Anybody with experience in both cars care to comment on how they would match up in autocrossing? Both cars are stock, the BMW has the performance package (bump in power, 6 speed manual, stiffer suspension). The JCW is stock with JCW suspension.

I ran my 2012 JCW last year and did very well in our local region, winning the overall champion for the season. We are not a huge region but we have past national champions so there are a handful that can drive pretty well.

I just picked up a low mileage 2004 330i and I was wondering how it would do compared to the JCW. They are both in D Stock so I assume they will both be in the same Street class next year.

Would the cars run similar times given the same driver or would the 330i have an advantage being RWD? It does not have a limited slip though, but neither does the JCW except for the EDLC. The BMW is 600 lbs heavier, on paper its faster but it feels slower off the line.

I would like to attend nationals next year and do as well as possible. I have no vision of placing but my goal would be to place in the top half of pack. I am just curious if I should consider switching to the BMW next year or stick with the JCW.

 

I'd think that the weight of the Bimmer would hurt its performance more than the RWD would help it. The MINI also has a few more years of suspension design behind it, which probably mitigates the FWD disadvantage to some extent. Plus the JCW has a more-advanced suspension, and 8 years less wear on the bushings and such.

I'd pick the JCW, myself.

 

Interesting question! Although I have no experience in autocross apart from being a spectator, it would seem that with the "point and squirt" nature of the sport that lightness would be an advantage. I.e., the nearer you can get to a Lotus 7, the better. ;-)

Spridget

 

I autocross with the BMW club here in Colorado where we have several MINIs competing. The MINIs ( JCW and S) are consistently coming in ahead of the 330is and M3s.

 

Everybody over on the E46 forums also have the same opinions. I was just curious what others thought. In regards to bushings etc... The front of my 330 will have refreshed bushings and ball joints all around so will drive like new, but like everyone says, the 600lbs will be the factor.

I think when I get into Track days the 330i would be more fun though. The engine really revs well and pulls very well in 3rd gear to probably 105mph before red line.

 

was there ever a lsd as an option for the 330? probably good idea to add it if so

 

Our BMW club allocates cars points for autocross, 1 point is supposed to be worth about 0.1 sec on a 60 second course.

They'd give 41 points to a 330i sedan with the performance package, and 43 points to a JCW with JCW suspension. That's a roundabout way of saying the local club thinks they're pretty equal in performance, so any difference is way overshadowed by driver skill. They'd both compete in equal terms in the "B" class (for cars with 40-49 points).

For comparison, our JustaCooper currently has 34 or 36 points (depending on wheels) and when we've modded the suspension, it'll be on 39 or 41 points. We've never run our JCW which would have 41 points (with sport suspension). There's no one running a Cooper-S or JCW to compare to around here. (The only Cooper-S I've seen is a full on STX MINI with 71 points, he runs near the top of the club or at the SCCA.)

 

Btwyx,

It sounds like your guys just have a modified version of the SCCA pax system. Our club does overall points based off of PAX so we all can compete against each other and then individual class competitions as well.

The pax system is very consistent time after time.

 

JCW will win.
So will a regular MCS over a stock E46 or E90.
It is very hard to overcome the 600# penalty that the BMW carries. In my case, even with an AWD E90 335i - my MCS beats 335ix times by ~2 seconds on the same 60 second course. That's a LOT!

However - the outcome would depend on the course.
Turbo MINI will do better on a shorter course with tight low-speed turns. BMW will do better on longer high-speed sweepers where 50:50 balance and RWD will allow you to start accelerating sooner out of a turn. Thus, the E46 will post faster times on track for this and many other reasons.

a

 

Are they both on stock sized tires? How big is the lot you guys run on? The BMW will transition really well and do better in the larger lots while the mini will be easier to drive on the smaller lots. It's probably going to be dependent on course and how comfortable you are in the car.

In regards to Nationals next year if you're not driving an AWD car (Audi/Subaru) in D Street "You're gonna have a bad time". In related news... you're going to go to Nats with a bone stock car and run in D street and are shooting for placing in the top half?

The mini is going to have trouble putting power down in street form and the BMW is going to need some high dollar shocks (700-1000 per shock) to tame that funky rear suspension. Pick your poison. Or open up the checkbook and buy the ringer car in D Street... The VR6 Audi TT

 

i'd say the system our BMW club uses is a very different philosophy than PAX, but the result is the same.

With PAX you have the question of "how fast should the best car in this class be (relative to other classes).

With the club's index system the question is "fast should this individual car be, given its potential and modifications". The index is then used to sort cars into classes which can compete on roughly equal terms.

With PAX my index has been .804 no matter which wheels I use, or which mods I apply. If I haven't modded the car to the full potential of the rules, PAX still assumes I have.

My index with the club has been .899 or .902 depending on the wheels and will be .907 or .910 once I've applied mods to shocks and rear bar.

PAX is about potential, the club index is about actuality.