so uh, randy i presume, wat consists in this package, sounds super kewl. im guessing most likely every bolt on there is. correct?

 

Where exactly has this been advertised?

 

I am interested as well. When can we see the new products up on the website?

 

You guy's should check the Vendor Announcements.

Check Here

 

sounds very interesting. gotta kno the info =D

 

>>You guy's should check the Vendor Announcements.
>>
>>Check Here

When I checked the vendor announcements, I noticed that MINISWAG puts their t-shirt announcements up as sticky posts!? This has nothing to do with Randy's (wonderful) announcement of new products, but I thought it was kind of "tacky"

 

Any insight into what the 230 package includes? Prices would be nice too

 

>>Any insight into what the 230 package includes? Prices would be nice too

I would be interested as well - did you recieve any info?

 

The final piece to this puzzle is the intercoooler. There are two options, both of which will work, but I only have pricing and availability on one.

Here is the list:

Intake (Alta $259 Madness $239)
Throttle Body ($459)
Supercharger Pulley ($169)
Intercooler ($990)
London Stainless Header ($1300)
Exhaust ($600-900)
ECU ($720)

The package if you added it all up would be ~$4500 but for the kit it will be $4300. The price may come down if we can test a couple other products and substitute them. The water-air intercooler should also reduce the price slightly.

Other items are also available as a substitute that will get you to the ultimate goal - the cam for instance.

I still like to mix and match based on what the customer wants, so I think I will continue to just build packages for folks rather than say - here it is, buy it without any advice or guidance.

I would also recommend some braking and suspension upgrades to be used with this package.

What I really want is a package that will stomp the JCW car in all areas, but still come in at less money.

Let me know if you have any questions!

Randy

 

Will that throttle body be notice by the dealers if installed?


Peter

 

Is the throttle body ready? and the water to air?

_________________
'02 S, mania-pulley,modified K&N typhoon intake, mania header, magnaflow exhaust, air box mod, any more details, it wouldnt be racing!!

 

Randy,

Are the horsepower numbers at the wheels or crank?
Where can I get more info on the ECU mod?

Thanks!

 

Isn't the JCW kit ~$5000 INSTALLED! You are never going to beat the warranty issue either...sorry.

 

I was quoted that the JCW kit was $4500 plus installation of 10 hours at $100 per hour plus there is tax and the return cost of the core parts of the engine. So rough estimate is $6000 total.

Randy's upgrade package has some HP advantage in the intake option (about 9 HP), the header (up to 12 HP?), the larger bore throttle body (5 HP), and exhaust (maybe 10 HP-since some people think that the JCW exhaust isn't as good as it looks- dyno results are unknown)

Light rims with grippy tires (Bridgestone SO3 or Goodyear F1 GSD3) would do wonders.
Suspension upgrades- springs, rear anti roll bar, front tower strut brace all would help cornering.
Brake upgrade- better brake pads for track/less dust, power slot rotors, better grade brake fluid, and stainless steel brake linings provide for better stops and heat endurance.

I don't think the throttlebody is ready yet. The guy who makes it isn't ready to make enough to fill orders and keep up with demand yet- maybe soon though. Randy will let us know soon.

 

>>I was quoted that the JCW kit was $4500 plus installation of 10 hours at $100 per hour plus there is tax and the return cost of the core parts of the engine. So rough estimate is $6000 total.
>>
>>Randy's upgrade package has some HP advantage in the intake option (about 9 HP), the header (up to 12 HP?), the larger bore throttle body (5 HP), and exhaust (maybe 10 HP-since some people think that the JCW exhaust isn't as good as it looks- dyno results are unknown)

In fairness to both parties, Randy's package is going to involve alot of labor as well. The header and pulley themselves are major mechanical projects. If you're a very good mechanic, then you can probably pocket that money. Most people would likely pay a professional to do at least the heavy lifting. The difference between Randy and JCW is Randy gives the people with the ability the option to do it themselves.

Also the top performance option Randy is offering almost doubles the gain that the JCW is claiming. The JCW increases power over the stock S around 20 percent versus around 40 percent for what Randy is talking about. The cost is apples to apples but the performance gain is definitely advantage to Randy.

All of that said, unless you're competing, 230 hp for a Mini is a bit absurd. I have a hard time justifying the cost and risk of going for 200 hp. As Randy said, you really should sink another grand or so into the brakes and suspension and at that level I think questions about drivetrain come into play as well.

Obviously there are enough out there who are happy to sink $10k into a car so they can do sixty in under 6 seconds, but in my mind I see 200 hp as the point of diminishing returns for power modifications on this car.

As I said earlier, this all goes out the window if you're competing. That's probably the difference. If you don't have a problem slapping on all of these mods then a rebuild shouldn't scare you too much either.

 

Teldon I think its a bit absurd not that people want these power gains, but that you ridicule the idea when you haven't even recieved your car yet.

 

TELDOM I HAVE TO AGREE WITH ROTARYCOACH. WE COOPER S OWNERS ARE A DIFFERENT KIND OF BREED, PERFORMANCE IS VERY IMPORTANT TO US EVEN IF WE DO NOT COMPETE. IT'S ALWAYS GOOD TO HAVE THE EXTRA POWER WHEN NEEDED OR WHE WE WANT TO PLAY WITH IT. NOW RANDY IS A GREAT ADVISOR AND DEVELOPPER OF GREAT PERFORMANCE PARTS FOR THE BENEFIT OF ALL OF US, HE DID THE PULLEY UPGRADE FOR ME IN FLORIDA AND IS SENDING ME MY ALTA INTAKE AND I ALREADY HAVE THE MAGNAFLOW EXHAUST AND MY CAR WORKS TOTALLY DIFFERENT, WHAT AN ENJOYMENT. YOU HAVE NOT EVEN RECEIVE YOUR CAR YET, WAIT AND SEE, EVEN THE S IS FAST AS A STOCK CAR DO SOME MODIFICATIONS LIKE PULLEY AND EXHAUST AND YOU WILL SEE THE DIFFERENCE. PLEASE DO NOT CRITIC RANDY'S KITS BECAUSE HE IS ONLY TRYING TO GIVE US THE BEST HP GAINS AT THE LOWER COSTS. HE IS A GRAT GUY AND I HAD THE PLEASURE TO MEET HIM IN FLORIDA.

MY CAR: http://www.MSNUSERS.COM/PPANTHER
COOPER S 2003 SPORT PACKAGE,PREMIUM,17 RV90WHEELS,MAGNAFLOW EXHAUST,PULLEY,ALTA INTAKE, LAPIZ BLUE SEATS,MOONROOF,HELLA RALLY LIGHTS

 

ppanther,

Writing in ALL CAPITAL LETTERS is like yelling in here.

Man, my eyes hurt from reading it.

If you use mixed-case, your message will come across
more clearly.

And it was a good message by the way.

 

>>Teldon I think its a bit absurd not that people want these power gains, but that you ridicule the idea when you haven't even recieved your car yet.

I think the recent power obsession across the board is a bit insane. I turned 16 the year VW dropped a 90hp engine into a 3-door Rabbit and it was the most exciting development of the year.

I currently drive a Miata with a 140 hp in 2,200 lb car and it's largely considered to be "underpowered." That's absurd.

A stock Cooper S will run with a 1984 Corvette. Subaru and Mitsubishi packing 300 hp cars to sell to teenagers might be a positive step forward in terms of social darwinism and zero-population growth, but it has massively disturbed perceptions of power.

If you reread my post and try not to act so defensively, you'll see that I was positive about what Randy had to offer. What I questioned was at what point are you looking at diminishing returns? I was thinking 230hp or $5,000 for this car was about that point.

That was a fair question when everyone was criticizing the JCW for 35-odd hp for $5,500 est. The questionable number wasn't the 35 hp so much as the price tag. The question is when you're looking at $5,500 plus other improvements to handle the power, it's the same question. Is that extra 30 hp really worth it?

I more than allowed for the competitive/racing nature of Mini owners, but otherwise it seems to be more George S. Scott in Dr. Strangelove wanting "one of those doomsday devices." They want to autocross or road race, maybe even drag, whatever, where you want any advantage, that's perfectly sensible. If you're not, you're talking about shaving a few tenths of a sixty time if you have no disregard for the life of your clutch or drivetrain. And from pure asthetics, what really is the difference between a 230 hp maxed-out Mini and some riced-out Civic?

I'm all for more power, but that doesn't mean that I suspend the right to be rational and ask questions. I drove the Works package last Friday and having a feel for what around 200 hp feels like I feel pretty comfortable saying another 30 hp isn't for me.

I think what Randy has done with the pulley installs is great and I read with great interest the Florida threads about the pulley party in West Palm Beach. When my S comes in, I'll have a pulley, a renntech ecu, a madness intake and a borla exhaust which basically gets me to the JCW level.

I was just raising the question. When is enough and enough and what is practical for street use?

 

>>I was just raising the question. When is enough and enough and what is practical for street use?
>>

This is an interesting thread but most of these questions are questions that won't get answered because there are people involved from several camps.

Getting more HP out of a motor is something that has been happening for decades and is something that isn't going to end any time soon. It is as much if not more the challenge of getting the HP as it is to use it. It is no more insane to want 200 or 230 hp out of the MCS as it is to want 163 HP over the 120 or so out of the normally aspirated Cooper. Some people don't want the extra 40hp of the S, some do.

As for practical for street use, the Cooper is plenty practical for street use. I seriously doubt that there is one person out there who is in search of 200+ HP because they think it is more practical.

Enough power is enough power when it becomes cost prohibitive to buy any more power or when having that extra power under the hood starts scaring you or when you just don't care about having it. :smile:

Happy Motoring.

 

>>>>
>>
>>I was just raising the question. When is enough and enough and what is practical for street use?
>>


henessey venom r viper

 

>>henessey venom r viper
Been a few years since he's been able to do that.

 

I suspect that the number of Cooper and Cooper S owners that regularly visit MCO to be statistically small, not to mention the subset of us who lurk around on the Performance Modifications threads. By definition you are unlikely to find many owners in this forum who are profoundly concerned with the particality of 230 HP in a 2600 lb FWD car.

Around here the focus is generally bang for the buck. Best power, handling, stopping, etc for the fewest dollars will generate great interest while calls for rational reservation on extreme modifications will fall on deaf (or mildly hostile) ears.

That said I generally concur with you. I'm here to learn how to improve a car that I found near perfect off the showroom, and it's been a very interesting education. I once stood in awe of the JCW package not really understanding what they did. Now I believe that for the same $5-6 K you can build a car with similiar or better acceleration plus better handling and braking for the same amount.

But your question is why? I for one drove a track event for the first time in my life because of my new found enthusiasim and now have the bug to do it again. Maybe most people here won't do that but like me they will also get great satisfaction from just working their own MINI and making it better. So I guess the why is, because it's fun.

:smile:

Jim

 

I already have enough torque to spin my tires through first gear from a roll. I will have enough when I can spin them through 6th gear.

 

The cool thing about the MINI is the diversity in the group. This kit isn't for everyone, and what is amazing is the cost for the extra power. I think for most folks, 200 hp is plenty, and comparing the costs of the two kits, you can see the big loss of the horsepower/dollar ratio. It's always been that way - to get the last few horsepower it becomes exponentially more expensive.

What I tried to accomplish with this kit is giving you the most you can get without having to address other areas (and start getting into REALLY big bucks) like the gearbox, clutch, and axles. If you have a limited slip, I think the axles will be a weak link even below 230 hp (which is why we are working on making a heavy duty axle set).

For most folks, the 200 hp kit is much more cost effective, and I guarantee it will make you smile!

If you want the last little bit though, it costs. The big costs are the intercooler and the header.

Labor is a consideration, but other than the pulley, all of the items are very straightforward installs. The header takes about an hour to install - and the how-to explains it pretty well.

The 200 hp kit includes the intake, exhaust, ECU and pulley and runs $1610. With the extra savings, you can get the springs, swaybar, stage 1 brake kit and have an incredible package (or you can pocket the cash). If you absolutely need more power, you can always upgrade piece by piece in the future (that makes birthdays and Christmas that much more fun - like being a kid again!).

As far as when enough is enough - that's more philisophical, and while a great conversation, probably belongs more in off-topic . Seriously though, it depends on personal taste I think, not necessarily what you are using the car for as to the horsepower level you take your car to.

Let me know if you have any other questions.

Randy