R50/53 A National/International MINI Car Club? What do you think?
Thread Starter
|
Coordinator::Asia
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 845
Likes: 2
A National/International MINI Car Club? What do you think?
I and probably many of you NAM members received an email from Barry at MC2. He is proposing creating a National (International) MINI car club much like BMWCCA. See some of the excerpts from the email below
"We would like you to join us in our forum for a discussion of the viability of a national umbrella club. Much like the BMWCCA and other national clubs, a hobby eventually grows to a place or size that it could or should innovate such an idea as a national club.”
“One of our reasons for wanting to start this conversation is the 2007 events schedule. A lot more money could be given to charities than was given so far if the clubs could attain insurances, t-shirts and supplies, event signups and so much else. A club would "umbrella" so much.”
“We have been asked by so many clubs to donate to their events, we've become aware that we could do a better job of helping clubs with sponssorship and promotions thru our magazine and a formalized club than we are now.”
I think it is a great idea myself but would like to see this on an international level and not just a stateside level. There are many many MINI clubs globally and this could be a good thing to get sponsorships for MINI club events and activities.
I would like to see what you fellow NAM MINIacs think about this too. You can also post your ideas on the MC2 forums as a member.
"We would like you to join us in our forum for a discussion of the viability of a national umbrella club. Much like the BMWCCA and other national clubs, a hobby eventually grows to a place or size that it could or should innovate such an idea as a national club.”
“One of our reasons for wanting to start this conversation is the 2007 events schedule. A lot more money could be given to charities than was given so far if the clubs could attain insurances, t-shirts and supplies, event signups and so much else. A club would "umbrella" so much.”
“We have been asked by so many clubs to donate to their events, we've become aware that we could do a better job of helping clubs with sponssorship and promotions thru our magazine and a formalized club than we are now.”
I think it is a great idea myself but would like to see this on an international level and not just a stateside level. There are many many MINI clubs globally and this could be a good thing to get sponsorships for MINI club events and activities.
I would like to see what you fellow NAM MINIacs think about this too. You can also post your ideas on the MC2 forums as a member.
Keep it National. I've found from other car clubs and hobby clubs I've belonged to, that international club become far too unwieldy, and spread too thin.
From experience, a national club should be an umbrella organization, to create a national convention that rotates east, midwest, west. To produce a magazine, to look into group insurance for events, parts deals, and to provide a network for the chapters. No Mini club should be required to do more then to pay an annual affilliation fee. Individuals will have their dues to pay also.
The big question is, will this become an "owned" club (business), like the MGOC in the UK, or a membership controlled club.
From experience, a national club should be an umbrella organization, to create a national convention that rotates east, midwest, west. To produce a magazine, to look into group insurance for events, parts deals, and to provide a network for the chapters. No Mini club should be required to do more then to pay an annual affilliation fee. Individuals will have their dues to pay also.
The big question is, will this become an "owned" club (business), like the MGOC in the UK, or a membership controlled club.
7th Gear Gal
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 36,087
Likes: 3
From: Weeblegabber West (aka WLA)
A number of us tried to form a national MINI club back in 2002, but due to a variety of issues, it just didn't pan out. In the meantime, the grassroots desire for MINI enthusiasts to band together into social/enthusiast's clubs happened. I have co-founded many MINI clubs and think it would be rough to form a national one at this point. This has been discussed in many other threads. Seems like an international MINI club/organization would be more symbolic than functional, and a very clever way to market more swag.
I wasn't around for the ill-fated 2002 attempt, but national clubs for so many marques have been extemely successful for so many reasons: For those who don't live anywhere near a local club, who don't like to spend much time on the internet (they do exist), who would like to have a club magazine of some kind with tech tips, club happenings, etc. Group insurance that can be applied to local events (PCA, SCCA, Vette Owners all have it), national conventions instead of all these regional events, rotate the convention across the country (there's plenty of nice car areas to have a convention besides the Dragon and AMVIV).
Those of us who have been members of cars clubs for 20 years or so, can attest to all of this.
Those of us who have been members of cars clubs for 20 years or so, can attest to all of this.
Trending Topics
6th Gear
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 2,010
Likes: 0
From: Huntsville, Alabama
It may be a good thing or bad thing. I'm not sure since the MINI is the first car I have ever had and decided to join a club. I do know that we had a situation recently where we tried to form a main club where it would umbrella our smaller group. At first I was for it and so were a few of our members. But in the end we felt it was not in the interest of our local club. The larger club is great and we hang with them on occassion. The problem was dues and regulations that would be required. When the larger group gets together, there are at most 4, including myself, from our smaller group that travel to their area. We didn't feel it was right to have those in our club that never travel to the other area to pay dues to them and abide by their regulations. And niether did they.
So if a larger club would be formed and we became part of it. We would have to choose if we wanted to not join and keep going the route we are or join and run the chance of dropping membership down to possibly 6 members. Our club likes to be a no dues, no regulations, come and go as you please type of club. No annual meetings and such. We just want to have fun in the MINI and be friends. Maybe we aren't as large as other groups such as Atlanta or DCMM. Then again we don't have a MINI dealership in our state to have a large population of MINIs. We feel if we have at least 7 MINIs at an event, that is good. We've never been able to make sure but I doubt if there are more than 50 MINIs in the area.
That's why some of us don't feel as a group to join a larger group. We are small enough to be more than just a car club. A group of friends is more like it. So if a national club is formed. All I ask is that it not try to regulate or push smaller clubs into joining them.
So if a larger club would be formed and we became part of it. We would have to choose if we wanted to not join and keep going the route we are or join and run the chance of dropping membership down to possibly 6 members. Our club likes to be a no dues, no regulations, come and go as you please type of club. No annual meetings and such. We just want to have fun in the MINI and be friends. Maybe we aren't as large as other groups such as Atlanta or DCMM. Then again we don't have a MINI dealership in our state to have a large population of MINIs. We feel if we have at least 7 MINIs at an event, that is good. We've never been able to make sure but I doubt if there are more than 50 MINIs in the area.
That's why some of us don't feel as a group to join a larger group. We are small enough to be more than just a car club. A group of friends is more like it. So if a national club is formed. All I ask is that it not try to regulate or push smaller clubs into joining them.
It may be a good thing or bad thing. I'm not sure since the MINI is the first car I have ever had and decided to join a club. I do know that we had a situation recently where we tried to form a main club where it would umbrella our smaller group. At first I was for it and so were a few of our members. But in the end we felt it was not in the interest of our local club. The larger club is great and we hang with them on occassion. The problem was dues and regulations that would be required. When the larger group gets together, there are at most 4, including myself, from our smaller group that travel to their area. We didn't feel it was right to have those in our club that never travel to the other area to pay dues to them and abide by their regulations. And niether did they.
So if a larger club would be formed and we became part of it. We would have to choose if we wanted to not join and keep going the route we are or join and run the chance of dropping membership down to possibly 6 members. Our club likes to be a no dues, no regulations, come and go as you please type of club. No annual meetings and such. We just want to have fun in the MINI and be friends. Maybe we aren't as large as other groups such as Atlanta or DCMM. Then again we don't have a MINI dealership in our state to have a large population of MINIs. We feel if we have at least 7 MINIs at an event, that is good. We've never been able to make sure but I doubt if there are more than 50 MINIs in the area.
That's why some of us don't feel as a group to join a larger group. We are small enough to be more than just a car club. A group of friends is more like it. So if a national club is formed. All I ask is that it not try to regulate or push smaller clubs into joining them.
So if a larger club would be formed and we became part of it. We would have to choose if we wanted to not join and keep going the route we are or join and run the chance of dropping membership down to possibly 6 members. Our club likes to be a no dues, no regulations, come and go as you please type of club. No annual meetings and such. We just want to have fun in the MINI and be friends. Maybe we aren't as large as other groups such as Atlanta or DCMM. Then again we don't have a MINI dealership in our state to have a large population of MINIs. We feel if we have at least 7 MINIs at an event, that is good. We've never been able to make sure but I doubt if there are more than 50 MINIs in the area.
That's why some of us don't feel as a group to join a larger group. We are small enough to be more than just a car club. A group of friends is more like it. So if a national club is formed. All I ask is that it not try to regulate or push smaller clubs into joining them.
6th Gear
Joined: May 2003
Posts: 1,427
Likes: 0
From: Sword Mountain
From experience, a national club should be an umbrella organization, to create a national convention that rotates east, midwest, west. To produce a magazine, to look into group insurance for events, parts deals, and to provide a network for the chapters. No Mini club should be required to do more then to pay an annual affilliation fee. Individuals will have their dues to pay also.
.
pug poo picker-upper
Joined: Jun 2002
Posts: 9,803
Likes: 30
From: California
First, BMWCCA is an excellent organization and they are welcoming of the MINI. 
That said, a National MINI Club has been tried before. Many members of this forum (myself included) were part of that effort to get it off the ground.
There were two primary issues that confronted us back in 2003, and I think they are still very relevant today:
For your $40 to BMWCCA you get the glossy Roundel Magazine, chapter newsletters, parts discounts, a BMWCCA membership card, a BMWCCA sticker, and the ability to attend BMWCCA events.
What would a National MINI Club provide?
Here is the primary problem: A National MINI Club needs the existing local clubs more than the local clubs need the National.
A National MINI Club would be nothing without local clubs signing up to be local chapters of the National Club. Members want local activities, and you can't organize that at a national headquarters.
The easiest way to do that would be to get the current clubs to join a National Club, but the economics of it aren't very kind.
Right now lets say a local club collects dues of $25 a year. They keep 100% of those dues at the local level. None of that money gets siphoned off by a national headquarters. Under a BMWCCA structure, you would pay dues to a national organization and then they would distribute some of the dues money to the local chapter for each member.
So why would a local club want to be a chapter of National MINI Club when they could keep all of the $25 a member with no hassle, versus needing to deal with the hassle of a national headquarters that takes a cut?
You might say, well a large organization like BMWCCA brings in more members to each chapter than it could bring in itself as a local unaffiliated club. That's probably true in the case of BMWCCA because the organization has been around for decades. Don't expect a National MINI Club to be able to replicate the same thing. Where is National MINI Club going to attract these new throngs of "unattached" members from? If they aren't online already and seeing their club on NAM or MotoringFile, what's to make us think they will find National MINI Club any easier? Oh, maybe they would see National MINI Club information at their dealership since BMWCCA has pamphlets available? Maybe, but then a lot of dealerships already have close ties to their local MINI clubs.
The other thing to consider is if you really want your local club to be a "National MINI Club Chapter", because inevitably that means giving up some of the individuality that each club has. Currently each club in the MINI community is a grassroots effort and the local character shines through (CORN - Cooper Owners of Rural Nebraska for instance ). Maybe it won't happen right off the bat, but a National MINI Club would surely make a move at some point to unify the chapters by having common practices and naming. Currently local clubs have complete control over things like their naming, how "formal" the club is, and dues (Annual, lifetime, or none at all).
In the end, it just doesn't make much sense for a local club that has its own identity and local flavor to give that up to deal with a national organization and then get back less money in the end than they would get if they remained independent.
All that said...
North American Motoring has been a part of the MINI community and bringing the MINI community together since 2002. In that time we have worked with over 40 MINI clubs from around the country and internationally, by providing services to them such as:
If your club would like to take advantage of these services, all you need to do is have a representative of the club Contact Us
That said, a National MINI Club has been tried before. Many members of this forum (myself included) were part of that effort to get it off the ground.
There were two primary issues that confronted us back in 2003, and I think they are still very relevant today:
- What benefit do members get?
- Why would a club want to affiliate?
For your $40 to BMWCCA you get the glossy Roundel Magazine, chapter newsletters, parts discounts, a BMWCCA membership card, a BMWCCA sticker, and the ability to attend BMWCCA events.
What would a National MINI Club provide?
- A glossy magazine? Already available
- Insurance? Clubs are already able to get insurance for large events and NAM has played a supporting roll in this in some cases.
- A Club Calendar with Event Sign-ups? NAM is already providing this to some clubs. A lot of clubs have this on their own websites, but NAM can enable this for any club that requests it.
- Parts discounts? NAM Vendors are already providing discounts to NAM members: Classic MINI has you covered for discount MINI Parts and other NAM Vendors run group buys already.
- Membership card and a sticker or a t-shirt?... yes, they could provide that, but would it be worth joining for (sure some would but could you really make a successful club with those that would be happy with that?). What's the point of having a "National MINI Club" t-shirt, if there isn't a chapter in your area? (see below)
- The ability to attend National MINI Club events? What National MINI Club events?
- Large events like BMWCCA's Oktoberfest? the MINI community is already doing this with events like AMVIV, MOTD, MINIs in the Mountains, Minis on Top. These large events have grown out of the efforts of the local clubs involved, NAM has and will continue to play a supporting roll, but at their core these events are grassroots organized.
Here is the primary problem: A National MINI Club needs the existing local clubs more than the local clubs need the National.
A National MINI Club would be nothing without local clubs signing up to be local chapters of the National Club. Members want local activities, and you can't organize that at a national headquarters.
The easiest way to do that would be to get the current clubs to join a National Club, but the economics of it aren't very kind.
Right now lets say a local club collects dues of $25 a year. They keep 100% of those dues at the local level. None of that money gets siphoned off by a national headquarters. Under a BMWCCA structure, you would pay dues to a national organization and then they would distribute some of the dues money to the local chapter for each member.
So why would a local club want to be a chapter of National MINI Club when they could keep all of the $25 a member with no hassle, versus needing to deal with the hassle of a national headquarters that takes a cut?
You might say, well a large organization like BMWCCA brings in more members to each chapter than it could bring in itself as a local unaffiliated club. That's probably true in the case of BMWCCA because the organization has been around for decades. Don't expect a National MINI Club to be able to replicate the same thing. Where is National MINI Club going to attract these new throngs of "unattached" members from? If they aren't online already and seeing their club on NAM or MotoringFile, what's to make us think they will find National MINI Club any easier? Oh, maybe they would see National MINI Club information at their dealership since BMWCCA has pamphlets available? Maybe, but then a lot of dealerships already have close ties to their local MINI clubs.
The other thing to consider is if you really want your local club to be a "National MINI Club Chapter", because inevitably that means giving up some of the individuality that each club has. Currently each club in the MINI community is a grassroots effort and the local character shines through (CORN - Cooper Owners of Rural Nebraska for instance
). Maybe it won't happen right off the bat, but a National MINI Club would surely make a move at some point to unify the chapters by having common practices and naming. Currently local clubs have complete control over things like their naming, how "formal" the club is, and dues (Annual, lifetime, or none at all).In the end, it just doesn't make much sense for a local club that has its own identity and local flavor to give that up to deal with a national organization and then get back less money in the end than they would get if they remained independent.
All that said...
North American Motoring has been a part of the MINI community and bringing the MINI community together since 2002. In that time we have worked with over 40 MINI clubs from around the country and internationally, by providing services to them such as:
- Club forum on North American Motoring
- Club event calendar with event RSVP services
- Free web hosting for club websites
- Entry in the NAM Club Directory (coming soon)
If your club would like to take advantage of these services, all you need to do is have a representative of the club Contact Us
I was the North American Secretary of the MG Car Club Ltd from 1982-84.
I founded the Sacramento Valley MG Car Club in 1978.
I helped organize the 1986 IPMS National Convention in Sacramento.
Was Region 9 Coordinator for IPMS/USA for three years.
Bonafides established that I know a little something about club framework on a local, national, and international level.
There is this fear being encouraged that a National Club will somehow dilute the local clubs. How? No club I have ever belonged to was ever diluted in anyway by belonging to a national organization. if anything, it added to the flavor of the club.
A website does not reach everyone. Many people just don't care to sit in front of their computers for more than e-mail. A website isn't going to reach Mini owners that aren't into computers.
A national club would collect individual dues for those members who wish to join, and a chapter affilliation fee from those chapters who wish to be a part of the national network. How BMW clubs do it is not the model to follow.
A magazine that is by the club, for the club and it's members, providing the members a forum for their ideas and exchange, in a medium that can be read by all at any time. Can MC2 do this? Remains to be seen.
Regalia is also fun, and of course the feeling of "belonging" which is a root reason why anyone joins any club.
National conventions are usually the high water point for any club. Usually it requires the networking of a national club for work properly.
NAM is a great website, MC2 is becomiing a great magazine. Neither can take the place of a national club.
If national clubs are so bad, why is there one for almost every marque of automobile? Someone is having fun, that's why.
I founded the Sacramento Valley MG Car Club in 1978.
I helped organize the 1986 IPMS National Convention in Sacramento.
Was Region 9 Coordinator for IPMS/USA for three years.
Bonafides established that I know a little something about club framework on a local, national, and international level.
There is this fear being encouraged that a National Club will somehow dilute the local clubs. How? No club I have ever belonged to was ever diluted in anyway by belonging to a national organization. if anything, it added to the flavor of the club.
A website does not reach everyone. Many people just don't care to sit in front of their computers for more than e-mail. A website isn't going to reach Mini owners that aren't into computers.
A national club would collect individual dues for those members who wish to join, and a chapter affilliation fee from those chapters who wish to be a part of the national network. How BMW clubs do it is not the model to follow.
A magazine that is by the club, for the club and it's members, providing the members a forum for their ideas and exchange, in a medium that can be read by all at any time. Can MC2 do this? Remains to be seen.
Regalia is also fun, and of course the feeling of "belonging" which is a root reason why anyone joins any club.
National conventions are usually the high water point for any club. Usually it requires the networking of a national club for work properly.
NAM is a great website, MC2 is becomiing a great magazine. Neither can take the place of a national club.
If national clubs are so bad, why is there one for almost every marque of automobile? Someone is having fun, that's why.
6th Gear
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 2,010
Likes: 0
From: Huntsville, Alabama
National conventions are usually the high water point for any club. Usually it requires the networking of a national club for work properly.
5th Gear
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 696
Likes: 0
From: Reno
There's no doubt, Dave, that NAM has played a big role in developing an online national MINI community. That said, I'm not sure I'm good to go forward to a national club with King Mark I on the throne. I mistrust his agenda, suspecting that it has something to do with bigga bux. Sorry.
A national club needs elected officers and an elected board of Directors. I nominate Minimom for president!
Cheers,
Sid
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
igzekyativ
MINIs & Minis for Sale
34
Jul 16, 2020 12:54 PM
igzekyativ
MINIs & Minis for Sale
28
Dec 23, 2015 10:36 AM
marendt428
MINIs & Minis for Sale
0
Aug 8, 2015 04:44 AM