Ive been looking for a used Mini for a while now, specifically the S. Problem is that its just so expensive and way out of my price range. The cheapest used S is $22k, while my price range can't go more than 18k.

But Ive actually been seeing quite a few cheap Mini non-s versions. I was wondering, if I could get a Mini non-s for say, 12-13k and had around 4-5k to put into performance upgrades, how close could I get it to the mini S in horsepower? Ive seen some Stage upgrades that dont look bad but not sure on the hp gain from any of them.

 

The Base Cooper is quite a bit less used- about $9000 to $14000 in my area for 2003 versions some with auto transmission.

Used Cooper S (manual) are about $17,000 on up and one sold (2003 with lots of mods) for $14,000 so it is possible.

Don't plan on getting a base Cooper and modding it for power, $4000 is hardly enough to manage that.

If you want power keep searching for a used MCS due to the benefit of the supercharger. When new the Cooper S is $3000 more than the base cooper.

Both MINIs can be upgraded for suspension and comfort features.

 

The Cooper can make pretty good power with the right mods, but then you run into other problems like the transmission. The Coopers tranny is not built to handle that much power output. I would just keep looking for a used S if that is the power that you want.

 

I've driven both MC and MCS and I have to tell you that unless your going to race you really don't need the extra horses. My MC gets up and goes just fine. Unless you own a Bugatti Veyron there's always some one a little bit faster.

 

I think you should shop around more. I'm getting ready to sell my moderately modded 2003 MCS with 78k miles on it and don't expect to get any more than $15k for it.

If your heart is set on big power, you'll be disappointed with a Cooper.

 

I agree, in the twisties I can keep up just fine with a S, and they have to work at keeping up with me On straights they do have the advantage, which is boring, as if I wanted a quick car on the straights I'd get a Mustang

The Cooper is not a non S, the S is a Cooper with an S added

Mark

 

Welcome to NAM.

Tell us more about yourself and your expectations.

What do you drive now or in the past and what are you planning to use the MINI for?

Many of us use our MINIs daily for street use but also for-
Track sessions/ lapping
Driving school events
Autocross
Car shows
Car rallys
Cruising
Canyon driving
Cross Country Trips
Plus more- be creative

How handy are you at fixing cars? Any friends with a shop with a lift?
Check on any MINI car clubs in your area- they can be a great resource- where do you live?

Once you buy your car you have to insure it and keep it up. If you get a 2003 model it will be out of warranty so you may need to pay for repairs and other things-
Tires, brakes, coolant, brake fluid change etc.

Do you drive manual transmission OK? Automatic is not available in the Cooper S in the early years, only later. CVT in the base Cooper was ok but some had problems and the early 5 speed manual in the base cooper also had some trouble- not all are OK.

Both MINI models can be modified for brakes and suspension that will greatly help handling. Wheels will fit both models and you can find some good used ones here on NAM at marketplace. Or maybe see your local club.

The base Cooper has already been somewhat optimized for power vs the MINI One which is the more basic of the two but MINI One is not sold in the US. While you can add easy things like cat back exhaust, intake, spark plug wires, and ECU tuning, it isn't that much but it's OK.

To get alot more power then you may have to change some engine internals- maybe a turbo kit, ported and polished cylinder head, race camshaft, maybe a stroker kit, custom ECU tuning, header, enlarged throttlebody, etc.

For all that work starting with a Cooper S might make more sense. The 6 speed transmission is OK. It already makes decent power. You can add a 15% reduction pulley, intake and cat back exhaust anytime for a bit more power if you want.

If commuting and good mpg is important for you then the base cooper is better. It's also lighter in weight and for urban driving works just fine. If you come from a sports car background then the Cooper S might be a better match.

 

My MC is plenty peppy for me. It lacks straight line speed, but it does well in the twistys vs the MCS.

 

For $5000 you might get 20Hp more by modding a Cooper. A nice boost but not close to the S. If you really want the extra power bite the bullet and by the S. My MCC is pretty zippy, especially over 3500rpm. And handles just a well as an MCSC.

 

Our test mule Cooper is putting down ~145 whp and lots more torque than stock. The key was the head work - we went as far as we could go with it, but that unlocked a lot of hp. Our prior baseline, with an intake, cat-back and MTH software (not the tuner version) was 112 whp and 111 ft/lbs of torque. Adding the head, Shrick cam, header and better tuning made the difference. It's pretty wicked now, IMHO.

Performance from 0-60 is very comparable to a stock S and they can't walk me on straights at the track (modified S variants can, though, for sure).

Cost? Well, ours is somewhat unique in that we did all the head work ourselves. You can drop $4-5K though and probably achieve much the same results, assuming you pick the right head.

Of course, all this power grenaded the original Midlands gearbox. We're now running the MINI Mania UK 'uprated' gearbox, but I'm still worried about it. I've retired it from AX work (still do it occassionally, but rarely and especially not if it's a 1st and 2nd gear course), but it's fine on the track since there's only one 1st-to-2nd gear transfer (where the weak spot is) and that's coming out of the pits!

So, if you wanted to do any mods to the motor (and it can be done!), I'd look for a car with the Getrag 5-speed... IIRC, they started putting them in the Cooper in 2005. It seems to be stronger and more reliable for sure.

Eventually, our Cooper will likely get a Getrag 6-speed from a donor car and new internals with shorter gearing - that should make track/AX work even more fun and we can autocross again to our heart's content!

 

My Mini was a March '04 build and my girlfriends was a April '04 build (I think, I might be off a month). I got the midlands and she got the get-trag There's definitly a difference between the two.

How can you tell when the Midlands is about to grenade?

 

Crunching when shifting between 1st and 2nd gear - popping out of 2nd in fast sweepers. Not going into gear... You know, bad kind of stuff like that...

 

Keep looking. I looked from the time the new MINI came out until last year and finally purchase a used '04 MCS for about $17,000. They're out there, you just have to be persistent and follow all leads.
Good luck.

 

oh no.....

I'm having 1st-2nd trouble but I think its becuase I'm a lazy stick driver and I'm letting off the clutch just before I put it in gear and pops out with some crunching, however that didn't start till this summer. Also reverse has been hard to get in ever since I got the car.

i hope im ok i hope im ok i hope im ok i hope im ok

 

I had the reverse issue, too. I've found that letting my foot off the break when putting it in reverse makes it go nice and smooth everytime.

 

I'll try the brake method as soon as I take my lunch! I've been doing a dark ritual to get it into reverse for quite some time.

Clutch in: try reverse
Not going engaging?
Clutch out and back in: into first, try reverse
Not going engaging?
Clutch out and back in: into first, try reverse
Not going engaging?
Furiously ram the gear shifter all over the place while punching the steering wheel as hard as you can and scream profanities as loud as you can.... Clutch out and back in: into first, try reverse, reverse engages.

 

So, did it work out for you?

 

Try going into second gear, then reverse, works for me.

Mark

 

back on topic, we have an S and a Cooper.

Sometimes I prefer to drive the cooper - ours are both 06s, but the cooper shifts better for some reason, and it is just as tossable as the S.

I personally think a cooper with intake and exhaust would be a fine car, that you can have a ton of fun with. You really only notice the difference in power at freeway speeds, where the S can accellerate more quickly. They feel VERY similar 0-30mph or so, so around town there isn't much difference at all.

I have to say I like the non-scoop bonnet better as well.

 

The brake trick didn't work

But the second gear trick worked on the first try. I didnt even have to dance on the clutch

 

about the smoothness of shifting. The Cooper is very smooth compared the S. The S seems very stiff I guess would be the word. I have driven both a Cooper (mine), and an S, the S was fun, but there just wan't mush more straight line speed to make me to terriblely excited about it. I got my Mini because of what it can do on the Twistys, and the Cooper is great there.
Just my 2 cents

 

On most trannies, reverse and second gear are on the same shaft, so going into second just lines things up, well thats how I understand it.

Mark

 

I just helped a guy find an 03 "S" with only 29K bone stock and loaded for only $17K. You can find the S in your budget. I think you really need to look at post #7, he hits all the right issues. I have "JustaCooper" and love it. I auto X and track my Cooper and have put 60K on it in only 2 years. I'm running in the top 10 at my local events and beat most of the "S" gang. At this time I hope you can really frame in your mind what you want to use a MINI for and buy the one that meets your "needs", that may or may not be an "S".

 

My Midlands 5-speed tranny shifts a lot smoother than the Getrag 6-speed on a MINI S I drove. Hope it hangs together. I changed out the original tranny oil for Amsoil and that made it shift even smoother.