Quick question, if this is purchased and used on a car, but the owner decides to sell it and go back to stock (which happens quite frequently) can the device be flashed clear so that it can work on the next vehicle or is it a perm. once and done, once it's bonded it will never work on another car period?

 

Once this is used and bonded to that VIN, it becomes married to that ECU. But it can be re-loaded back onto the same ECU in the future (unlimited times).

In this regard, it functions the same way as a Shark Injector flash tool, but much more powerful. It's the same way with a Custom Tune; you can spend up to $750 (tune with dyno time) with a dyno tune, but if you decide to sell the car, there's no way to "recuperate" that cost. One can't expect to get the money back by asking the tuner to remove the tune and returning the ECU back to stock, correct?

 

No I completely understand that the cost of the actual tune or the dyno time cannot be recooperated. This looks and sounds like an awesome piece of equipment, basically like an Accessport (for R56) but for our R53's and a far better option for maximizing your cars potential (E85 option is always a plus). My only concern would be say you were going back to stock to trade the car into a dealer, the dealer won't want the Unit, so while you can't recover the cost of the dyno time or the tuning time (if you have to pay a tuner), you will also have a $750 paper weight that you can no longer use and can't be passed along for someone else to use.

Again I'm not knocking the product in any way shape or form, just a concern I had. One of my best friends tunes cars for a living and I've been tossing up the idea of going with some type of full tuning option or an RMW/Way Remote tune, so that's why I asked the initial question.

 

The way I understood it is if you sold the car it could go to the new owner (dealership also). If the new owner wanted to have it back to stock there is a "Stock Tune" that could be downloaded and the new owner would still retain the option to reuse the "Tuned" file at some later time....that's my interpretation.

 

Right, I totally understand that part, but there are also a lot of owners that trade their cars in to possibly move to a different platform or to a newer model, etc. The dealer they trade the car into won't want the Bytetronik unit or won't increase the value of the car with it (from my experience of working at a dealership a couple years ago) so what can be done with it if there is not way to make it compatible with any other ECU. If it's a private sale, of course, it could be used to increase the value of the car.

But there are also owners that decide to go back to stock for personal reasons and want to de-mod their car, which is a personal choice and I complete understand, upload the stock map and the car is back to normal, what I'm getting at is if a person no longer wants/needs or trades the car in, they still have the unit and they can't do anything with it because it will only work with their ECU.

I guess the only option would be to sell the Unit WITH your ECU in trade for another persons ECU and you both have to go to the dealer to have the ECU programmed to work with your car, but at least then the unit would work for the new owner in their car correct?

 

So they charge $300 for the MyGenius Flashing tool (just to upload and download maps from your tuner). How much is it for the Remote Tuning Map?

Can you get a refund on the Dimsport Remote Tuning tool when you go back to stock?

 

I know that most of the tuning parties that Jan holds, his tune is $350. I haven't inquired about remote tunes yet with purchase of the tool as I would prefer an option that allows my local tuner to tune it, in the event changes ever need to be made, hence why this product is appealing, far less expensive then Vipec.

If you purchase the Tuning tool from RMW, you can call Jan and he can reset the unit, but there is a fee associated, but from the searching I've done, that fee appears to be $100.

I'm coming from the world of older Toyota's that didn't have chipping/reflash options. Only option was full stand alone (AEM ECU is what I went with) or specific companies may have generic Rom Tunes. Piggy back's like SAFCII, Greddy Emanage, etc were a no no. So when I read about Accessport for R56's, I think that's a great tool, then I read about Bytetronik, again seems like a very powerful tool as well since it allows users to make their own changes, instead of paying for retuning and emailing files. I'm just trying digest the thought of owning a tool that works ONLY for one car and in the event I can't sell the car as a whole (if I sell the car down the road and there isn't always a market for heavily modified cars and you always end up making more parting it out) and have to part it back to stock, I will be stuck with a tool that cost $750 and has no other use. But it's still half if not less then half the price of a Vipec so it's still a great option.

 

Yeah, i hear ya on that one... People who have spent tons of modding their cars only get pennies on the dollar when it comes time to reselling their modded car... that's a fact of car modding. Besides, selling a used 1st-Gen MINI back to the dealership is not really an option these days. Lets face it, a 2005 S with 85k miles is going to have $5,000 trade-in value at the stealership? (if they will take it on a trade that is...)

FA is just one more tuning option for the MINI Owners around the world. There are Pro's & Con's to every tool out there and this one is no exception. We have sold tons of these to oversea customers and they are loving it. One tuner stated: "the data-logging feature along is worth $600."

At the end of the day, weight out your options and make the decision based on your needs. If this is not the tool for you, then feel free to chose from others on the list. Way Motorworks is also one of our Dealers and he has sold a few units for us as well.

http://www.waymotorworks.com/bytetro...uning-kit.html

I, too, have two Shark Injectors sitting on my desk as paperweight (one from a E46 BMW and one from a Z4 BMW). That's just part of the modding game. I knew what I was in for when I bought the Shark injector so there is no 'buyers remorse' there. You have to "pay to play"; otherwise, keep it stock.

You can't really compared FA to a Vipec b/c one is a tuning tool, the other is a Stand-Alone. FA can pass SMOG Inspection, Vipec can NOT

Vipec should be compared along the line as MoTeC or the 1320 Stand-Alone => for race applications ONLY...

 

I guess the trade in value is all area dependant, trade in value here in VA is still pretty solid as is selling it to a place such as carmax. But mine is an 06' with 60k so that may be why.

Way's website is the first place I ever actually saw this product. I've purchased from him numerous times and get a lot of useful information on future plans from him. His website just didn't have a ton of details and it's still a thought for me.

The world I'm from, stand-alone is basically the only real option for big power (400+whp) so that's what I'm used to, I've just been noticing that most "flash tools" don't really give you the ability to fine tune, just load maps, which again is awkward to me, which is why this tool caught my attention. And here in VA Beach, VA Smog isn't a problem

I've just been toying with the idea lately to part out my MR2 and turn my R53 into the new massive project and get an R56 as a daily, just kind of gathering prices/costs in my head to go for the big build on an R53 and if it's an avenue I want to take.

last question, is bytetronik bound by VIN or something else?

 

I Love Mine, I've had it since 05/11 and would have been absolutely sunk without it many times, not to mention the costs that I would have incured to do what I've done with Bytronik.

The datalogging itself has been a great tool not only for troubleshooting and tuning, but has also been a great tool for helping to learn more about tuning, just being able to map changes in the way the car performs after making an ecu change is just one of the many things it helps you to do and understand about how everything works.

 

As a BtyeTroniK customer since the initial release of the software, I CAN NOT stress the importants of this WARNING! If you do not know what you are doing your repair bill will be costly! (And it is NOBODYS FAULT but YOUR OWN!)
Also in the first siries of posts, it was brought up that you do not need to use a MINI specific tuner. While the principles of tuning an EFI system are the same, the way our ECU's work is a little different than lets say a Mitsubishi, or Honda ECU. Be verry cautious about the "TUNER" you choose! If your tuner dosent exactly know what they are doing your maps could look like the timing maps I am posting below.



This is just flat out WRONG! And done by a "PROFESSIONAL"! TOBZ performance in Denver did this GARBAGE! Its a wonder my car made it off the dyno let alone last 3 months before a bearing failure running 37* of timing!

There is no real fail safe with ByteTroniK, it's a TOOL and is up to the user to be able to USE IT CORRECTLY! It will do whatever the user wants it to, and if that is way out of any kind of SAFE OPPERATING RANGE... So Be IT! Looks like you get catastrophic engine failure because you did it wrong!

Overall after learning to use the software more effectively, I believe that there are people out there capible of using this tool. Its just a matter of how much the opperator of the software actually knows. There have been a select few people looking for just this kind of product for a LONG time. (Myself included) And this option has been out there for a while now.

I do believe there are some shortcomings to the program though. For instance the Tip In fuel controll, Injector latency, and some other maps that where just plain left out. Theese dont mean much just doing a BASIC tune, but the more advanced the tune needs to be (Depending on mods) they become more relevent. There was supposed to be a big update to the software, adding some more of theese maps that where originally deemed "Unnessicary to tune" by the creator. Now it's looking more and more like that update will never come. Also the descriptions of the maps themselves are verry vauge... Even to a Pro tuner. There are many many decent tuners out there for other markets who have never touched any part of a Tourque limmiter based system, and they just wont know what to do.

The purpose of this post is not to discourage people from purchacing this tuning software, it's your hard earnd money... Do with it what you please. I just wanted to add some additional warnings to a warning and share my personal oppinions of the product.

 

Your question has been addressed in two separate posts (see RED below)...

 

If you have the funds, wants HUGE horsepower and NOT have to worry about smog, then that's a no-Brainer... go with a full stand-alone ecu.

Unfortunately, about 95% of the MINI owners can't get away with that so the stock ECU is still the status quo.

If people are complaining about how dangerous FA can be in the wrong hands, then a stand-alone is far, far more dangerous. At least the stock ECU has pre-configured stock maps... with the stand-alone ECU, it's sink or drown

 

It's called tuner pride. And we have actually turned down quite a few sales to Evo/STi tuners b/c they always say "a motor is a motor...". We always stress the fact that the MINI Ecu doesn't behave the same as Japanese ecu. Just b/c the GUI looks the same, the codes and the mappings carry different characteristics. And this why we started to offer Custom Remote Mapping as an "Value-added Service".

We have offered to examine your final tuned file to offer you some advice, but that file was never received. And there's always the Tech Forum (which is being under-utilized, might I add)... A post in there with your timing maps should have raised some eye-brows.

We are always here to offer advice... people just have to suck up their pride and have some humility.

When your car was at the dyno, we specifically asked them if they needed some pointers. And we also asked them to use the DataLogging feature to check on the tune.

The Data-Logging is the "canary in the gold mine" - that's your fail-safe in a way. By examing the logs, one can easily see if the engine is "happy" or NOT.

Yes, that's human nature. People always demand more personal freedom and less government control; yet when anarchy breaks out, the same people then blame the government for not doing their job. Such is life, we have learned to deal with it

Case in point. People are blowing their motor up with 35+ maps; imagine if you have had 80+ maps to play with... with more maps, you motor probably would have only lasted one month instead of three months

Give us a little more time, we are working to incorporate some custom features to accommodate the Sprintex charger... So instead of doing separate updates, we are doing one comprehensive "version upgrade".

Remember, the best comes to those who wait...

This is a fair warning. People should know 100% of what they are buying, and better yet, know their own limitations... Thus another reason to subscribed to Custom Remote Tuning

 

This has truth to it. But at the cost of the stand alone (A little over $2000) You are getting much much more... So much more infact that 99% of people who use them will take it to a real professional tuner, as is recomended straight forward from even before the purchace. Plus more tuners know more about the standalone systems (Because the base program is not specific to only one car) than they do about a system they may have never seen before. This gives more "RELYABLE" tunability than using our stock ECU, by anyone who really does tunes.
FYI: They dont make you start from scratch either. (Atleast with the ViPEC) It is sold as a direct replacement and programed to run just like stock, or the distributer can do a custom tune at the time of purchace.

I'm still on board with ByteTroniK. It does a decent job at it's intended purpose, but in the wrong hands it can be just as destructive as it can be productive in the right hands.

 

For once I agree with 90ish% of what you said in post #17.

 

It's nice that MINI owners have yet another option to run their "Off Road" vehicles... and that has been discussed in another thread. Let's keep this one back on track.

FYI: there will be a CARB-Legal version of FA coming down the pipeline really soon... Stay tuned

 

If my Mini ends up becoming the toy project and retiring from the DD duties, I will likely head more towards this unit vice a stand alone. Lots of planning involved as my budget for the build will be whatever money the MR2 parts out for, and this is looking like the better cost effective approach, and hearing it is working out well for other Sprintex owners, that's always a plus too!

 

Just want to point out one more time, the MINI ECU behaves and operates differently than the Evo/STi ecu, as such, the maps are going to be DIFFERENT. They were not "left out" if they are not present in the code, right? FA provides over 35 maps on the current version, and the other tuning tool out there for MINI (costing over USD10,000 only provides 11 maps) and the tuner only adjust 5 to7 out of the 11 maps on that program...

People keep on forgetting, FA is only "translating" the 0101011101 from the ecu into a GUI so our brains can more easily understand the infomation.

FYI: FA has "Injector Battery Compensation"... Aka "Injector latency"... the map is there, you just have to know what you're looking for.

We tuned the Sprintex 70mm MINI with FA53 and got it to pass CARB Certification on the stock injectors while gaining almost 30WHP over the M45 (bone stock MINI, the only difference is the supercharger)... and California has the strictest smog regulations... so the tool is capable of doing a lot, the question is, how good is your calibrator (aka Tuner)?

Can someone name another MINI Tuning program out there that have maps that are CARB-Certified? Please share...

 

I'm waiting to see what the custom features for us Sprintex owners are.

Having individual maps for specific mods that you can load whenever you want is great, I actually have seperate maps for power & economy, for example my car is still my DD, I run my power map for everyday back & forth, I avg. between 26.5 & 28 mpg, depending on my aggressiveness and get about 28.5 for hwy cruising, but if I have a road trip to go on, like when I went to the dragon this year, I loaded my economy map for the drive there, this map gets me right @ 32.5 mpg if I stay under 70mph, when I got there, loaded my power map back in for fun, and so on.

Make as many maps as you want, load them when ever you want, at no additional cost.

Honestly, tuning aside, just the convience of some of the features that are built in to the software are worth it for someone like me simply because I live nowhere near to anyone who can do this stuff except my dealer, and we all know what it can be like to go to them with issues and a modded car.

 

 

I use the FA53, like all the interface/software, if you do shït, you will break something.

The advantage is to have the map and no need to find them yourself, the logger is GREAT, personnaly i love it.
I never saw an OBD logger so fast and easy to use.

Of course a programmable ECU will be even more open than the Stock Siemens, it is more dangerous too, as it does not have all the stock Securities and cost A LOT !

We are not the greatest tuners on earth, but we did a lot of R53 with standard Tools (WinOLS/ECM and Generic Interace), FA53 is the fastest to access everything, really fast writting, less than 30sec, other are more around 3mins, usefull maps without headache to find them, and again, the LOGGER !!

For me programmable ECU and FA53 war is stupid, it is not the same use, for 95% of R53 Mods the FA53 is enough. (no need of an expansive device for a pulley and an airbox)

 

And $800.00 is NOT a lot?

To me it is... Especially when we where promised constant updates, and have YET to get even ONE.

 

$750 is not chump change for anyone, but for the features that FA offers, it's not Expensive. Go check out EVC and see how much they charge for a reflashing tool (and you still have to find your own maps).

We never promised "constant updates"; we promised that all future FA Upgrades will be free of charge to existing customers. We are wrapping up the final testing phase of the new version, once everything is fully tested at our end, then it will be released thru the Tech forum. Expect this announcement to come before the end of this month.

FYI, in the software world, you don't want to see "constant updates." Updates are needed to patch bugs in the software

 

Let''s stay on topic. And may I just remind everyone of the site guidelines:

I don't want to have to start swinging.