I figured since I went through the upgrading myself and ended up with a very successful install of the front light kit as well as the rear, I thought I'd share my thoughts on their operation as well as some cool things I found out about them.

To use the lights, the headlights or foglights must be on. They will not come on with just the running lights on, or by themselves.

The rear fogs remain on with either the low or high beams, unlike front fogs which extinguish with high beam use. Turning off the lights or restarting the car requires you to turn the rear fogs (front fogs too, for that matter) back on (this is a good thing).

Cool feature: If you turn on just the running lights and the front foglights without the headlights, you can turn on the rear fogs. The cool part is when you 'flash' your high beams, the rear fogs go out, and come back on when you release the high beams switch. In other words, you can flash a warning from both ends of the car. This is valuable in very low visibility situations.

For those with everything but rear lights, the upgrade process is very easy, just a toggle bank with the missing switch and a recoding of the body control computer to make it all work. Adding front lights is a great deal more involved, with wiring needed to be installed under the hood as well as under the dash. A recode is required as well. The 'official' instructions for installing the front foglights contain a couple errors, but is otherwise useable. Not for the faint of heart though. Since most people seem to have the foglights up front anyway, it doesnt matter much. You dont need front foglights to have the rears.

For those wanting to keep their brake light mod, the 'diode mod' in whatever form works well. Best of both worlds. And you get to have the all-important full row of toggle switches. For those who dont want rear fogs but would like the switch to be useable for other lighting, it's a simple matter to tap into the wiring for the rear fog to use as a control (relay drive) for additional auxiliary lighting up front.

This should have been an option on U.S.-spec cars from the start!

 

Thanks for the great rear fog light education, Greatbear. I've been following your posts.

Now here's a dumb question, if folks don't mind. With the standard red lenses in the back of the Mini, do the rear fog lights shine a red color? Initially, I assumed it was white, like most front fog lights, but in the rear, you have these red lenses, so it seems that they would come on as red.

Is that correct?

If it is, would another way of thinking of the rear fogs be like this? They provide a dimly lit upper red light on the back of the Mini, presuming the headlight or fog light switch is on?

So for folks with rear fogs *and* Greatbear's rear fog mod, they get all of this described above, *plus* the rear fogs shine brightly when the brake is pressed.

If I understood all of this correctly, I would always put on the rear fogs, just to provide more of a "dim red" illumination to the back of the vehicle during nighttime driving.

Sorry for the clueless questions. My MCS hasn't been born yet, and I don't have ready access to a Mini. I'm currently thinking of going with the rear fogs (my order goes in late December or early January) and then doing the white tail lamp and Greatbear's brake mod after taking delivery.

Oh, that reminds me: one last question. I know that you're supposed to add red bumper reflectors when doing the white tail lamp install. Why don't the white tail lamps have reflectors built into them, like most tail lamps? Seems like if Mini did that with a white reflective material, the problem would be solved. Unless, of course, the DOT requires *red* reflectors.

Lots of little questions, thanks to anyone in advance for any help.

Thank you,
Dan

 

>>Thanks for the great rear fog light education, Greatbear. I've been following your posts.
>>
>>Now here's a dumb question, if folks don't mind. With the standard red lenses in the back of the Mini, do the rear fog lights shine a red color?

The Rear Fogs shine brightly in Red.
>>
>>So for folks with rear fogs *and* Greatbear's rear fog mod, they get all of this described above, *plus* the rear fogs shine brightly when the brake is pressed.
>>
>>If I understood all of this correctly, I would always put on the rear fogs, just to provide more of a "dim red" illumination to the back of the vehicle during nighttime driving.
>>

If you have the rear fog brake mod, the bright red rear fog lights illuminate when you step on the brake pedal, in addition to the standard rear brake lights.

>>Oh, that reminds me: one last question. I know that you're supposed to add red bumper reflectors when doing the white tail lamp install. Why don't the white tail lamps have reflectors built into them, like most tail lamps? Seems like if Mini did that with a white reflective material, the problem would be solved. Unless, of course, the DOT requires *red* reflectors.

DOT requirement, check with your congressional representative for a change.

 

I will offer this about rear-fog lights. They are indeed a good idea, whilest common (and required) in Europe. Understandable in places like rainy Belgium or the UK, thye are much rarer in the U.S. People don't fully understand them, so just keep that in mind.

I see many people driving around with them on accidentally (classic example, the 2001-2004 Olds Auroras, people don't know what they are). Only use em if visibility is poor... They are annoying on a clear night.

I've had more than one person tell me "are you brake lights broken" or "those brake lights are awwfuly bright" :smile:

caio, -Matt

 

Thanks for the clarifications, MGCMAN, and for the advice "only use em if visibility is poor", zfxr.

I remain confused on one last point:

> Why don't the white tail lamps have reflectors built into them,
> like most tail lamps?

Is there white reflective material in the white tail lamps? Or is the *red* reflector the DOT requirement that I need to petition my congressman for a change? :smile:

Thanks in advance,
Dan

 

Ok, I called my dealer again and answered my own questions:

1) There is *no* reflective material in the white tail lamps.

2) The Mini dealer will *not* install both the white tail lamps *and* rear fogs. They won't do it, for liability reasons.

3) On any car, the rear reflectors must be *red*. Makes sense, since you wouldn't want any white light coming out the back of your car to confuse those behind you.

(Unless, of course, you are in reverse and backing up, in which case you *do* want white lights. :smile:

Hmmm, that leads to another question. Can you install a replacement reverse/backup light that is brighter than the standard backup light? I often run my dogs on back country roads late at night and use the backup light to help myself find them. :smile: A super bright backup light would be awesome.

Cheers,
Dan

 

>>I will offer this about rear-fog lights. They are indeed a good idea, whilest common (and required) in Europe. Understandable in places like rainy Belgium or the UK, thye are much rarer in the U.S. People don't fully understand them, so just keep that in mind.
>>
>>I see many people driving around with them on accidentally (classic example, the 2001-2004 Olds Auroras, people don't know what they are). Only use em if visibility is poor... They are annoying on a clear night.
>>
>>I've had more than one person tell me "are you brake lights broken" or "those brake lights are awwfuly bright" :smile:
>>
___________________
Sense and Sensibility.
>>caio, -Matt

 

>>If it is, would another way of thinking of the rear fogs be like this? They provide a dimly lit upper red light on the back of the Mini, presuming the headlight or fog light switch is on?
>>
>>Dan

/rant
The rear fog light is an extremely bright light meant to be used in inclement weather when visibility is less than 50meters. If one drives in Europe with the rear fog on when it is clear, they will be mercilessly flashed by other motorists until they correct their error and turn off the bright, annoying light. Don't ask me how I know. :smile: I believe you can receive a citation there if it is used improperly.

The problem with the rear fogs in the US is that most drivers are clueless and adhere to the 'more is better' philosophy rather than what is necessary and prudent. I have followed, and been annoyed by, numerous drivers in Euro cars blinding me needlessly with the rear fog on a clear night.

As with front fog lights, use them in poor visibility conditions, not be cause 'they are there' or 'they look cool'.
rant

 

Dan,

Yes you can get higher-power halogen reverse bulbs (I got a pair for my Olds Intrigue), they do help. You can even get them integrated with the "reverse beepers" (if U want to simulate a delivery truck!) as an option.

Caio,

-Matt

 

Cool, thanks Matt, although I think I'll skip the backup-beep sound for now.

(Speaking of backing up, I almost went for the Parking Distance Control until the dealer told me they put four visible sensors in your rear bumper. I didn't want to change the look of the bumper for something that's not needed, so it's no longer on my order.)

Any suggestions on where to get a higher-power halogen reverse bulb(s), what size/part#, and what amount of power is the max I should go before I burn something back there?

Thank you,
Dan

 

I got mine long ago thru Autobulbdepot.com
They seem to be dead now? (bad computer?)

 

I currently have the standard red tail lamps with the amber turn indicator, as well the rear fog lamps. My question is, if I switch to the red tail lamps with the white turn indicator are there any wiring changes required. Seems to be this would be a straight forward exchange, other than an amber bulb for the white turn indicator.

 

you realize with the '05 rear assemblies.. the rear fogs are no longer in the assembly , it is moved to where the backup light was..


because of the height of the new position, you cannot get fog lights installed by the dealer in California, and one other state,i believe.

has anybody tried the dual stop lamp mod on an '05? it looks like there is a bulb there.. but i have never seen a car with it lit..

 

I forgot to add that my Mini is a 2003 model, and the fog lights are located within the tail lamp assembly.