I would do that, but I want the option of putting the Magnaflow back on for the street. I'm actually thinking of doing both the Supertrapp and a megaphone and seeing what makes more power.

I don't know if I'll do this set-up anytime soon though, to be honest. I'm trying (believe it or not) to use restraint on the S when it comes to the mods. I don't want to start cutting it up - yet. As hard as I try to avoid it, I always seem to end up doing a lot of fabrication on the cars I own to make exactly what I want. For the purposes of MINI-Motorsport, I need to try to do all of the things that won't require people to make major modifications to the car before I start cutting and welding.

Randy

 

If some people are concerned about leaving that huge hole in the middle of the bumper, couldn't they just purchase a bumper from the Cooper? Not that I am interested in the SuperTrapp....

 

>>I would do that, but I want the option of putting the Magnaflow back on for the street. I'm actually thinking of doing both the Supertrapp and a megaphone and seeing what makes more power.
>>
>>I don't know if I'll do this set-up anytime soon though, to be honest. I'm trying (believe it or not) to use restraint on the S when it comes to the mods. I don't want to start cutting it up - yet. As hard as I try to avoid it, I always seem to end up doing a lot of fabrication on the cars I own to make exactly what I want. For the purposes of MINI-Motorsport, I need to try to do all of the things that won't require people to make major modifications to the car before I start cutting and welding.
>>
>>Randy

Well, I took the Borla off and put the Supertrapp on tonight. I will say my S sounds like a true British sports car now. The sound reminds me of my '68 Triumph TR-250 -- only louder. I will probably put the Borla back on after autox season, although the hanger system used by Borla makes installation/ deinstallation harder than it needs to be. I cannabilzed the stock muffler by using the pipe from the cat to the first muffler. We welded about a 5" extension piece onto it and brought it out the right side the same way Garfield did (see the pictures earlier in this thread)

I started with 8 discs, but have plans to do some dyno testing and tuning soon to determine the optimal number of diffuser discs. With the Rogue intake and the straight pipe Supertrapp the S is inhaling and exhaling freely.

David

 

FWIW, you can install a supertrapp exhaust that takes up almost no space. Just get the "DISC ONLY" mufflers which have no absorption section. This make the length of the muffler equal to the number of disks. If you really want an absorption section, place one upstream before all the wacky bends that will be required. Happy Tuning!

--
Cheese

 

>>I started with 8 discs, but have plans to do some dyno testing and tuning soon to determine the optimal number of diffuser discs. With the Rogue intake and the straight pipe Supertrapp the S is inhaling and exhaling freely.
>>
>>David


David,

I am really curious what you settle on for your number of discs, and hope you post your findings here. I don't have access to a dyno, but I am trying to get a G-TECH to do some of my own testing. A dyno is so much better though.

I am convinced that more power can be had with more discs, particularly when running an intake. Garfield is running a stock intake, so I am guessing the 8 disc is only a jump off point.

I'm running 8 discs now, but I just got a BMP intake from Randy, and have yet to play with the number of discs. Now that I am sure it is impossible to end up with a lean condition with the Mini with only intake and exhaust I plan on doing some seat of the pants testing first, and then again with the G-Tech later.

Let us all know what you find out.

And I agree with you the sound of the Mini with the 'trapp is a unique sound, and not intrusive like some aftermarket exhausts I have had on other rigs.

Later,

John

 

>>I am really curious what you settle on for your number of discs, and hope you post your findings here. I don't have access to a dyno, but I am trying to get a G-TECH to do some of my own testing. A dyno is so much better though.
>>
>>I am convinced that more power can be had with more discs, particularly when running an intake. Garfield is running a stock intake, so I am guessing the 8 disc is only a jump off point.

John:
The car goes in for dyno testing next week (3-2). Actually, Garfield is going to take my car to the same place he dyno'ed and tested his last year. We will be setting the car up for autocrossing so will be looking for the low to mid band power.

I'd be happy to share results.

David

 

David,

I look forward for your results. I am looking for mid-range and top end, but I still believe your info will be valuable to me.

I guess you, me and Brian are about the only 'trapp lovers. Thats ok though, the rest don't know what they are missing.

Talk to you later,

John

 

John,

I'm missing that side exit and the 'trapp noise

Seriously, I do still plan to check out the Supertrapp - probably after the UUC testing is all done.

I talked with David today about that 'trapp (and some suspension stuff we are working on together) and look forward to the info he gathers on it as well.

Randy

 

Randy, your a smart guy but got no taste!!!!

I agree the 'trapp is not very pretty, but it sounds great!!

Looking forward to see what these guys come up for numbers. If they are willing to, I would like them to play with discs to see what kind of max numbers are possible. I know max power is not there thing, but I am interested to see what the 'trapp is capable of. If this costs them additional money, I would be happy to send some cash to help offset costs.

John

 

>>FWIW, you can install a supertrapp exhaust that takes up almost no space. Just get the "DISC ONLY" mufflers which have no absorption section. This make the length of the muffler equal to the number of disks. If you really want an absorption section, place one upstream before all the wacky bends that will be required. Happy Tuning!
>>
>>--
>>Cheese
>>
>>
>>
Do any of you supertrapp experts know if this will work? It souds like a good solution to the iss of how to get it through the bumper.

 

The main reason not to go with the diffuser disc setup is sound. It's not a muffler, and in many states will not be legal. If it's legal in your state, by all means get it.


Here's what happened today with the dyno:
I don't believe in people comparing one dyno to another, so I'll just skip to the recommendation of discs in the Supertrapp.

I dynoed dpayne's car today with the Rogue intake on it with Magnecores and the Supertrapp.
Here's the short story:
Choke the Supertrapp and you end up with bad results. Below 6 discs was a waste.
8 was good,
10 was optimal,
12 did exactly as expected, a tad more hp than 8, a tad less torque than 8.

So I'm clear, 10 discs had both the most hp AND torque (without even bothering above 12 discs, which is what the Supertrapp comes standard with).

Also keep in mind, I didn't want to waste the extra money on doing 9 and 11 discs, but by the trend the numbers followed, I can honestly tell you that I believe neither would be as good as 10.

From 6 to 8 was extreme because he had his 6 discs on backwards, which both Ed (York Automotive, Mt. Airy, MD) and I feel makes it worse, fighting against the correct flow.
6 (backwards) to 8:
26 hp and 9 lb/ft.

8 to 10:
4 hp and 2 lb/ft.

10 to 12:
-3hp and -3 lb/ft.

Hope this helps for those with Air Intakes and Supertrapps

Brian

 

too bad the supertrapp is so ugly....

it obviously gets the most power and HP

and i heard it sounds cool

why cant it be center mounted twin like the original

 

>>>>FWIW, you can install a supertrapp exhaust that takes up almost no space. Just get the "DISC ONLY" mufflers which have no absorption section. This make the length of the muffler equal to the number of disks. If you really want an absorption section, place one upstream before all the wacky bends that will be required. Happy Tuning!
>>>>
>>>>--
>>>>Cheese
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>Do any of you supertrapp experts know if this will work? It souds like a good solution to the iss of how to get it through the bumper.


Sorry, I didn't explain that well - I thought that what "macncheese " was saying was that you could install the absorption section upstream, do the bends required to get out the center exit - and then use the disc only section at the end? Does that make any sense? Obviously using the disc only section would be noisy as all get out. The wieght benefit alone makes the Supertrapp a very enticing option... the cosmetics are just a bit challenged.

 

For those who want something that might look a little better, check out Supertrapp's WaveTech Designs at http://www.supertrapp.com/Automotive...otive_page.htm These look a little different and are available in two lenghts 8" and 14", so they are also somewhat more flexable in where you can put them or just use some less sharp bends to get them where you want them. Looks was clearly an issue when they designed the WaveTech's.

_________________
2001 & 2002 SCCA, STS, Pro Solo National Champion

 

Not only that, but awhile back I spoke with Supertrapp about the Wavetech and found out some nice information:
The Wavetech is about looks and sound (and slight cost difference). It has neither advantages nor disadvantages in power.

So, it's purely a preference. If I was putting one on another car, I'd probably think about a Wavetech. Of course, I'd have to hit the dyno...AGAIN.


Veak, the end section, that I can tell, has no means of installing "in line" farther upstream. Just look at the exit of it.


Brian

 

Wow.. great thread about Supertrapps! I pretty much decided to go with one, once I heard the sound, (and I guess i'm probally the only one who likes the weird closed off pipe look ), but I still want the center exit... I just can't wait for someone to figure out how to do it.. , but just wanted to say thanks for the discussion...

Rocketboy_X

 

My Supertrapp has 10 discs in it and it's loud. I seriously think I'll put the Borla back on after race season. I wanted to find out how loud, so I got out my radio shack sound level meter and took some readings today.

At 70 MPH in either 5th or 6th gear with steady throttle (no coasting) I'm reading 91 to 94 db in the drivers seat. I have the shelf on and the back seat up.

I still need to take a reading or two from inside at WOT in lower gears and then outside the car at idle, and pulling away.

Of course, I didn't think to do this with the Borla before I took it off.

Here's a pic of the Supertrapp and the LEDA on the right rear.

 

That seems *awfully* loud!! Yikes, I thought the supertrapp seemed like a good option, until I heard that. I guess I'll see what Garfield's is like on Saturday...

 

You can hear mine on Saturday as well - see you there....

 

>>My Supertrapp has 10 discs in it and it's loud. I seriously think I'll put the Borla back on after race season. I wanted to find out how loud, so I got out my radio shack sound level meter and took some readings today.
>>
>>At 70 MPH in either 5th or 6th gear with steady throttle (no coasting) I'm reading 91 to 94 db in the drivers seat. I have the shelf on and the back seat up.
>>
>>I still need to take a reading or two from inside at WOT in lower gears and then outside the car at idle, and pulling away.
>>
>>Of course, I didn't think to do this with the Borla before I took it off.
>>




David,

Wow that seems loud for even 10 discs. I have 12 discs in and except for cruising at 2500 rpm, the noise intrusion into the cab is not bad at all. In-fact at 3000 in 6th about 73mph, the car is almost as quiet as stock. Now at WOT there is lots of noise, but even cruising at 4000 rpm the noise is not bad at all. Perhaps because my 'trapp extends out more from the back of the car than what Garfield has his, by about 2-3 inches, it helps with noise reduction. At about 2500 rpm there is the infamous drone going on, but just above and below that it's good.

My wife is the best gauge of noise level, and if she is ok with it, anybody should be. She didn't like the 3 inch exhaust on our 95 Mitsu GSX, but is fine with 12 discs in the 'trapp on the Mini.

I will have to db meter the car now, and give out some objective info to the group.

John

 

I am a little late to the party, but I am planning on the a Supertrapp and some dyno tuning on a Cooper strictly for autocross (H Stock). I will post results when I get them.
Richard- the area behind the rearmost seat is not considered to be part of the passenger compartment pg. 139 of the SCCA Rulebook 2003.

 

This was a great post on the supertrapp. I am going to give this setup a try for my new cooper non-s. I do have a question sbout the disc-only section. If I only install that part, everyone says "loud". I would like somekind of db numbers to back-up the statement "loud". Everyones impression is different and I am curious on the sound loudness difference between the disc only and the trapp that brian is using. Do you guys think or have experience the noise increase?? Also would it be better to run a 2.5" pipe to the trapp over the stock pipe? I may have more questions but this is all for now.
Thanks

 

Here's a dyno read out from a basicly stock car... 8-12 disc setup, 24" unit, 2.5" in and 4" out.....





peter
Team M7

 

M7,

Nice data! Looks like your results were very similar to Garfield's. I have yet to see a Supertrapp dyno that did not make more power with more discs.

Interestingly, your A/C test mirrors my acceleration runs:



Kudos to the Team M7 Team!

 

>> I have yet to see a Supertrapp dyno that did not make more power with more discs.>>

some older data
http://www.mini2.com/forum/showthread.php?t=52991

flyboy2160