If I read the feature description right, this is ONLY active/on if you have disabled Dynamic *Stability* Control....

In my mind, If I disable one, I would probably disable both - so I'm looking at this as a way to shave off $250.

It sounds like this:

Option 1 (normal): Dynamic Stability Control ON, DTC OFF
Option 2: Dynamic Stability OFF, Dynamic Traction ON
Option 3: DSC and DTC OFF

Do I understand this correctly, and is this a "must have/should get" feature?

Thank you, ladies and gents!

 

IMO, DSC should be standard. It is quite a useful safety feature. It saved my butt a few times.
If i remember correctly, you can have DSC off, but have DTC on. And then *almost* everything off, by holding the DSC button longer than 3(?) secs.

Unless you plan on making a track car out of your roadster, I dont recommend you not getting DSC.

 

In the US if you get the sport package or the John Cooper Works package you get the DTC included. It's a safety feature at the end of the day. In normal driving why not take advantage of all the help you can get to keep the car on the black bits and out of the ditch/other vehicles? You'll probably never notice the one time that it quietly saves your bacon, but it will just sit there saying "you're welcome"...

You can turn it off if you feel the need, but quite honestly no matter what we all think, the DTC/DSC type systems do a far better job than we do, as most times they kick in you are not at 100% concentration and you wouldn't react fast enough to save the day.

I'd have got it, even if it wasn't included in the JCW appearance package I got.

 

DSC is standard on the Roadster S. I am asking about the optional DTC. I don't plan on turning off DSC at all unless I wan't to make my tires squeel to annoy a friend (which I've done only a few times in my life - tires are expensive!)

Straight from the Mini website, it says

"If DSC is turned off, the Dynamic Traction Control (DTC takes over."
http://www.miniusa.com/top-feature-c...Top_Features-m


I do not think they are both on at the same time. What I am saying is I won't ever turn off DSC, so if I understand correctly I would never actually use DTC.

I'm pretty sure that the two systems do not run simultaneously. That's what I was looking to confirm. If they don't I wont bother getting it.

 

DTC also gets you the fancy electronic diff control which will help you stop from spinning the inside wheel pulling out of corners. I think that's active all the time. I definitely think that it pulls stronger out of tight fast corners than my R56 did, and I put at least some of that down to the diff doing it's thing instead of the system backing off all the power like the older car used to.

 

The e-diff is actually only active when the dtc and dsc are disabled (button held down for 5 seconds). Kind of strange setup considering it replaces a mechanical limited slip which would obviously always be working.

 

Thanks for the clarification. Guess the DSC programming must have improved on the '12s versus my old' 07 R56 then.

 

DTC is DSC light

my OM says to turn off DSC in low traction situations, ie deep snow

i have gone out and played with the 3 settings in a parking lot in the rain

with DSC active. it is almost impossible to get the car out of shape, the computer reduces power and applies the brakes to keep the car in control

with DSC off, DTC on, the car will slide some but not enough to be a lot of fun

with both DSC and DTC off, the car will let you make a fool out of yourself, i have spun my CMS All4, but it will let the rear end slide out in a power slide, allowing throttle steering ie throttle oversteer

i say get it, since you can turn it off at will

my normal starting sequence is to press the start button, press the DSC button, press the sport button

scott

 

Thanks for the feedback. It does indeed sound like it's only ON when DSC is OFF.

I'll probably skip the feature. I'm always going to have DSC on for commute and normal driving, however if for some reason I intended to turn it off, I sure wouldn't leave DTC on, too - i would want them BOTH off.

 

well that explains why my torque steer is vastly reduced when I disable everything

 

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I think the traction control kicks in before the Ediff has a chance. So if you disable the TC you will feel the Ediff doing its job

 

After you posted this I realized that I was wrong and that a combo of your post and JPMM's are correct. With everything on in normal mode, the e-diff won't have a change to do anything since stability control/traction control are going to kick in at the slightest wheelspin. When you hit the DTC button you'll get some benefit and the most when you shut off the DTC completely. Sorry about my mistake folks!

 

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i think you are all both correct and incorrect

let me explain

the DSC, DTC, eDiff and ABS are all software running in the cars computer system and they work by taking input from sensors on the suspension and wheels and acting on the brakes and/or throttle

the DSC/DTC button is telling the software what level of assistance you, the driver, want from the computer

if DSC or DTC or eDiff is an optional feature, it is more than likely that it is enabled or not by the setting of 1 bit from 0 to 1 in the computer, just like the other options we can set like 1 flash or 3 flash turnsignals

on my cms all4, i have all the features as standard equipment, and as i did not even consider any other model, i do not know the status of which are standard or optional on a justa or an s, except i believe that ABS is now a required feature by usa regulations

playing with my car in a parking lot in the rain i found the following (no drag race style starts were done, respect the clutch):

with DSC enabled, it is almost impossible to get a wheel to spin or to slide the car, the computer intervenes and takes away the throttle, it feels like the engine died, i hate it and always turn off DSC as soon as i start the car

with DTC enabled (DSC off), a small amount of wheel spin is possible as is some sliding/drifting, you can feel the individual wheels slip and bite as the All4 system, DTC and eDiff do their thing ... with lots of throttle and rapid steering inputs, the car will slide some

with DSC and DTC off, it is possible to spin the wheels and even spin the car, allthough it appears the eDiff will not allow 1 wheel to spin, it is more like all or none spin, the tail will come out and throttle steering is possible, and IF YOU OVERDO IT, A SPIN WILL RESULT

in all three modes, a panic stop activates the ABS, and apparently there is no way to disable the ABS

with the 225/45-18 summer wheels/tires and sport suspension, i have to use lots of power to spin wheels or slide the car, even in the rain, i am scouting for a grass field that is firm enough to support the car when wet and then i can explore the various modes under more challenging conditions

if i can't find an appropriate grass field, i'll just have to wait for some snow!

another experiment that is easy to do is to put 2 wheels in grass and 2 wheels on pavement ... i have done this too, both by side (for example, both left wheels in the grass) and by axel (for example, both rear wheels in the grass) ... try it

scott

 

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i agree with you, the point i was making in the sentence you quote is that these are all software features and all cars probably have the same software that has features enabled or not during the manufaturing of the car

my playing in the wet parking lot seems to confirm that eDiff is always active as i can not make one wheel wildly spin, same with some wheels on grass and some on pavement, it is not possible to spin one wheel

scott

 

Agreed, it's a frustrating bit. I do agree with you that it's always on (why I apologized for my wrongful assumption in my post above) but I've found that it never really gets a chance to react with all the nannies on since power is cut before wheel slip is allowed to enable the edlc to function and brake the inside wheel. I do have this on my S and have played around with it and find that for my car, its really only noticable when the DTC and DSC are off.

Oh well...still wish I had a mechanical LSD

 

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