If you re-read what Slave to Felines said, he said that he is just as fast in the twisties and faster than some (mostly because of the driver)

NO ONE said the straight Cooper is faster on a course! Gee whiz! It always comes down to the pissing match, doesn't it, guys....

Look, for MOST people who drive the car daily, and go on club runs once in a while... the straight Cooper CAN be just as GREAT, because MOST people aren't race car drivers. They're looking for an agile, fun, grin-inducing car, that they can also afford to keep going until their loan is paid off, and a few years more than that. Something that doesn't keep needing extended warranties. Something that they can get about 100 miles per tank EXTRA with.

The whole point is that they should give the straight Cooper a chance, not take a short, sedate drive around the dealership and then be talked into the turbo because the dealer would like to make that extra profit.

The whole point is that it is just as fun to drive a slow car fast, playing with what it can do, not just stomping your foot down... anyone can do that.

So even though the forum is FILLED with superchargers and turbos, and we Justas are a small minority, new buyers should be reminded that straight speed isn't everything, and that the forum is also filled with expensive repairs, walnut shell blasting, coked oil, and all of the expense that comes with the choice of the direct injection engines.

Now go and have an ice cream and it will all be good.

 

Thank you for posting those results. I had the feeling I was right on my prediction.

 

Just cause one person has a different opinion doesn't mean you should attack them because of their comments.

But as for repairs and blah blah blah on the MCS/JCW, you should start mentioning 07-10. The '11+ are very different in reliability. I have only had my thermostat replaced at 24k miles. Everything else was recalls(two things) and bad gas that gave me a CEL(put fresh new gas in and no problem). Keep in mind NOT all Straight Cooper's are reliable. My '08 was NOT reliable. But the '08 was known for trouble, as for my '11 MCS, it has been the most reliable MINI I've owned yet. I can only hope and imagine the brand will get better in the 2014 new gens(non-turbo and turbo).

 

Oh one more thing it is a "Cooper" not a straight or a Justa. All others should be referred to as Cooper S or JCW. Just saying it is one of my pet peeves.

 

I do love a spirited discussion...
Feisty lot these Justa owners...

Cheers,

Charlie

 

Only reason I say "Straight Cooper" it's too make every other "Cooper" owner happy.

 

I bought my 03 "Justa" for 1500 bucks having a bad clutch and I can honestly say during the clutch installation I was kinda regretting it but once I sat behind the wheel and drove it, I have not looked back, I have test driven the S models and have thought about owning one but at the end of the day my "Justa" is mine and the work I have put into it I cant justify selling it or trading it, I drive it and can keep up with my S buddies, not saying I can beat em in twisties or straight up drags but I can deff keep up.

 

Yes, that's true, but since this post was aimed toward prospective new owners, the distinction might escape them. It's a heck of a lot easier to just say Cooper, and that would be fine, if everyone was on the same page with it.

 

I'm good with any other moniker for our Coopers (porthos is correct) except for "Justa". One of my pet peeves...

So.... I'm on one of my favorite twisties this afternoon heading into about a two mile stretch that has no driveways, side roads, nothing - just pure twisting asphalt, the perfect place to play without altering anyone else's life. A sweet, black Challenger is in the oncoming lane and has just finished this section. As I pass him, I see his brake lights and the beginnings of a U-turn...

RPM's didn't drop below 4000 for pretty much the whole 2 miles. And I didn't see the Challenger (not even in my rear view on straights) until I got to the stop sign at the other end.

 

Given a driver of equivalent skill (ie me driving both) a JustaCooper (with sport suspension) is just as fast around corners as a Cooper-S (with sport suspension), in fact I tend to go around corners faster in the JustaCooper as I want to carry as much speed as possible through the corner, given the lack of power. A Cooper-S (or JCW) has enough power to make it worthwhile to sacrifice some corner speed for a faster exit. If the MINIs didn't both have the sport suspension, the one with will probably be able to corner faster.

As noted, the driver is the most important factor in the performance of any car. Given a driver of reasonable competence, its quite easy to find a driver of lesser competence, making the competent driver's car seem faster. If you want video, try these:

http://btwyx.com/Movies/Shawn.mov
http://btwyx.com/Movies/BLMINI.mov
http://btwyx.com/Movies/DSMINI.mov

That's me driving Tristan, a JustaCooper, playing the part of the competent driver. As this was in the beginners group it was easy to find slower drivers.

Also, personally I like "Justa" Cooper as a description.

 

I know a "Cooper" can keep up with a MCS, my point was a MCS is NOT slower when it comes to corners vs a "Cooper". That was my point. I'm tired of half the people on this thread making it a war between the "Cooper" vs MCS/JCW. People here in the Michigan club don't do that crap. The turbo's and non-turbo MINIs are similar in the corners. I'm done talking about it, it's just irritating sometimes reading stupid posts.

 

[QUOTE=RobMuntean;3738290]Just cause one person has a different opinion doesn't mean you should attack them because of their comments.

But I thought that was the NAM way (rolls eyes).

 

I'm tired of half the people on this thread making it a war between the "Cooper" vs MCS/JCW.

Very well said! Me too. And that goes for the auto vs. manual debate too. They're ALL MINIs. Drive what you like and have a blast doing it!

 

I don't disagree.

 

i love the turbo... i wanted the extra acceleration when needed

 

Well, that's fine...

Not everyone needs that, though. Did you take a Cooper out and give it a good try? Did you go out with someone who Autocrosses one? That's the point of the thread.

 

While I don't doubt the straight cooper engine is fun when you wind it up, in city driving the "dead zone" off idle really turned me off when I test drove a 2012. It was impossible to drive smoothly at slow speeds, press the pedal, nothing, press more, surge of power. The sport button made it a little better. The S had better throttle response in normal mode than the non-s in sport mode and in sport mode response is pretty instant. Still talking about 0-30 here so it's not a "the S has so much more power" argument, just a lot more daily drivability in non-sport mode.

 

Like everything else, you learn to drive it smoothly after you do it for a while. And your ECU 'learns' that you want power early in the range, and responds. Which is why it is best to drive with someone who knows how to drive one, and even drive a straight Cooper that has been driven by someone other than timid people who are test driving. The jumpiness smooths out, and your reactions become instinctive.
Really, test driving a new one is not a good test of what they are capable of. Unfortunately.
But then again, MINI and the dealership would prefer that you buy a turbo. They make more money when you buy it, and they can anticipate that you might spend more on maintaining it.

 

The salesman told me the surge of power 'simulates turbo boost'. He also didn't know what a twin scroll turbo was 'it has two.....scrolls'. Well if it was a marketing thing to turn people off on first impressions it worked, but after my free service is up I'm not giving the dealer anymore money unless absolutely needed. Good thing there is helpful info on forums :-)

 

Yes, thank goodness for forums and good independent mechanics!! That's the truth!
The gal who sold me my first Cooper said that I didn't need to do oil changes more often than MINI suggested because... and I am not kidding... 'your MINI knows how much oil to use, and only uses what it needs' or words to that effect. Ummm.... okaaaaay......
Nice gal, but my dog knows more about engines.

 

Yes I'm definitely doing preventative maintenance. Oil changes at 5K miles, 15K is ludicrous even using synthetic on a non-turbo engine. Auto trans oil drain and fill a lot more often than 'never'...