My poor Samantha has been in the shop for almost a week now (6 days) and she is having a problem with her newly installed JCW brakes- there seems to be air continously flowing into the brake lines... (I dont fully understand this, I just know it is bad...) Anyone else have problems or solutions??? Thanks!

 

Bleeding brakes is not exactly a rocket science. Why is your dealer keeping your car for a week when you pay big bucks for the brakes. I would be very surprised if the problem has anything to do with the JCW kit. Sound more like poor customer service.

 

They are bleeding the brakes again today... I dont think that it is poor customer service or the JCW kit... but the inexperience mechanics... I was just wondering if anyone had problems too... stupid niello. arg.

 

Here are a couple of thoughts for you.

First, if 'air is getting into the system' then fluid is getting out. No way around that. The hose fittings and pistons are the only points of entry and exit. This should be evident by trails of fluid somewhere. Air does not just find a way in.

The other thing to look for is bleeder location. I'm not familiar with the caliper but if the bleeder nipple is not the highest point in the caliper when mounted it can have air become trapped. I have some kits that can do this.

The nipple must be the high point. If the caliper is mounted at a slight angle or the nipple is not by design at the high point then you need to jack up the car to place this point at the top. Sometimes the crown of the upper piston is actually a bit higher than the passage drilled for the fluid to bleed. By moving this you allow this air to escape and bleed completely.

If they are using some sort of bleeder contraption tell them to toss it and do it with a small vinyl hose and a catch can. There are no bleeder tools that can compete with the most basic 'two men and a hose' system. Most are just marginal at best.

 

As you know (because we exchanged PMs) I don't have experience to share. But I want to express my sympathy that your new MINI with JCW equipment should be giving you and Niello (actually more you than Niello) such trouble. Seems unfair after waiting so long, tracking production, and then arrival. Bummer.

 

if these tech can't do a simple install and bleed of brakes...certainly no rocket scientists needed for this...how do they do a JCW engine upgrade?
I wouldn't let them near my car.
maybe they installed them on the wrong side of the car

 

That was my initial thought too they installed the calipers on the wrong side. The calipers may be handed, and if left-right reversed the bleeding nipple ending up on the bottom trapping the air on top. Since I haven't seen the JCW BBK I am only speculating the possibilities. This would be too simple though.

It is taking so long may be the dealer is flying in a brake expert from JC Garage in UK.

 

Not sure about 'too simple' but if I'd taken the car in and the tech didn't know which end of the caliper was up....well, I'd be looking for a new service center very quickly.

***Actually I had this happen not more than a month ago. Kit buyer buys kit and installs.

Calls complaining of poor braking, pad wear etc.etc. "I've installed lots of brakes and I'm an expert, know what I'm doing, done this, done that, owned one of these, one of those etc. etc. Your kit doesn't feel nearly as good as my old XXX whatever....Send me some different pads these suck yada yada.

Me, I ship him new pads and talk about bedding etc.

Call back; "same as before, disappointed, poor pedal, I KNOW WHAT I'M talking about blah, blah, blah.

Me, send me a pic of the pads and the wear you see and are upset about.

So he does.

Me, Umm, (wanting to call him Mr. Expert) before we go any further on all of this, how about you swap sides on the calipers. Put the bleeders on the top. Or follow the directions about 'bleeders pointing up' or maybe read the R and L on the box?

No more calls, alls fine now. Now he want one of the rear kits. Think he'll know which end is up?



Sheese. (not a MINI)

 

Your car must be at dealer because this is a brake problem and it is unlikely they will let you drive it until they resolve the problem so you are a kind of stuck. I would demand they put an experience tech to work on it.

If you don't understand the reason excuse they give you should find a friend who understand the principle of hydraulic brake to go with you and demand a timely resolution. Another avenue is to escalate the matter with Mini USA.

This is unacceptable. I wonder how much they are charging for the installation.

 

after a week in the shop dealing with all sorts of problems... mostly with the brake lines... she is home. and now that i am able to motor again... (behind the wheel of a REAL MINI... -for a while i had a counterfeit) they will be forgiven... and hopefully this wont happen with the next set of JCW brakes they install!

 

Well......what did they say was the problem???? Don't leave us hangin'


Later

 

All calipers are handed, unless they are mounted horizontally (12 o'clock position) ...or nearly horizontally; no more than 2 or 3 degrees off 12 o'clock, or unless they have extra bleed points(would be a huge waste of resources to any company producing calipers, so this will likely never be done)

please elaborate. what was the culprit? how was it resolved?

 

dont know what the problem was... they didnt tell me... will ask when i go in with my subeast to pick up my other wheels...

 

the problem was that they calipers (spelling?) had been installed either backwards or upside down (i forget which)... and that was causing the problem...

I got to be the Niello guinea pig, so if any of you have to go in now, they should know what they are doing

 

This sure sets a new standard for Factory Trained BMW Mechanic. The best part is there are som many owners were told their cars has no problem because there is no fault code registered. Good that they are trained the indispensable skill of reading the fault codes.

I have a suggestion for BMW. Why not just display the fault code on the dash board so the owners don't have to inconvenient the service department when they don't have a code.

I am sorry you have to live through this ordeal.

 

Wow! I just installed the JCW brake kit on my own car last Friday and it seems a little strange to me that a dealer could boof up the install that bad. The calipers install very easily and if you match them up to the stock ones you're taking off the car (i.e. with the bleeder valve on the top of the caliper), I would think that it would be a no brainer. Not to mention the fact that if they installed them upside-down, the bleeder valve would be on the bottom and it would be quite hard to get all of the air out of the system to begin with. No?

However, I don't see how installing the calipers upside-down would cause the system to take in air??? It's a closed system and so it shouldn't matter what direction the caliper is facing. The only thing I can think of is that by installing them the wrong way up, it was causing the brake line to be pulled on (and hence come lose) as the suspension worked and that's what was causing air to enter the system. Oy!

Anyway, I'm very glad to hear that you got your car back. The JCW brakes are AWESOME! I really like mine so far.

BTW... Here's a shot of a JCW caliper properly installed (with the bleeder valve on top as it should be):

 

you had it right with the first assumption. they never properly bled the system the first time. air never got fully out of the system, heck I'm surprised the brakes worked at all, prolly had 75% air in the piston pot.


on another note: OfficeMaven: who makes the rotor for the JCW kit? their name should be cast in that ring around the hat. thx
also, is that the dust shoield that comes with the JCW kit, or is it the original?

 

I'm truly surprised they admitted to such a mistake.

 

Soon followed by the classic: "Got a minute Fred?"

 

I'm not sure who makes the rotor, but from the looks of it, it's the same company who makes the stock rotors. Here's a shot of the larger JCW rotor and my smaller 05 MCS stock rotor side-by-side:



As for the dust shield/backing plate shown in the picture... It's the stock one. The JCW kit doesn't include a new shield. All the kit comes with are two new front calipers (completely pre-assembled with the pads pre-installed), two new rotors, two new banjo bolts with seals (for hooking up the brake lines), and a set of new rear brake pads.

 

Mike, is a write-up coming? Like to hear more of your thoughts on this kit's performance and installation :smile:

 

they didnt want to admit it, but i got it out of one of the techs :smile:

these brakes are great! i love em a LOT!

and now back to everyone and their conversations...

 

Yes, it should appear on Motoringfile.com any time now.

Lot's of nice picture just like the ones above too.

 

right on . You keep piling on the mods and my poor MCS is still STOCK..

 

Yes! Mike's excellent write-up will be on MotoringFile early Wednesday!