Great tips......everything is "hot" according to the dealer until it sits on the lot and doesn't sell. If you're in the South, this is especially relevant because there are LOTS of dealers in a 300 mile radius! By the way 2017All4, my JCW was "born" 12/16 so on the lot for 5 or so months (depending on transit time).

 

On various boards a frequently asked question is, “Should I buy the extended warranty?”

First, what is usually offered is NOT a warranty, but insurance. These are protection plans that cover certain, specified risks. When they are pitched to a customer, the focus is on hypothetical situations where most would agree having someone else pay for a repair would be a good thing.

The salesperson might have said, “Well, if at 55,000 miles your dihedrial balancing veebelfitzer goes out, this plan will pay to have it fixed for free and you’ll get a loaner car to drive while your car is in the shop and if it happens out on the road and you need a tow, that’s covered and if you’re on a vacation, with the Platinum Plan coverage, you will be put up at no charge at a nice hotel….”

After listening to the pitch, the FIRST QUESTION to ask is, “Tell me what’s notcovered.” For example, your dihedrial balancing veebelfitzer may be covered if it fails due to mechanical failure caused by a defect in material or workmanship. But, at 55,000 miles it might just wear out, and won’t be covered.

And the insurance company will not put you up in a nice hotel at no charge. IF it turns out the breakdown is due to a covered repair that is caused by a defect in materials or workmanship, not what is almost always deemed to be normal wear and tear, then you can request reimbursement for a pre-determined amount for the hotel stay YOU paid for. And it may be a $50/night, two day maximum amount of coverage, with hotel taxes excluded. Same deal for the tow – reimbursement for a preset rate IF the repair is determined to be covered.

Should you buy the extended “warranty?” Is it MINI USA or a third party? What’s NOT covered? How is coverage determined? Is it reimbursement or direct payment to the garage or mechanic of your choosing? Is there coverage for diagnostic services to determine coverage or, if coverage is denied, is the diagnosis fee on you? Is there language buried deep in the policy that says if your car has been in an accident then a whole bunch of stuff is no longer covered?

And then, is it smart to buy a policy that kicks in AFTER the factory warranty expires when you may not even own the car anymore? Can you get a refund if the car is totaled before the policy kicks in?

How many people, after spending a few hours wheeling and dealing to do a car deal, are in the mood to sit in the F&I office and spend at least an hour or two reviewing fine print on an add-on protection product? How many people are willing to whip out their cell phone right in front of the F&I salesperson and say, “I’m going to call a couple of dealers and tell them I’m about to buy this protection package for $1,995 and ask them if they can beat your price?”

So, skip all of that. If you think you might want it, simply ask for a written list of everything that’s not covered and ask for some time to review it and think about it. After careful review, if you still want it, offer half of what the salesperson is asking and see what happens.

You spent weeks researching and shopping and pricing the car – don’t roll over on the add-ons and give it all back for something that may not cover the things that are likely to go wrong with your car 5 years down the bumpy road.

What’s not covered? If you don’t know, better think long and hard before buying.

 

Good advice, except you should get the actual warranty/policy and not a list that may not be accurate. Only what is written in the policy has meaning.

I never bother with this step because I ain't buying.

 

Most customers dread the test close when a car salesperson attempts to get a commitment to “buy today.”

Actually, “What do we need to do to get you into a new MINI today?” is my favorite question, if I’m ready to buy.

Think about this. You’ve done extensive research on the internet. You’ve built your dream MINI on the MINIUSA web site. You’ve calculated estimated invoice. You are aware of any rebates/incentives. You know there is holdback which allows a dealer to sell a car at dead invoice and still make a small profit. You’ve analyzed monthly sales data and you know the model you covet has not been selling as well as it did a year ago. You know your credit score. You know the wholesale value of your trade and you know what, if anything, you still owe on your trade. You know your budget.

Now it’s time to test drive some MINI’s to make sure what you think you want is, indeed, the MINI you will enjoy driving for the next few years.

Select a dealer (if you have more than one from which to choose). On a week day, other than Monday or Friday, if you don’t have the name of a specific salesperson you want to use, call your chosen dealer and speak to someone in sales – doesn’t matter who. Introduce yourself by name, tell them the model you want is on your short list of cars you are considering for your new car, tell them what you’re currently driving and, if you’re considering trading it in, tell them you are considering trading it in if they want to make you an offer. Tell them you would like to email them the build of the car you think you might want, and ask them to call you after they receive your email to set up a time to test drive something similar to what you have built.

If the salesperson on the phone asks about what you’re seeking, you can give details over the phone (and let the salesperson think he/she is ‘taking control of the sales situation’), or you can repeat that you’d like to send them the build and have them review it and call you back if they’re got something similar you can test drive.

If you are asked your time frame, tell the truth. The best answer from a dealer’s perspective is, “If, after I drive the MINI, it feels like what I want for my next car, I’m ready to proceed right away.” Or, if the truth is you have two or three other brands you are considering, or if you are considering a used car and you plan to drive several before buying, tell that to the salesperson.

But if you are at the point where you know it’s going to be a MINI, and you know the one you want, then what you are hoping for is that the salesperson asks any variation of the magic question, “What do we need to do to get you to buy TODAY?”

If you are ready to buy (or lease), have your answer ready.

“$10,000 for my trade, $500 back of invoice for the new MINI, less incentives, best APR (or money factor if it’s a lease), complimentary full detail with the first scheduled service, a windshield sun shade, and I’m ready to go right now. Can you get that done for me now?”

Or whatever numbers and terms would represent an offer you couldn’t refuse.

So, ask yourself, “What would be an offer I couldn’t refuse?” Make it an insane offer that is probably better than you have any hope of getting. And don’t be afraid to ask for it.

Understand that dealers are amateur psychologists. They know that if they meet a customer’s first offer the customer will begin to worry that they may be overpaying, so the dealer is probably going to counter a customer’s lowball offer, first, because of the psychology, and, second, because the dealer needs to test to see if they can get the customer to go higher. And third, a customer's lowball offer may not be something the dealer can or is willing to do, even on the last day of the month. Fair enough. But maybe they can get close enough. All you, as a customer, can do is answer the question and present the dealer with the opportunity to sell you a car.

If an informed customer who is ready to buy today has a clear sense of the offer he/she wouldn’t refuse as well as a general sense of the highest acceptable price and terms, then the cheesy 'what will it take to get you to buy today?' question is a welcome one.

When the dealer hears your response to the “What will it take to get you to buy today?” question, and the dealer’s response is to say, “No can do,” remember, they asked.

So tell the dealer, “You asked.” And when they say it can’t happen, smile, and, calmly ask, “How close to my terms can you get, because I am, indeed, ready to buy today if we can come to acceptable terms, and you, Mr. Eagerbeaver Salesperson, now know how to get me to yes. So, go tell your manager I’m ready to go right now if you can get close to my terms.”

If you’re ready to go, and you stay alert, and stick close to your numbers, stay friendly, firm and loose, and keep a close eye on every moving part of the deal as it develops, magic will often happen, if, that is, you truly are ready to buy today.

 

So, if the salesperson, upon hearing a customer's lowball offer, says something like, "Get real," the savvy shopper pauses, smiles the Zen smile, calmly replies, "You asked," and, still calm and smiling, is not intimidated by a signal from the salesperson that the low offer is a non-starter. The BEST response to a salesman's rejection of a low offer is not to be intimidated, because there is no shame in honestly telling a salesperson, in response to his/her query, what you would say 'yes' to right now. So, after the salesperson says "no way," the savvy customer cuts the next order, as in "go tell your manager I’m ready to go right now. If you can get close to my terms, I'm ready to do this deal.” No apologies -- no shame, just business.

 

Many years ago my then teen aged nephew was admiring my car. With the sarcasm of youth, he said, “I’ll give ya five bucks for it right now,” to which I replied, dead serious, “Have you got the five bucks on you right now?” With panic in his eyes, he looked down and muttered, “Nope.”

After analyzing all the techniques and tricks and strategies for approaching the purchase or lease of a new car, there is a central fact that remains unchanged:

To get a good deal you have to be ready to do the deal.

As the very first post in this thread mentions, you need to get all of your duckies in a row. Know what you want, know the current market, know what you want to do with your trade and know what it’s worth – wholesale and retail. Have your finances in order – have the five bucks on you so when you offer five bucks for the car and the dealer says show me the money, without blinking an eye you can say, "if you’re ready to sell me this car for the price I’m offering, I’m ready to go right now."

Your readiness will transmit a clear sense of confidence and will enable you to unapologetically hold firm on a realistic, but low offer that favors you.

There is an old Chinese saying, “You have to be ready for your luck.”

Be ready, and you might get lucky.

 

As stated in a prior post, the BEST response to a salesman's rejection of a low offer is not to be intimidated, because there is no shame in honestly telling a salesperson, in response to his/her query, what you would say 'yes' to right now. So, after the salesperson says "no way," the savvy customer cuts the next order, as in "go tell your manager I’m ready to go right now. If you can get close to my terms, I'm ready to do this deal.”

So, after the customer says, "if you can get close to my terms..." the savvy salesperson will counter with, "How close do we need to get?"

Here are some responses to that question:

"As close as you can because I'm not inclined to go higher."

"You asked me what I would say yes to and I told you. Why don't you tell me your best numbers?"

"Why don't you show me how close to my numbers you can get and then let's see from there."

"I'm ready to say yes to the numbers I gave you. If you can't do that, I'll have to think hard about whatever you can do, so bring me your best offer."

No matter how the salesperson tries to turn it around, DON'T GO THERE. For example:

Salesperson: My manager says no way on your proposal, so you need to ...

Customer: You asked what it would take to get me to yes. I told you and I'm telling you again, at my numbers, you have a yes. You tell me what part of my offer is hanging us up.

Salesperson: Well, maybe if you will take less for your trade....

Customer: Not really interested in discussing "maybe." You have my offer. What, specifically do we need to change to get to yes on your end?

After a few rounds of this, without losing patience, the customer can say, "I have asked you three times to tell me, specifically, what we need to adjust on my offer. You have yet to show me hard numbers. I think it's time to sit down with your manager and see if we can nail this down."

And, the savvy customer's opening line to the manager is, "Thank you for taking the time to help me get this done. I told the salesperson I'm ready to sign if (the customer restates the first offer). Let's make this simple and do the deal as I proposed and I'm ready to take delivery today.

And go from there. This customer REFUSES TO NEGOTIATE AGAINST HIMSELF. If pushed he will consider a counter offer, and will keep saying, "That's really more than I'm prepared to pay," or "CarMax quoted me $X for my trade so that's the minimum I'm prepared to accept for it and I'm comfortable at $500 back of invoice if there's any way you can do that today."

What managers know, from years of experience, is that, slowly and steadily, they can get a stubborn customer to increase what they will pay. And they are right. All a customer can do to control how the numbers increase is to stick close to a reasonable but very, very low offer, and never lose calm patience as the process grinds on.

Once a manager knows a customer can't be bumped, the customer will see the best offer and will have a choice to take the deal or walk.

 

So, the smart MINI shopper finds a Clubman S All4 that looks like it might just be the one.

It has an MSRP of $42,000.

The MINI shopper wants to lease and 3yrs/30,000 miles will work because this MINI shopper knows more miles can be purchased during the lease term if need be.

The MINI shopper visits MINIUSA and learns by reading the small print:

$0 security deposit, $2,500 customer cash, $750 lease cash and $1,500 in-stock allowance). Actual MSRP may vary. $636 Dealer contribution may vary and could affect your actual monthly lease payment. Lessee responsible for insurance during the lease term and any excess wear and tear as defined in the lease contract, $.25/mile over 30,000 miles and a disposition fee of $350 at lease end. Cash due at signing includes $700 down payment, $219 first month payment, $925 acquisition fee, and $0 security deposit. Not all customers will qualify for security deposit waiver. Tax, title, license, registration and dealer fees are additional fees due at signing.

So, quick math tells the MINI shopper that if the dealer agrees to a 5% discount from MSRP (that's $2,100 off of MSRP on a $42,000 car), then the incentives roll in and...bingo!

$2,100 dealer discount
$2,500 customer cash from MINI USA
$1,500 in stock allowance from MINI USA
$ 750 lease cash from MINI USA

$6,850 total discounts from MSRP, which is over 16% off of MSRP, and that's with only a 5% discount from the dealer.

Read the small print on the web site, fellow Motorers. Find the new MINI you covet. Calculate estimated invoice. Offer a bit above or right at invoice, THEN, after you get that agreed to, load in the MINIUSA incentives.

Who says making insane offers is insane? When MINI is basically saying that their cars are worth thousands less than MSRP, it's dealin' time.

 

Last weekend of the month.
Middle of summer.
End of model year production changeover.
Many new MINIs sitting on dealer lots.

Anyone snag an exceptional deal?

 

If anyone wants a 2016 Clubman S ALL4, due to current incentives, we're offering $7000 off of in-stock inventory at Princeton MINI. You've got until Monday.

Contact me for questions, info, etc. These deals are crazy, and if I had a manual in stock that wasn't black, I'd buy one myself!

 

Thanks, as always, Zillon. Anyone shopping for a MINI should reach out to you for sure.

 

Some people feel it’s not right to shop one dealer against another. Sort of like cheating on your significant other.

Aggressive dealers don’t mind being shopped if they’re dealing with a prospect who is truly ready to buy now. And that’s the important distinction. We’re not talking about a person who is just tire kicking to see how low a price they can get and then, if they like the price, maybe they’ll start thinking about buying.

If a customer knows what he/she is seeking and gives several dealers the opportunity to vie for his/her business, then aggressive dealers will do whatever they can to meet a prepared buyer’s terms and close a sale.

So, if a customer walks out of Dealer A with a set of numbers, and tells Dealer A that he/she is going to do some price shopping, and then contacts Dealer B and says, “I just walked out of Dealer A and we couldn’t get close to what I need. I’m ready to say yes to $XXX. If you can get me there, I’m ready to buy today,” and if Dealer B meets terms that are acceptable, and the customer has made the commitment that, if acceptable terms are met, he/she is ready to buy, then it would, indeed, be weird to take Dealer B’s terms back to Dealer A – not illegal, but certainly not a nice way to do business.

If, when leaving Dealer A, that dealer says, “If you get a better offer, please come back and give us the opportunity to meet or beat it,” try not to laugh. Simply say, “I’m going to tell Dealer B that I just walked out of your store and I’m going to tell them, just as I told you, the numbers I need to see in order to say yes today. If Dealer B gets me to my numbers, I’m ready to buy. Now, do you want to save me the time and just go ahead and meet my numbers? Because if you can do it now, I’ll do the deal with you right here, right now and I won’t bother to visit Dealer B. But if you can’t do it now, unless Dealer B can’t get me where I need to be, I won’t be back.”

Thus, it is okay to shop. Keep it above board. Be straight up and honest about what you’re doing. Be courteous and professional.

If you’re ready to buy when the numbers are right, and you are fortunate enough to be located in a region where there is competition, then let competing dealers fight to earn your business. But when a dealer meets your terms, then they have, indeed earned your business, and they should get the deal. A good deal for all.

 

Not new but I picked up a 2016 JCW with 6,500 miles on it, with every option available other than the driver assist, for around $26,500 last week. They originally had it listed for like $28,900 or so and I checked Autotrader and the other big car sites and it was the cheapest in all the land, right in my back yard.

I was serious going in and let them know that if we could make the right deal I was ready to buy. Of course they busted out with the standard `what can we do to get you into this car today?' bit.

I told them if they could give me what I wanted for my trade and their car for $25,000 they had a deal. No dice. `Not even close,' the manager said. So I said `Well, let me know how close you can get.'

I don't know if I got a `great' deal or not but I certainly got what I thought was a fair deal. And at the end of the day, value is perceived and I perceived the value of the Mini JCW at more than $26,500, so I'm happy.

The key to me is shopping around nationwide, not just in your area. I was willing to fly across the country if the savings was substantial. I mean, if you can save $5,000 and have to spend $500 for a plane ticket, that's a good deal all around. Plus road-trippin' in a new car is always fun!

 

Congratulations on a great deal on a great car. You did very well and demonstrated that your readiness to buy resulted in a substantial reduction in the selling price. Be sure to post some pictures on the F56 photo thread.

Thanks for posting. And drive safely

 

Good deal!

Wasn't I just saying the other day that little used JCW's are around? Not a clubby but still a JCW.

 

Yeah I found a few but they were all north of $30,000 with anywhere between 5,000 and 25,000 miles. I wanted one that was super low miles to maximize the warranty and capped it at $28,000. I got lucky that this one just happened to be in Austin. Apparently, though, it'd been at the dealership since May but didn't pop up on Autotrader until July. Or at least I didn't see it.

 

It's yours now!!!

 

 

Is it possible to negotiate down the dealer discount even more after the order is already palced? I just placed an order, and we agreed on $1500 dealer discount (about 4% off my $36,250 built jcw) + $1500 in incentives for a total of $3,000. Haven't signed anything yet, but the car is already in production. From reading all the posts, I feel like I could have pushed a little more. Just want to check if I should try for a bigger discount (don't want to offend my dealer as they are super nice and supportive) or if I am already getting a good deal and should just stick to it. Thanks for all the helpful info!

 

I have had sales managers say to me, "I wish all customers were prepared like this". Your advice 2017All4 about going in and being serious if the price is right, is key. Always have the numbers in mind (I write/print it all out) before hand. I think dealers who want to move units appreciate your not wasting their time and will respond if they are truly interested in making a sale the day you venture in. Also look far and wide at many dealers.

 

Well, first of all, congratulations on ordering your car. The fun part is following the car's journey from the factory and looking forward to driving the car -- because we drive the cars, not the deals!!

Second, congratulations on having a firm, discounted deal locked down at time of order. The most important thing is that the dealer discount is separate from available factory incentive discounts.

If you did the credit app and got "locked," you should be in an "as good or better" situation in that you have a deal which can't get worse and might get better just based on the incentive picture at time of delivery. When the car arrives, if the car is satisfactory and you elect to take delivery, you can take advantage of any better incentives available at time of delivery -- if it's a new month, the incentives may differ, and may be better than what was available at the time of order. Make sure it's clear that you are entitled to whatever is best.

HOWEVER, if you have seen advertisements for significantly better deals than the one you now have, then it might be reasonable to advise your dealer that you expect to receive the better advertised offer.

As to the philosophical question of renegotiating dealer discounts in a deal after one has agreed to a deal -- that depends. If you felt you had arrived at a satisfactory deal when you agreed to the deal you now have, then, even if you could go down the street and find a better deal, at what point is a deal a deal? Certainly, we would all howl if the dealer tried to renegotiate more favorable terms for the dealer after a deal was agreed to.... so one could argue that the standard should cut both ways -- for customer or dealer, a deal is a deal.

But, if, after you made your deal, information became readily available indicating that the price has gotten significantly lower due to incentives or general dealer advertised discounts, by all means, you should ask for and get whatever the best deal is, based on what is currently offered today or at time of delivery.

MINI changes offers frequently so, if the world looks different in the delivery month, until you sign the contract and bring the money, you can argue for a more favorable deal. But, IMHO, it needs to pass the, 'what if someone did that to me?' test.

However, if, upon reflection, you feel you have agreed to a deal that is too high in price based on your demonstrable understanding of the current market today, there is no law that says you can't return to the dealer today and say, "I still want the car but I need another $X discount or I'll need to cancel my order, and here's why." It all depends on what makes sense in your mind, whether or not you are willing to cancel and walk away from the deal, and when, and under what circumstances, you feel a deal you agreed to isn't a binding deal. How you choose to treat people from whom you are buying a car is your business. Yet some would argue that business is business.

Whatever you decide, just make sure your current deal is understood to be "as good or better," and you'll be fine. And think about lovin' the car, rather than squeezing a few more nickels out of a deal you felt good about when you ordered your new baby.

Hope this helps.

 

Understood. Thank you! The reason I asked is because the dealer just agreed to my price without any hesitation, which was weird to me being used to fight for every penny. So I am left wondering if I should have offered even less, seeing how easily they accepted my offer. I did not read this thread before going to the dealership, but I should have. I am ok either way and can't wait for my second jcw to arrive. Thanks again!

 

MINI sales are soft so they are happy to move cars. Funny when I went to buy my last car they were steadfast in not going any lower and I was about 1500 off MSRP.

Can't hurt to ask for a bit more, but good to see that you will be happy either way. Enjoy the ride!!

 

Sigh I am one of the suckers the dealers love to see coming. I still don't understand enough about how leasing works to get the best deal. I got an email offer and it looks pretty horrible Zillon has kindly agreed to look at it and see what he thinks.

 

LOL the way my dealer acted you wouldn't think that. They wont budge on MSPR they were trying to charge me a MF of .004 (even with my FICO being 739). I also am about 6 months out from lease end on my current lease. I almost bought a dodge challenger till I realized it wouldn't fit in my garage with the other cars we have so that's the only reason I even bothered to stop in the Mini dealer. I thought it wouldn't hurt to see what they offered. I balked understandably and then I got another off sent to me by email and frankly it looks pretty horrible plus its only for in stock Minis and the CAP cost looks WAY off even considering the extra money from getting out of the lease early. Think its time to walk to another dealer or even look at another brand.