I'm new to NAM and new to Minis. I've done a good bit of research in the past year on Minis, and I've had my fair share of experience working on cars from the 1960s to the 2000s, and I've done a decent bit of welding and metal fabrication at my old job.

I've got the Minifinity Ultimate Mini Buyers Guide printed out, read, and on hand.
I've got the MiniMania Rust Detection article printed out, read, and on hand as well.

While I've read tons about minis, the only one I've ever driven is the one I'm consdering purchasing:
http://www.minimania.com/web/id/8209...ale_Detail.cfm
http://classicmini.shutterfly.com/

The current owner has had it for a bit over a year and I don't think she's trying to hide anything, but I don't know about the previous owner. My only real concern is that there may be hidden rust that I'm just not able to see because of what seems to be a relatively new paint job.

I got to hear the car cold-start on a day that it was about 40 degrees outside, and it started fine, but took a good 10-15 minutes to warm up enough so that I could press the gas pedal down at a fairly normal speed without making the engine bog down. Once it was warmed up it seemed to run great, shifted well, and road/handled well (brand new front suspension cones). I looked underneath and the subframes seemed solid without any rust. I was originally told that they thought the engine was a 1000cc, but then just emailed me to a day ago and said the found the engine tag that says 12HE on it, implying it's likely a 1275cc. I'm 99% sure the car is pieced together from a bunch of other cars, but overall I was rather impressed with it.

Just so you know, my plans are to drive it as a pseudo everyday driver for a year or two and then do a vtec conversion and full body restoration. I'll still have my my truck, motorcycles, and festiva (yes I love that car) to rely on if the mini fails me at any given time, but I'm selling my Audi S4 to make room for the mini. While I dont think there is anything I couldnt do to the mini, ideally I'd prefer not to get into any huge projects for the next year or so. Money is also not a huge issue with me but knowing my own habits if something does go wrong, instead of paying to have a shop fix it (since I probably won't have time), I'll just figure out a way to make time to do it myself or put it off until I have legit free time.

To give you a basic idea of how good/bad I am at working with my hands: I've built a tube chassic vw bug w/ a sbc 350 v8, but never felt right with my own custom made front suspension, so it's being swapped out with the front rolling subframe of an MG and I built the sbc from the block up without without much problem. I've never gotten into transmission internals. Also, while I still have the same abilities that I use to, my shop is now my garage with more limited tools and space instead of a huge fab shop with anything and everything that i could ever want.

So now tell me why I should(n't) buy this mini, and please be as critical as you want. Any and all opinions welcome.

 

thank you for sharing if you happen to have any specific questions please mark them with a (?)

 

sounds like you have the skills to deal with the body work

There's a 'body kit' covering the sills and if I read the pictures right it appears many of the rust spots are in the small portion of the sills peaking out. I'd try hard to see what's under there... Having just cut out and replaced sills I can say it is certainly doable. The other spots are in 'common' places. Be sure to pull the carpet up and look at the inner sills and floor pans. And take a GOOD look at the subframes (get on a lift) to b sure there isn't just a good coat of paint or undercoating covering ills.

I'm not sure I buy 1970 .... from the dash and especially that cowl on top of the engine, but if it is re-engined who knows....what it says on the title don't mean squat. That's the date that got it into the country....

$6000 is a decent price if it is street legal - even tho VA gives a car running antique plates a get out of jail card as far as safety inspections goes you might consider running it thru the inspection process just to find out.... (I lived in Norfolk when I aquired my 79) But at $6k I'd be expecting to find rust...

So far as using it as a daily driver....well you can find many threads and opinions on that one.

 

From what I seen in the photos, most all of the rust that's obvious, is easily repaired. The only areas I'd be real concerned with are those that are covered by the kit.

If Vtec is in your future, then the larger wheel openings will be to your advantage. But lose those cheesy flares and get some nicer sports pack style. They look better around the bumpers as well.

For $6K, it ain't bad. I have some serious doubts about its vintage from the looks of the interior. I could be wrong, but it just seems to me to be much newer then the 1970 indicated. This is often a problem with the classic,as so much can be done to make one look older or newer then it actually is. (see the re-vin posts thru-out NAM)

Good Luck with your search and if this Mini does indeed become a part of your stable, keep it's upgrades posted here and at MiniMania.

 

The flares and siderails are the biggest thing I don't like about the car. As far as looks go, I think they look a bit cheesy, and for rust, I'm afraid they were put on to cover up bad rust. Since the seller is very reasonable sounding and said she will negotiate the price because of the known rust, I think I can work a deal where I pay a certain price upfront, take the car and a bill-of-sale contingent on a full flare/side rail removal and inspection while she holds the title, then pull the flares and side rail to check for rust. After getting it all pulled apart have her come look at it too if she wants so she knows I'm not making anything up one way or the other, and then depending on the rust condition, we'll determine one of two prearranged prices that we both agreed to upfront as fair sale prices given the results of the rust inspection.

I really don't think it's a '70 either, and I'm pretty sure it's a re-vin, but I know she bought it in the same condition 13-14 months ago and was able to title, register, and drive it no problem. The only issue right now is that the turn signals don't work, but the 4 way flashers do. I figured it's either a bad signal switch (but I'm hoping it isn't), bad wiring, or a bad flasher (if it turns out to be the setup which uses two flashing units for the 4ways and the signals. Regardless, legally I can use hand signals in a pinch, but in a worst case scenario, I can take a couple hours to run a temporary wire from any ignition switched power supply, split it to a three way rocker switch or even just two cheap two way switches, and run those directly to the left and right signal wiring (obviously with appropriate fuses/breakers). Even though I can always play the antique plates game, I'd still take the car in for a yearly $15 safety inspection just because it's a cheap and easy way to find out at least the bare minimum amount of issues I need to address.

I've read almost every opinion. I know there will likely be days it won't start, that it's a death trap in an accident with an SUV, and it's not the smoothest ride in the worth, but people told me the same stuff and worse about crazier things I've driven in the past.

As a good personal anecdote that should hopefully make you laugh/frown/surprised/something and also give you an idea of why I'd even consider a mini as a pseudo daily driver...
One day when I was bored, I called my buddy Jess to see where he was on his 3 month motorcycle trip around the US. He was in Oregon. I looked in online classifieds and found a wrecked 2001 R6 sportbike in Pasco, WA. Called the guy, asked if it was drivable, and flew out the next day. On my layover in Denver, I got a message from the seller saying he couldnt pick me up from the airport like he promised, but that he payed for a reserved a rental car in my name so I could just drive that the 3 hours to his house. I got to Seatle to find out the rental car company would not allow me to rent the car because I was not 25 yet. So I hitchhiked to the bus station, bought a ticket for the next morning, and went to sleep with about a dozen local bums, sitting upright on a bench holding my motorcycle helmet and wearing a full leather 2pc race suit. The next morning I took a 7 hour bus ride (b/c of stops) to Pasco, met the seller at the bus stop and went to go see the bike. The bike supposedly only had "minimal cosmetic damage." The bike really had bad front brake calipers (almost seized up), a transmission w/ no second gear, missing body parts, and a bunch of faulty wiring. One of the headlights was busted out and the entire nose of the bike was broken off at the fairing stay, so it was only held on by the rashed up plastic fairings. The tires were also in bad shape. I went to walmart, bought some basic tools, a bunch of wire, duct tape, zip ties, PB blast, some rope, and two gas cans. I spent the day working on the bike. Got one of the two front calipers working well, duct taped all the rashed or broken parts of the body, wiretied the snapped fairing stay back together, ran new wiring to get the a lights all function with at least tail lights, brake lights, rear turn signals, a headlight, and a highbeam. I also messed with the carbs a bit because it was running pretty poorly at first. I finally got the bike drivable and set out at 9:30 PM sunday night. I knew I was behind schedule, so I drove 1500 miles to Nebraska thinking my buddy was much further along in his return trip than I thought. I called him Tuesday morning and found out he stopped in Cheyenne Wyoming (which I drove right through the night before) and that he decided to go south to Denver instead of east back home. By the way, he still thought I was at home and getting ready to go back to school in 4 or 5 days. I finally tracked him down in Denver in the next 30 hours after crisscrossing paths about 4 times. We hung out for a bit, went to sleep, and then rode the next day together. After 12 hours in the saddle he decided to call it quits. I decided to go ahead and get back home for school since I only had another 1200 miles to go. The next 1200 miles involved me taking two naps sitting in parks at picnic tables for 20-30 minutes each, again wearing full leather race gear, and then finishing 4 of the last 6 hours in the trip driving through "torrential downpours" where at points I was driving through 6 inches of water on flood highways doing 10 mph. All in all I did about 4200 miles in a bit less than 4 days on a cramped up 600cc sportbike and had nothing but fun. Oh, and I ended up getting back to school 1 day late for classes.

I'm definitely not saying that I make the smartest decisions, but I usually manage to make them work out no matter what. So when I'm driving my mini on a daily basis, I'll be expecting to have mechanical problems here and there, and I generally drive to and from work when there isn't much traffic on the road anyway.

Thanks for the help so far. I'm really excited about getting this mini and if I do, I'll keep you all posted. If I don't get it, then that just means I'll be looking for another one shortly.



I attached a picture Jess took in Denver after I knocked on his hotel room door and he opened surprised to see me standing there. I really didnt know why I was there other than to say hi, so I just asked him, "is this where the blue bikes park?" You can see the preparation difference between our two rigs. My biggest packed item was the spare helmet that came with the bike. I put a quart of spare oil inside the helmet figuring it would be fine. When I finally got home and pulled the helmet off the bike, I found the oil had busted open and got all over the inside of the helmet and the helmet got thrown away. It was the longest distance Ive ever carried something to put it in the trash can.

 

You have more than a little rust there. My bet is its a 90's Mini and one of the rustier prone runs of Minis.

Pull out the liners from the back seat pockets and inspect the bottom (if there is any) with a flashlight. Look where the captured nuts are for the sub mounts. Lift the carpets and inspect edges. Look for water settling. Inspect the metal around the fresh air intake on the right side (way up in the fender well-it usually rusts out and lets water in). Check the boot floor under the spare and at the rear of each wheelwell. Check the bottom edges of the door underneath and the bottom edge of the boot lid. Check the front & rear valences. Water runs down the inside where the door hinges are, back through the sills and ends up at the rear sub mounts. This is all hidden by the body kit.

My bet for minimum panel replacement is:

1. inner sill repairs and complete outer sills
2. possible door step repairs
3. subframe mount bulkhead ends (where the front of the rear sub bolts on)
4. quarter panel repairs in front & behind arches
5. A-panel replacements
6. windscreen scuttle ends - need to take A-panels off anyway, but this means front wings off (fenders) too.

Looks like major work. You can find a better body shell for $6,000 than this. Buy the best body shell you can find. Don't worry so much about mechanicals.

Body panel directory/source
http://www.m-machine.co.uk/MM%20Panels_Directory.htm

 

Minimad, thanks for your post, I really appreciate it tons. I'm definitely going to see if I can pull the kit to inspect it.

I know this is very subjective, but given a few of the following scenarios, can you give me an idea of what a reasonable purchase price and a "great deal" purchase price would be?

a) assuming the rust is really bad, pretty much worst case scenario where someone just tried to cover it all up and paint it

b) assuming the rust is not actually too bad, as in if someone actually tried to do a good resto job on it, but screwed up in a number of places where rust is coming through, but the rest of the car seems to be pretty solid

Sorry if these are really dumb questions, but while I've obviously been able to read and learn tons about minis in general, it's hard to tell how much an individual mini would actually be worth until I saw a bunch up them up close and figured out how much each would actually sell for. I'm sure two years from now I'll have a much better understanding of pricing, but I don't feel like the last year I've spent looking has given me too much solid information. It's also really tough because it seems like minis just don't turn up for sale very often and the few that do always seem to really vary in price by a huge margin.

 

First step is admitting the problem.

Second step is not buying the first car you look at without checking out if theres something better

Third step is finding a better mini.

Why put a couple of thousand into repairing a rusted out body when you can spend the same amount up front to get a body that won't be pieced together with repair panels. I know you want to buy a cheap one now and then put money into it later when you have money to put into it. I've been down that road and knowing what I know now I'd wait till I had more money for better one.

 

Some of that rust is coming from the inside out which means the holes are not a screw up in the body work. You patch the hole and another one forms right next to it. At first glance you're going to have to do some major panel replacement to fix it right.

 

Since you are a novice, let me show you what you could end up working on:

http://s355.photobucket.com/albums/r...%20Cooper%20S/

If this shell were the age of the car you are looking (80's-90's) at it would have been parted and scrapped. However, since it is a 64 1071 S and among the rarer Minis, (and I'm dumber than a stone) I am attempting to restore it. Is this what you are looking for?

Your Mini is simply not worth this kind of effort. Frankly, I wouldn't buy that car. If I did, I'd be looking at half the money because of the unknowns.

Do more searching. You can find a suitable Mini with a much better body shell for $6K.

 

Minimad I honestly think we should make a thread like your photoalbum and make it sticky. Show the quarter sized hole or that ever so tiny rust bubble that was there when you bought it and then show what the damage actually looks like when stripped. We could also come up with an example of what a restored car looks like after a year or two of daily driving. I think it would clear up the same questions that keep popping up around here.

 

Quite true. There is no way to explain how what appears to be a small, insignificant rust bubble can represent hundreds of dollars in repairs or weeks of work to fix it correctly. Minis are deceptive. What looks minor usually isn't.

A "restored" or properly repaired car, if maintained properly, ought to remain fairly stable even with daily driving depending on the climate in which you live. Fortunately I'm in FL and my wagon that was completed in 2005 and driven weekly (not daily, but 25,000 miles) remains good. I don't think the same would be said for a car up north.

 

You wagon still isn't your only vehicle that you park on the street that probably never gets washed. I bet you don't take yours out when you know its going to be a crappy day and it probably gets washed after you take it out. There's a big difference there between your definition of daily driving and most peoples.

 

Probably, but otoh I drove this for 3 years every day year around prior to the wagon, so I do know something about it:

 

Thanks for the replies, this has helped tons.

It's not an issue of not having money for it now, it's more so that I know I don't have time right now to do a full vtec conversion + resto job. I also know that when I do a vtec conversion, I'm going to be doing a lot of body restoration work on the body as well, so I figured buying a cheaper mini with some rust and that runs ok would suit me best for now (not saying this mini is the one now that I realize how bad the rust really could be). So knowing that I'm going to be doing significant work on it later no matter what I don't want to spend a bunch of money on a "restored" mini now and still find out it's got tons of hidden problems (which is why I'm really grateful for your, minimad's, and everyone's else replies).

I'm definitely trying to find a "better mini," but just wanted to see if you all thought this may be a decent possibility. I'll definitely keep looking for now, but it just seems like minis don't come up for sale near me all too often.

This helps tons, thanks for the perspective.

Am I missing something on the link? It seems like it's just a for sale ad for a Mini R1 conversion.

 

Why the need to stay local? Theres always one popping up here an there. Check around, craigslist sometimes will have a few show up. For some reason people in Florida like to hoard them. Buy one down there are take the autotrain home.

Since your plan is not to do anything with it right away you probably want to buy something that you can re-sale if your plans change. That car you are looking at is going to be tough to unload.

From what I see out there on your pretty much run of the mill mini, 10k+ is pretty average for a genuinely nice car (no visible rust, great shape mechanically). ~8k gets you an original that in nice shape but has some issues, less than 8k gets you something that may look ok but has been hacked together or something that has some major rust issues.

 

Link is fixed.

Decent shells are available under $8K. They will come with a 998 motor or may be a Clubman Saloon. A less popular Clubman is a good candidate as they would be cheaper and you have to replace the nose anyway for the VTEC.

Keep your eye out for unfinished projects. There have been several. This is a more challenging and expensive project than most anticipate. The costs, delays and aggravation get to people and they end up dumping them.

Like any car restoration, you'll be lucky to get your money back out of it. You limit the number of buyers by doing it.

Keep in mind that many who do finish VTEC conversions end up selling them within a year or so. They are not without their own set of issues. So, talk to as many VTEC owners as you can. Drive a couple and be absolutely sure about it before investing your hard earned cash and time.