I'm trying to understand the logic here ...

Why wouldn't MINI make some of these aftermarket upgrades standard in, at least, the MINI S? Yes, I realize things like exhaust can be expensive but in cases like a pulley upgrade, the cost for MINI to put a higher performance pulley in the car would be minimal. Why not add in the lower cost upgrades as standard and put out a car with more HP and better efficiency?

I've heard mention of a company putting out aftermarket MINI parts that are approved by MINI and covered under warranty. Any news on this subject?

~Steve~

 

They do....Its called JCW kit.

 

Individual parts, smarty pants.

 

Easy question. How would they possibly justify $6k+ for the JCW kit if they're only giving you <$2k of parts??? And when you consider core charges!!!

Seriously, since the pulley makes almost ALL of the torque gain for the JCW, they'd have to charge $3000 for it. When tuners such as Randy from WebbMotorsports and Eric of Helix only charge around $400 installed AND considering that Randy and Eric have much more experience doing MINI installs than the average MINI tech, which pulley would you get????

 

I believe margin of safety and cost are the main reasons. Automobile manufacturers want to deliver a cost effective product that can operate under the broadest range of conditions. For example:
Tubular headers would be expensive to mass-produce with high levels of quality.
A car with a 15% pulley that is "accidentally" filled 87 octane gas on a humid 100 degree day may blow the engine.

Mopar with the Dodge SRT 4 Neon is the most extensive factory-backed mod program I know of. It's a new program, so we'll have to wait and see how it pans out.

We have the Cooper Works option, but it's quite expensive.

Then there's companies like Dinan and Saleen that are aftermarket tuners with warrenty agreements with the manufacturers8)

 

When you consider that they went from a standard cooper with around 115hp to an 'S' version with 163hp that's a significant difference and no mater where they stop with HP improvements there will always be aftermarket products to improve further. They have to stop at some point and they have emissions and warranty tradeoffs to worry about. The aftermarket doesn't have to worry about either. I like aftermarket products, that way I can put the products I want on the car and I can make my car better than it was from the factory.

 

Good points! I think I tend to look at these things from a marketing point of view since I have more knowledge in such things over my knowledge of cars. I would love to promote the MCS as a complete monster. I would be the designer at MINI pushing to make it as powerful as possible off the lot. But I do understand these points and I know how car enthusiasts really enjoy customizing and aftermarket choices.

 

You would think that the BMW M3 would be perfect from the factory as well, or a Benz Coupe....but tuners like Dinan, Brabus and many others make a killing off the desire of owners to be faster, stiffer, cooler or whatever. It's also a matter of MINI sells cars to make money - coilovers, springs and exhausts (just a few examples) are not going to be high volume sellers for them. Think about how many MINI owners are really going to get bit by the upgrade bug...of course, on MCO and in performance mods, many of us have dropped a few grand on parts already - but we are a small number of overall owners. How many MINI's have been sold so far? 50,000?

 

I think that even though you read a lot on MCO and other forums about modded MINIs, there are plenty of bone stock One's, MC's and MCS's on the streets, folks that are plenty happy with the cars as they are.
The rest of us, those who have to mod, do something, personalize the car and make it individual, it's just that: you want your car to reflect what you like, you want to be able to make choices: BMP, ALTA, Pilo intake or others, which sway bar, which rims. UUC, Supersprint, Borla or Quicksilver.

 

The desire to modify the car will always be there. If they built a 300hp Mini, people would be pushing it to 350hp. Even if they put Brembo brake kits, people would still be modifying them. I see that Stillen has a kit for the G35, in which they ditch the Brembo brakes and put another kit on. For most people the Brembo brakes would be awesome, but people are still chucking them for more, more, more.... Even Vipers, Porsches and Ferraris are heavily modified even though these are some of the best cars on the market, performance wise.

I agree with the previous posters. It was really a decision to make an overall well balanced car, economical,and as reliable as possible. I think the current MCS does an excellent job at that. BMW has to stand behind this product so it has to be as reliable as possible. Also, it allows a whole tuning community to be built, allow people to express themselves, and even allow BMW to jump into the tuning market for the car. From a marketing perspective the current scenario makes more sense than putting a small hatchback, with the same level of quality and reliability with 300hp, better handling and better braking for $40k-$50k. It really starts pushing the car into another bracket such as an M3 or used Vipers. Most people would scoff at paying more for the car even if it does come with more performance and enhancements. That is why a lot of the people can't believe people who are maxing out the car from Mini with a sticker price of $43K.

 

>>I'm trying to understand the logic here ...
>>
>>Why wouldn't MINI make some of these aftermarket upgrades standard in, at least, the MINI S? Yes, I realize things like exhaust can be expensive but in cases like a pulley upgrade, the cost for MINI to put a higher performance pulley in the car would be minimal. Why not add in the lower cost upgrades as standard and put out a car with more HP and better efficiency?
>>
>>I've heard mention of a company putting out aftermarket MINI parts that are approved by MINI and covered under warranty. Any news on this subject?
>>
>>~Steve~


Its too early. MINI doesn't see a need right now to offer anything other than JCW. Like said earlier... A Webb pulley costs $, JCW $$$$. Its profit for MINI and when someone shows up with a non-JCW for work... there's more $$$$ because no warranty.

IMO, JCW sales will tank and MINI might get a clue---too late.

_________________
-goin440 IB/IB MC on 17" Volks

 

Alot of it has to do with the cost and where the car fits in with the rest of the company's models...in this case BMWs. BMW has a specific spot that the MINI fills and they don't want that overlapping with other cars they sell. If the car was making 300hp from the factory, rear or all wheel drive, etc then the sales of other BMWs would have a chance of falling. BMW wants this car to be an introduction to BMWs for people that are looking for a car in this price range, or as a 2nd car for a person that drives a BMW for daily use.

 

JCW is gravy for the Dealers repair shop income. MiniUSA are most likely selling the parts to the dealers at a profit, and you are paying for approx 12hrs of labor charges for something that should just be installed at build time in Germany!

Mini has no incentive to offer some of these aftermarket products because the extra revenu will most likely not out weight the extra burdern/waranty hassles associated with offering these products.

The could go the Misu Evo route, offer OEM aftermarket parts as stock from the factory, lowering production costs thus increasing their incentive to offer a better deal.

I'm curious about the numbers, but I'm sure the modding community for MINI's is a small number compared with the number of people who do not Mod, or Modded by buying the JCW kit.

 

In my mind, the MCS JCW package is not worth more than $2.5K $3K tops including installation. For example, when you go from the regular Cooper to the MCS, the price difference is $3K. Those $3K get you 48HP more, better engine mechanicals, nicer wheels, a superb 6-speed Getrag transmission, ASC+T, a hood scoop, SS+ suspension and enhanced exterior cosmetics (Including sport seats). So to me MINI really gives you your money's worth for those $3K bucks.

Now by comparison, the JCW kit costs $6,500 installed ($4,500 for the kit alone) and you are getting 37HP more over the standard MCS, a new engine header, pulley and ECU programming, exhaust tips and a couple of JCW stickers. See where the problem is?

For $6,500, the JCW kit should give you race seats, kick *** wheels, improved brake and suspension packages, etc.

MINI is making a killing on every JCW kit they sell, like 500% profit. True you still get covered by the MINI warranty, but is that worth all that money?


There is a huge disparaty when going from a Cooper S to a Cooper S with the JCW Kit. I have driven the JCW MCS and while it is nice, you can accomplish very similar results for mucho less dinero.

 

For a small percentage of JCW buyers, they want excluvisity, regardless of cost and value. The badging and oooohs and ahhhhhs from people at meets is enough.

 

>>For a small percentage of JCW buyers, they want excluvisity, regardless of cost and value. The badging and oooohs and ahhhhhs from people at meets is enough.


And probably the expect resale value of having a serial numbered JCW kit. Maybe from an investment point of view makes sense, but otherwise?

 

JCW - MINI/BMW makes money, John Cooper makes money, Your Dealer make money and you dealer get's the installation money.... mucho denerio removed from your wallet and put into others....

 

Exactly. Typical BMW, no?

 

Typical of almost any luxury type marketing - watches, cameras, stereo equipment - $$$$$ & low production create desire, buzz & jealousy

 

...and jealousy leads to stolen tire valve caps! :smile:

 

As a teenager, I made model cars. I modified EVERYTHING! Do not ask me why, but at times it is pretty funny (strange). As with my MCS: Why would you want a chrome grill when the MCS is distinctive with the body color? Why? Because! If it is white, make it black. If it is chrome, paint it! If it is quiet and efficent, put something loud on it! All to make it unique! I am an observer, do not have answers!

 

I'm convinced its a chronic condition. There are those of us who Mod ( 10% - 15%) and there is everyone else. I've owned seven vehicles and modded them all. Hell, I've even thrown a K&N filter and Mintex brake pads on my wife's family hauler. It's gotta be genetic, or an addiction, I just can't stop myself.

(As I type these words, my Kosei K-1 and winter tires are on their way here and I'm enameling a big red "S" on the aftermarket aluminum pedal pads I bought. My name is MGCMAN and I am a car modder....)

 

I think I'm an odd-ball in that the MINI is the only car I've ever modded. I look @ my other two vehicles, and I still don't feel any urge to tinker. They're good at what they do, and I can't see tricking them out at all.

The MINI, on the other hand, in stock form was (for me) *almost* perfect. I could "feel" the potential for a ride-of-a-lifetime in it; it just needed a nudge. So I queued up and let Randy do his stuff, and now I own a perpetual grin machine.

As for why BMW doesn't deliever them that way in the first place, remember that most folks have been "trained" through years of automotive mediocrity to expect mushy, soft and unresponsive vehicles. The stock MINI may be pushing the limits of divergence from the norm pretty well already. Judging by the JDPowers feedback on the ride quality; it seems BMW still cares about keeping the car acceptable to the masses.

I don't think the issue is the cost of the A/M upgrades (JCW profit motivations aside); for BMW it's more an issue of it's easier to be sure they're competing against similar sized cars of other makes if consumers *don't* view the MINI as being too radical. So ride can't get too hard, noise can't get too loud, and vehicle can't be too demanding in the power/weight categories.

 

>>When you consider that they went from a standard cooper with around 115hp to an 'S' version with 163hp that's a significant difference and no mater where they stop with HP improvements there will always be aftermarket products to improve further. They have to stop at some point and they have emissions and warranty tradeoffs to worry about. The aftermarket doesn't have to worry about either. I like aftermarket products, that way I can put the products I want on the car and I can make my car better than it was from the factory.
>>

Forgive me, but I'm one of those cynical types that think Mini reverse-engineered the Cooper and ONE from the S/Works.

Mini didn't just happened to consider supercharging the engine - It was PLANNED from the get go! The engine was absolutely designed for it!

I'd also wager that a few of the S test mules were actually works S's.

You don't really believe that 200 horsepower was an afterthought. C'mon, German engineers? ..I mean really!

 

I am one of those who can't leave well enough alone, meaning I always modify my vehicles in different ways, more power, custom touches, personalizing, etc. The MINI practically begs for this sort of thing. True, the 'out of box experience' rivals that of most other cars out there, period. Styling unlike any other, unbelievable handling, decent power, and possibly the highest option to vehicle-size ratio there ever was. You can customize your car quite a bit before you even take delivery.

I have been modding my car a little at a time using factory and aftermarket items and parts, and I have barely started. I can never have too much power, and the handling of the S, as good as it is, can still be improved further at modest costs. The JCW kit is considered the ultimate factory 'customization' but it suffers from a high price to performance ratio. Would I get it? Sure, but only if I could buy it myself, off the shelf, and install everything myself and keep the 'charger and cylinder head instead of returning them as 'cores'. I'll only involve the dealer for programming the ECU. The $4k of the kit would be offset by my own labor to install and the leftover parts that can be sold or modified and fitted to another car.Would it make a difference if I installed it versus the dealer? That's a perception issue, but I know I would do a better job. Would the dealer/BMW balk at warranty issues? You bet they would. Would I take that risk? Uh uh, most definitely.

The MINI appeals to those sorts who value their individuality. As such, most of them will do something to 'personalize' their car to some degree. To some, it might be just a cupholder or an armrest. Others will go for the roof graphics or stereos, and there will be those who mod their cars for handling and/or power. I'll be doing most of this.

The aftermarket has some really cool goodies for our cars, and so does the factory. I say, use both these resources!