choice with the E46~

 

I love the A3 ....seems perfect....my only concern is the Audi resale.... I have friend very stuck in a "allroad" if you are like me and keep vehicles it doesn't matter..(I drove the the new FJ Cruiser hmmm)

 

We've owned a manual 2.0 A3 since May '05 and although there have been some issues with the engine warning light and the audio system, overall it's been a blast to drive.

The engine light problem came down to the fact that the car should be re-fueled before the low fuel light comes on...seems stupid to me, but we have followed their suggestion and the engine light has remained off.

The sound system problem is recent...FM frequency will suddenly jump like an errant scan and some CD skipping has also appeared. All that has suddenly stopped, so nothing can be done unless it starts doing it again.

My wife had been reading up on the A3 a year prior to it's US introduction, so once the 2.0 hit, she didn't have the patience to wait for the 3.2 AWD...we may look into that soon as a replacement.

...and I drove the FJ Cruiser too...too big in all the wrong places.

 

The Jetta GLI w/ DGS would strongly appeal to me but I haven't heard anything good or bad about VW quality lately. I always enjoyed our 2001.5 Passat 1.8 turbo.

 

Thanks for the comments!

Electric Shock - We're on the same page. I hope your GF trades that A4 before the warranty expires

My brother recently traded his A4 quatro for a TSX because he was having to take the A4 in every other week for problems raging from electrical to mechanical. Speaking of the TSX, we're not going to considering it. It's too sedate imho.

About the E46. We did take an 2004 325i and an 2005 X3 out for some spirited driving the same day we drove the others. Fit and finish, quality, etc, all were really nice. But we both got out of those cars wanting more. I actually think I liked the X3 more than the 325i. It's hard for me to pin down, but the 325i reminded me of the Legacy GT.

I asked the VW sales person about the past quality issues. His response was that those problems have been corrected and that VW has spent $90M in improvements at their Puebla plant.

One last car - we also drove a S40 T5. Nice and quick, but the Volvo lacks as standard options many things the others cars have. They also don't include scheduled maintenance (neither does VW, but that's expected).

 

those are all nice choices. i kinda prefer the Legacy over the other
ones you listed since i already own one and very happy with it. it's a
very smooth riding car. the only downside is the steering wheel shape.
i don't like the design.... the circle in the middle...humm... they feel
nice though since i believe MOMO OE's them.

the GTi 5 door or A3 would be next.

9-3's are nice but its design is getting real outdated now... looks like a
car from the 90's.

 

i think the GLI is your best choice there. previous to the MINI, i drove a Legacy GT. it was both fast and stable, but it was really uninspiring. i almost never found myself driving it faster than i should have, you know?

on test drives, i thought the GTI and GLI were great- almost good enough to sway me from taking the MINI. great engines, really cool interiors, lots of features (i wasn't looking DSG, but it is pretty impressive).

my vaguely-connected anecdotal history with VWAG- i drove an A4 for about 40K miles with pretty much zero problems.

ian

p.s. and you can get everything about the A3 that's worth having for several thousand less by getting a GLI or five-door GTI.

 

you shouldn't be driving faster than you should into a tree anyway.
you need to thank subaru for that.

 

My wife has 2006 A3 2.0T with DSG. She has 1K miles on it now and no problem so far. She loves it so much. She has a Nissan 350Z before and she said this A3 is as much fun and more practical. MPG on A3 is always on 29-30 mpg with 30% city and 70% highway. I have not experienced the volume up down like COOPERation said on the A3, but I got that issue on my S4. I took it to the dealer and it was the Audio Pilot. Just like on the MINI. It's a speed controlled volume adjustment. You can do it yourself just select the radio function "SVC" and adjust how much sensitive you need.



I just bought a GTI last month...can't let she has all the fun. Yes, GTI exhaust note is much more pronuce than an A3. The most important thing...it comes with "FAST"

 

My wife has a A3 2.0T with DSG, Sport Package, Cold weather package (both highly recommended!) and the Bose sound system. 14K miles, one year of driving, two road trips from Maryland to Montreal, very few issues. When we first got the car, the DSG's "safe mode" kicked in twice - both times happened during the first thousand miles, we have not had any issues since then. My wife is absolutely thrilled with the car, and when I drive it, I find the 2.0T/DSG combination to be very sporting.

From what I have read, the A3 shares almost no components with the older (pre-new-grill) 1.8T A4’s, so I think one cant really draw reliability comparisons between the two.


Before we selected the A3, we test drove an E46 325xiT-somthing (the awd one) wagon, Volvo V50, and a Saab 9-2x. All - even the BMW - paled in comparison to the Audi. From my wife’s perspective, it was no contest – and I agreed with her.


I highly recommend the A3.

 

We just went through the same thing. Our requirements were it had to br used, have AWD, be fun, and since we are sick of VAG reliability, no VW or Audi. That severely limited our options, and we were looking at the WRX, Saabaru, and Legacy GT/Outback XT.

We ended up with a 05 Legacy GT and I couldn't be happier. The thing is a monster. Power everywhere when you're on the turbo. It's no Audi on the inside, but it's a world better than any other Subaru interior I've seen. And these cars look much better in person than in pictures. Appearantly with a few simple mods you can exceed STi power.

I did look at the A3 a few months back. It seems like a great car to drive, and DSG is as good as advertised (I want). What turned us off on the A3 is to get AWD and all the toys we wanted you had to get an S-Line, and they ran into the upper $30s-40s if I remember correctly. Way too much. Our 05 LGT with 19k miles was less than 1/2 of that.

If you're into these kind of comparisons:
http://www.roadandtrack.com/article....&page_number=1

 

So after weeks and weeks of driving everything under $38K to replace our 2003 Saab 9-3, my wife and I have finally settled on two cars -- a 2006/07 A4 and a 2006 235i. But we're not happy with that decision.

First, I wish the lease rates were better on the A3. I'd still rather drive this one home. It's a perfect, stealth rocket with lots of utilitarian function. Listen up Audi -- lower your lease rates and up the residuals! Not everyone wants an A4!!!!

I feel quite the opposite about the Aero. The Aero is fast and has a good punch of turbo-ed V6 torque. But aside from all the creeks and rattles our test drive car had, they got two important audible traits very wrong! There's no turbo whine and the exhaust is too cheap and loud. With our current 4-pot 9-3, the turbo whine always puts a smile on my face! Saabs = turbo and if I don't hear the turbo, I don't want it. Lastly, regarding the exhaust - let's just say the Aero is not the new GTI.

But the biggest problem I have with the Aero is what happened during an extended test drive last weekend. During an attempt to pass a slow moving truck, the Aero went into limp mode after throwing a gearbox malfunction and a ESP failure. 90 miles on it and this is happening... no thank you. No amount of discounts will ever persuade me to buy another Saab.

The 330i on the other hand is a dream car. Oodles and oodles of throaty V6 power. Doing 110 feels like 60 and is effortless to obtain (well compared to my MINI). Tight steering, a good 6 speed auto trans. Everything I want in a car. But it's a loaner. An 11 month loaner. It's got scratches, the bumper has been backed into and the paint is (imho) a disaster. Plus since it's a loaner, it's been washed at least 3-4 times per week for the last 40 weeks. That's a lot of dealer done car washes. The clear coat is probably the equivalent of a 4 year old car. A good detailing would make it look great for a few weeks, but let the luster wash off and the paint will probably look awful again.

So that leaves me with the A4 and the 325i.

The A4 seems quick and nimble (but with the auto it's rated at 7.5 to 60). It feels like a junior MINI in many situations. I can take turns at speed and it feels solid, really glued to the ground. We have an A4 now on an extended test drive. I followed her home last night in our 9-3, and could barley keep up at intersections. Looking in the A4's rear view mirror at me, she was worried that I'd loose control following her out of turns. Just another nail in the coffin; the Saab really sucks!

The 325i on the other hand feels heavier and some what more lumbering. But compared to the A4, the steering on the 325 is tighter and more responsive, closer to that in the MINI. The interior seems a little richer and the controls are perfect for anyone who has driven a MINI.

My only complaint so far with the A4 is it's engine. It's rough down low and you're always reminded that it's a 4 cylinder. The V6 in the 325 is buttery smooth and shifts are virtually unnoticeable. And the sport mode is faster than the A4's version.

My only complaint for the 325i is that it has run flats and I'll need to buy snow tires for the winter. Our test drive with a 330i with 11K miles was accompanied by the familiar RF drone. It's less in the 330i's hushed cabin, but it's still there and I can still hear it. I don't want to lease a car for 3 years and have to 1) buy winters and 2) replace expensive RFs half way through the lease.

 

IBFTL!

 

A good friend of mine was searching for her new car. She had a few "wants" and a "must have".

The Must Have was a manual transmission. the wants were things like 4-doors. She test drove many cars that were "nice" (many on your list), but not a single one offered a manual transmission (auto-stick doesn't count to her). She ended up with a Honda Accord 4-door, that has a 6-speed.

Me, I sold a 2003 Jetta when I got the MINI. The only reason I didn't buy it off the lease was because I didn't get the 1.8T. I even made money selling it outright myself. I really like the VW products (I guess that includes Audi), but I don't know that I'd spring the extra cash for the Audi A3 when it's essentially a Passat (my Audi A4 driving friend thinks so of another friends Passat).

My sister likes her 2.5 Jetta (2005), but I think I'd go turbo...

 

Well, when looking for a car for the wife, lots of different things get involved including emotions, design, and functionality, whereas very unimportant to a lot of men. In that case it is harder to make a decision.

As far as 330i/xi being a dream-car, i would doubt that. I have always beeen a fan of inline6 BMWs but they are getting old and the new 3.5 twin-turbo motor is on th way(finally BMW realized so much getting owned to Audi at the lower end). I would take an Audi A4 Avant (even a 2.0T) all day long, since BMW is pretty boring at the lower end.

So far your choices are good, A3 3.2 w/DSG is an awesome choice and do not make this a difficult on you, whatever appeals to your lady, whatever makes the most sense go buy it. At the end, it is a f... car, what if you make a mistake? You change it for another. You are as **** as it can get. Can't make a decision your own, asking the whole America what others think? Just do what your little voice inside says, and make sure not to favor Saab since they carry a lot of GM products.

Good Luck....

 

Often times I think the best decisions are made after listening to what others have to say. In this case on NAM, it's asking questions, posting thoughts and opinions. I don't think that's being ****... well maybe a little

Regardless, that little voice inside did bubble up last night about 7:45pm. We're done car shopping.

Thanks for the comments everyone, I really appreciate it

 

There's no reason to get mean. Turning to a car enthusiast forum for advice on a buying decision is the smart thing to do - it helps you cut through all the advertising BS the dealer will give you.

What I did is ask around on several forums, compiled a list of candidate cars, my wife and I test drove them all, we took a couple days to decide, and ended up buying a 2.0T DSG A3. For some people buying a car is a trivial exercise, for my family, it was a significant purchase and we wanted to make the right decision.

The absolute worst thing you could do is walk into a dealership without doing any research, you leave yourself open to being manipulated by their sales staff.

 

I would have got the 3.2 instead of 2.0T if they released it at the same time. Love that exhaust note on 3.2.

This is not thing to do with car performance, but AUDI and VW drivers are the true car enthused just like MINI drivers. The community is great and people are really helpful on any thing you may come up with. Compare to some other german company community based in Bavarian, Some of them are pretty nice, but some are just totally crowns.

 

I see nothing **** about your inquiries whatsoever. I think it is smart. You can read about cars and test drive cars but there is nothing better than the opinions of actual owners. The collective knowledge of NAM members certainly exceeds anything you can read or get in a test drive.

So are you going to tell us what the little voice said? An Impala perhaps?

 

It sounds like a tough choice. I think someone mentioned the Volvo S40 and if you're looking for a good value, the S40 T5 is a quick car, very solid, has good handling, and has AWD as an option. You could pick one up for significantly less than an A4 and 3 Series. That said, I realize that not everyone loves Volvos as much as I do, but if you haven't gone and test driven one its worth a look. I haven't driven the Audi A4 or 3 Series but I imagine they are both great cars and you can't go wrong with either IMO. It just comes down to your personal preference for appearance and driving mannerisms.

And don't worry about the criticism for being too picky either. Buying a car is an important and huge decision and its not as easy for all of us to just "change it for anotherone." Prior to purchasing my MINI I had the same dilemma as I was considering the VW Rabbit and the Scion TC. Both cars had very good features and I was very torn between the two. Then I walked into the MINI dealer, problem solved...

 

Last year I also tested the TC prior to looking at the MINI... Then I went to the MINI dealer... the rest of the story is like yours. Impala My father-in-law would be so happy with us! "Why don't you buy a Buick Lucerne, it has a V8."

I think why we're unsatisfied is that we keep comparing everything back to my MINI. Damn my MINI!

Anyways, everything came into focus while driving the A4 back to the dealer last night. On my way there, I stopped by a VW dealer to compare the A4 back to back with the Jetta. DSG made all the difference. But you get what you pay for and the Jetta demo (with 200 driven miles) was falling apart before my eyes So at that exact moment I realized two things - either we buy the A3 - the original car my gut was telling me would be perfect for us or wait for the R56 Full circle - but I'm glad we weeded out the alternatives. Thanks again for all the opinions!

 

This was a great thread to read - lots of nice cars and good opinions. I haven't driven any of those on the list but I'm very impressed with what I see of the GTI and the A3.

One car no one mentioned - has anyone tried the Mazdaspeed 6? AWD, 260+ turbocharged HP, etc. The spec sheet sounds really good. I think the nose looks funny (they had to raise the hood to stuff the engine in there) but otherwise it seems like a decent car. The reviews I've read in the mags were decent, nothing earthshattering, though. Any driving impressions out there? The first new car we ever bought was a 1992 Protege and that car was as reliable as a claw hammer. We had it for 220,000+ miles and 10 years. I'd buy another Mazda any day.