Drivetrain M7/Cosworth performance packages
#51
06-05-2005, 09:35 PM
Sorry for not being able to give answers this weekend, but we have been busy with the AGS how to web pages.
As for the Cosworth MINI S, we decided that superb drivabillity and reliability was of utmost importance, not to squeeze out the last 10 HP.
As the car was tuned in Southern California we decided that we would use
91 octane gas for the dyno runs. The head has the stock sized valves retained. The AGS/pro system with our TB that has a velocity stack cut
going from 65mm down to 62mm, this combo is feeding our custom ported
Supercharger driven by the M7 16% Technology pulley. The intake manifold is portmatched to the head. As we are waiting to receive the Cosworth cam we decided to use the standard up to now, Schrick.
We are also using the M7 400cc injectors for fuel delivery.
The exhaust on this car is the Magnaflow and was chosen by the client for it's sound.
When we were looking for software to tune the car, we approached MTH
to help us with a custom map, and after countless hours I believe we do have an outstanding ECU map that has both the timing advance and fuel trim optimized. The California version of the Cosworth MINI gave us
a true 200 WHP and if you are in state that allows higher octane levels expect more horsepower wise.
The Cosworth car has also been the test bed for some new products that you could expect soon.
I am sorry you feel that way about the badging. As part of our agreement with Cosworth Racing states that we can only offer their official logos with any of our combined product line we can not alter this item. They supply the logos and badging for this project. You are of course free to not display the logo if you so desire but this part of the project is out of our hands.
Please feel free to call us with any questions you might have.
peter
Team M7
562-608-8123
As for the Cosworth MINI S, we decided that superb drivabillity and reliability was of utmost importance, not to squeeze out the last 10 HP.
As the car was tuned in Southern California we decided that we would use
91 octane gas for the dyno runs. The head has the stock sized valves retained. The AGS/pro system with our TB that has a velocity stack cut
going from 65mm down to 62mm, this combo is feeding our custom ported
Supercharger driven by the M7 16% Technology pulley. The intake manifold is portmatched to the head. As we are waiting to receive the Cosworth cam we decided to use the standard up to now, Schrick.
We are also using the M7 400cc injectors for fuel delivery.
The exhaust on this car is the Magnaflow and was chosen by the client for it's sound.
When we were looking for software to tune the car, we approached MTH
to help us with a custom map, and after countless hours I believe we do have an outstanding ECU map that has both the timing advance and fuel trim optimized. The California version of the Cosworth MINI gave us
a true 200 WHP and if you are in state that allows higher octane levels expect more horsepower wise.
The Cosworth car has also been the test bed for some new products that you could expect soon.
I am sorry you feel that way about the badging. As part of our agreement with Cosworth Racing states that we can only offer their official logos with any of our combined product line we can not alter this item. They supply the logos and badging for this project. You are of course free to not display the logo if you so desire but this part of the project is out of our hands.
Please feel free to call us with any questions you might have.
peter
Team M7
562-608-8123
Last edited by M7; 06-06-2005 at 12:10 AM.
#52
06-05-2005, 09:47 PM
And I also like to address the Cooper and it's shortage of performance parts.
I have to be honest to say that if I get handfull of calls a month for the Cooper I would be surprised....
With that said M7/Cosworth does have a head available now for the Cooper.
And M7 will be offering the AGS/C in the next couple of months complete
with our fantastic heatshield. Software support is available from MTH.
Cam from Schrick ETC.
If you like to discuss a Cooper buildup, don't hesitate.....call us.
peter
Team M7
562-608-8123
I have to be honest to say that if I get handfull of calls a month for the Cooper I would be surprised....
With that said M7/Cosworth does have a head available now for the Cooper.
And M7 will be offering the AGS/C in the next couple of months complete
with our fantastic heatshield. Software support is available from MTH.
Cam from Schrick ETC.
If you like to discuss a Cooper buildup, don't hesitate.....call us.
peter
Team M7
562-608-8123
#53
06-05-2005, 10:15 PM
Former Vendor
Originally Posted by rednwhitecooper
make it look like the factory "cooper" emblems at least, for god sake, for 3500 bucks, you better get something better than a piece of black plastic with some hokey chrome job on it and a strip of double sided tape on it.
liek said before it looks 70's or 80's, like it came off a cavalier from the 80's or something
liek said before it looks 70's or 80's, like it came off a cavalier from the 80's or something
#54
06-05-2005, 10:33 PM
#55
06-06-2005, 12:28 AM
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#56
06-06-2005, 01:11 AM
Originally Posted by M7
And I also like to address the Cooper and it's shortage of performance parts.
I have to be honest to say that if I get handfull of calls a month for the Cooper I would be surprised....
With that said M7/Cosworth does have a head available now for the Cooper.
And M7 will be offering the AGS/C in the next couple of months complete
with our fantastic heatshield. Software support is available from MTH.
Cam from Schrick ETC.
If you like to discuss a Cooper buildup, don't hesitate.....call us.
peter
Team M7
562-608-8123
I have to be honest to say that if I get handfull of calls a month for the Cooper I would be surprised....
With that said M7/Cosworth does have a head available now for the Cooper.
And M7 will be offering the AGS/C in the next couple of months complete
with our fantastic heatshield. Software support is available from MTH.
Cam from Schrick ETC.
If you like to discuss a Cooper buildup, don't hesitate.....call us.
peter
Team M7
562-608-8123
I think there IS a market for upgrades for the MC. You don't hear much because there are "limited options" right now and so MC owners are used to that expectation. It's a catch 22, not much out there so few ask but more would ask if there were a viable and affordable option.
Some ideas-
Although individual upgrades are attractive- like an AGS for the MC, I think there is also a demand for a tuner kit for the MC including mods that are integrated for each other. Something like:
AGS for MC with heat shield
Larger throttlebody
Ported and polished cylinder head
MTH software
Schrick cam
Cat-back exhaust
Magnecor wires (edit-
thanks)MSD coil
In my area there are a fair number of MC vs MCS. Some MC have already been upgraded with intakes and Cat-back exhausts, springs, wheels, rear swaybars, etc.
You can also offer the tuner kit in stages. Good luck.
Last edited by minihune; 06-06-2005 at 11:27 AM.
#58
06-06-2005, 01:55 PM
Originally Posted by M7
s.
[snip]
As for the Cosworth MINI S, we decided that superb drivabillity and reliability was of utmost importance, not to squeeze out the last 10 HP.
[snip)
The Cosworth car has also been the test bed for some new products that you could expect soon.
[more snipping]
peter
Team M7
562-608-8123
[snip]
As for the Cosworth MINI S, we decided that superb drivabillity and reliability was of utmost importance, not to squeeze out the last 10 HP.
[snip)
The Cosworth car has also been the test bed for some new products that you could expect soon.
[more snipping]
peter
Team M7
562-608-8123
Without falling into a peeing contest over numbers and dyno irregularities, it sounds like the Cosi Mini S may have it over on the JCW, especially when fully fitted out with cam and 93 oct fuel. I applaud your choice to maintain driveability and reliability by not seeking the last 10hp. These traits are extremely important to me and I am now even more interested because of your caution and prudence.
I would like to go on record that I am not really concerned over the badging.
#59
06-06-2005, 07:09 PM
Originally Posted by minihune
Peter,
I think there IS a market for upgrades for the MC. You don't hear much because there are "limited options" right now and so MC owners are used to that expectation. It's a catch 22, not much out there so few ask but more would ask if there were a viable and affordable option.
Some ideas-
Although individual upgrades are attractive- like an AGS for the MC, I think there is also a demand for a tuner kit for the MC including mods that are integrated for each other. Something like:
AGS for MC with heat shield
Larger throttlebody
Ported and polished cylinder head
MTH software
Schrick cam
Cat-back exhaust
Magnecor wires (edit- thanks)
MSD coil
In my area there are a fair number of MC vs MCS. Some MC have already been upgraded with intakes and Cat-back exhausts, springs, wheels, rear swaybars, etc.
You can also offer the tuner kit in stages. Good luck.
I think there IS a market for upgrades for the MC. You don't hear much because there are "limited options" right now and so MC owners are used to that expectation. It's a catch 22, not much out there so few ask but more would ask if there were a viable and affordable option.
Some ideas-
Although individual upgrades are attractive- like an AGS for the MC, I think there is also a demand for a tuner kit for the MC including mods that are integrated for each other. Something like:
AGS for MC with heat shield
Larger throttlebody
Ported and polished cylinder head
MTH software
Schrick cam
Cat-back exhaust
Magnecor wires (edit-
thanks)MSD coil
In my area there are a fair number of MC vs MCS. Some MC have already been upgraded with intakes and Cat-back exhausts, springs, wheels, rear swaybars, etc.
You can also offer the tuner kit in stages. Good luck.
as long as i wont have to worry about reliability issues, i wouldnt have a problem with swapping the head and cam along with a header and the exhaust. i would buy the AGS/c either way, but it would be nice if a nice reliable upgrade for us MC owners was available to get my car up a bit closer to an MCS and some of my friends cars.
#60
06-14-2005, 03:24 PM
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ATTN M7 - We actually bought our MC instead of the MCS because we knew you were working on a turbo for the MC that supposedly would have more hp than a standard MCS. Not only does the standard Cooper have a much smoother, sexier, and most importantly classic look, nothing would be better than beating an MCS. There is a huge market for MC owners! A lot of us purchased our cars knowing that they are lighter and handle better. We are all just silently (and patiently) waiting for you.
#61
06-14-2005, 05:27 PM
While I can appreciate why you bought your MC, since I've got a 2003 MC, from what I understand, the Turbo for MC was dropped not due to lack of interest but simple economics and laws of physics.
From what I've heard and read about the users of the m7 Turbo, there have been many issues that essentially all boil down to pushing the mechanical limits of a car that wasn't designed to handle so much power.
Also, I recall reading that the "safe" limit that the MC could be pushed to was close to but not more of that of a stock MCS but the price of an aftermarket Turbo was twice that of the price difference between the MC and MCS.
I believe at this time, the safest way of increasing horsepower is without turbo.
15 hp by ECU Tuning
5 hp by intake
10 hp by exhaust
= around 30 hp for a 145hp MC
Smaller lighter wheels can also help low end torque, but I wouldn't hold my breath for an MC Turbo. Now the new MC's with the Getrag could be different altogether, and finally these comments are just observations. I believe we really would need to hear from the TMMZ gang that have been doing the long term testing of Peters turbo.
From what I've heard and read about the users of the m7 Turbo, there have been many issues that essentially all boil down to pushing the mechanical limits of a car that wasn't designed to handle so much power.
Also, I recall reading that the "safe" limit that the MC could be pushed to was close to but not more of that of a stock MCS but the price of an aftermarket Turbo was twice that of the price difference between the MC and MCS.
I believe at this time, the safest way of increasing horsepower is without turbo.
15 hp by ECU Tuning
5 hp by intake
10 hp by exhaust
= around 30 hp for a 145hp MC
Smaller lighter wheels can also help low end torque, but I wouldn't hold my breath for an MC Turbo. Now the new MC's with the Getrag could be different altogether, and finally these comments are just observations. I believe we really would need to hear from the TMMZ gang that have been doing the long term testing of Peters turbo.
Originally Posted by minimonkeygrrl
ATTN M7 - We actually bought our MC instead of the MCS because we knew you were working on a turbo for the MC that supposedly would have more hp than a standard MCS. Not only does the standard Cooper have a much smoother, sexier, and most importantly classic look, nothing would be better than beating an MCS. There is a huge market for MC owners! A lot of us purchased our cars knowing that they are lighter and handle better. We are all just silently (and patiently) waiting for you.
#62
06-14-2005, 07:09 PM
Former Vendor
Being part of the TMMZ gang, i still believe a turbo is possible. I actually know someone running a turbo in his cooper (i dont think its m7 though..?) and he overcame any fears by putting in an MCS tranny.
From talking to two people who ran the M7 turbo...it seems that as long as you are reasonable and keep the boost low, you wont run into any problems. But the production that needs to be put into the turbo is VERY essential, and very painstaking. Helix is supposedly working on a turbo(for the MC)...which would be great. We shall see if that one sees the light of day, as there are possible obstacles.
IF you ever decide to go the turbo route however, its not going to be a simple bolt on and leave alone. I think that to really get the most out of it, you will have to be willing to work on the internals of the engine and keep an eye on how your engine is running. There's lots that goes into power handling and things may need to be changed in order to harness any HUGE power numbers.
Like octane said...chip,intake, exhaust, light wheels, header and throttle body will make your cooper FAST. I have got the chip intake exhaust group with 13 pound wheels...and my car flies. I'm debating putting a header and throttle body on as i have the CVT (Which is rumored to not be able to handle more than 155 torque??), and i imagine that will really loosen up a good amount of acceleration. It will never be an MCS when it comes to straight lines....but thats not what our cars are for. On runs, i have no problems keeping up with heavily modified MCS's in the twisties thanks to all of my suspension mods.
From talking to two people who ran the M7 turbo...it seems that as long as you are reasonable and keep the boost low, you wont run into any problems. But the production that needs to be put into the turbo is VERY essential, and very painstaking. Helix is supposedly working on a turbo(for the MC)...which would be great. We shall see if that one sees the light of day, as there are possible obstacles.
IF you ever decide to go the turbo route however, its not going to be a simple bolt on and leave alone. I think that to really get the most out of it, you will have to be willing to work on the internals of the engine and keep an eye on how your engine is running. There's lots that goes into power handling and things may need to be changed in order to harness any HUGE power numbers.
Like octane said...chip,intake, exhaust, light wheels, header and throttle body will make your cooper FAST. I have got the chip intake exhaust group with 13 pound wheels...and my car flies. I'm debating putting a header and throttle body on as i have the CVT (Which is rumored to not be able to handle more than 155 torque??), and i imagine that will really loosen up a good amount of acceleration. It will never be an MCS when it comes to straight lines....but thats not what our cars are for. On runs, i have no problems keeping up with heavily modified MCS's in the twisties thanks to all of my suspension mods.
#63
06-14-2005, 07:20 PM
Yes the bottom line was not "No interest" but rather the liability of
people blowing up their engines and gearboxes.Honestly we could have sold
over 50 kits in no time but.........
I'm not going to bore anyone with the details of why the MC engine is not
up to the rough enviroment of Turbo charging, here's a few why's....
cast pistons
cast rods
cast crank
low quality valves and seats
No oil squirters for pistons
No oil cooler
Etc. Etc. Etc
So again we ar not taking a chance that one of you will blow up engine.
And later posting "M7 F**** up my baby" post
So sorry no M7 MC Turbo.....
people blowing up their engines and gearboxes.Honestly we could have sold
over 50 kits in no time but.........
I'm not going to bore anyone with the details of why the MC engine is not
up to the rough enviroment of Turbo charging, here's a few why's....
cast pistons
cast rods
cast crank
low quality valves and seats
No oil squirters for pistons
No oil cooler
Etc. Etc. Etc
So again we ar not taking a chance that one of you will blow up engine.
And later posting "M7 F**** up my baby" post
So sorry no M7 MC Turbo.....
#64
06-14-2005, 07:24 PM
#65
06-14-2005, 07:42 PM
Former Vendor
#66
06-14-2005, 08:44 PM
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We have the B & B exhaust which is incredible. And this year got a pair of R90's from another Cooper, keeping the run flats even though I know that would help. Decided on H Sport springs and will have them installed Saturday. I think the Promini intake from rspeed is the best choice and probably have M7 do the throttle body. As everyone here already knows Peter from M7 is great and it was a pleasure to finally talk to him about the details about the turbo on the phone today
. Thanks Peter. If anyone has suggestions about the springs, intake or any other MC advise let me know. There are a couple of pics on our website (don't stray to far, some adult content
) www.yocheckusout.com
. Thanks Peter. If anyone has suggestions about the springs, intake or any other MC advise let me know. There are a couple of pics on our website (don't stray to far, some adult content ) www.yocheckusout.com
#67
06-14-2005, 09:13 PM
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#68
06-15-2005, 09:54 AM
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Originally Posted by rednwhitecooper
thet m7 mc turbo is nice, but i still wanna hear more about the cosworth MC kit!! it keeps getting put on the back burner here!!!
Then, maybe you can be the person to educate others on the forums :D
#69
06-15-2005, 10:56 AM
#71
09-08-2005, 10:17 PM
Peter, this is very interesting to me, I just sold a 75 Cosworth Vega and I'm picking up my MCS Convertible tomorrow, I really want to know what Cosworth's involvement was in this project, did they simply showed you how to port the head?
You said the stock valves size were unchanged, on the Vega, the head was a totally different set up, GM had a cast iron head but Cosworth had an aluminum dual overhead cam with 4 valves per cylinders.
This look like a stock Mini heads with porting, when you say 200 hp at the wheel, that sound like a way better package then JCW, the price you stated was $3519 I believe but on your site it's now $4699 does the web site price include installation over the $3519?
I need you to convince me, I'm really interested in this package but I need to know more and maybe see one car with this set up.
Thanks
Al
You said the stock valves size were unchanged, on the Vega, the head was a totally different set up, GM had a cast iron head but Cosworth had an aluminum dual overhead cam with 4 valves per cylinders.
This look like a stock Mini heads with porting, when you say 200 hp at the wheel, that sound like a way better package then JCW, the price you stated was $3519 I believe but on your site it's now $4699 does the web site price include installation over the $3519?
I need you to convince me, I'm really interested in this package but I need to know more and maybe see one car with this set up.
Thanks
Al
#72
09-08-2005, 11:06 PM
#73
09-09-2005, 08:10 AM
Originally Posted by M7
Good Morning....
The webmaster pulled the trigger before I had a chance to proof read
the page. There's much more information to be added and hopefully we will have it up within 24hrs,
As for pricing, you will be surprised
Here's a sample:
M7/Cosworth Stage 3
1. Cosworth ported head.
2. Cosworth Cam (Schrick for now).
3. M7 AGS/ pro with 62mm TB
4. M7 400cc injectors
5. M7 Oil Catch Can
6. M7/ Cosworth software uppgrade
7. Exterior "Power By Cosworth badges"
8. Cosworth serial # badge for cam cover
This package can be had for $ 3519.00 We have heads in stock for
immediate delivery on our packages....
peter
Team M7
562-608-8123
The webmaster pulled the trigger before I had a chance to proof read
the page. There's much more information to be added and hopefully we will have it up within 24hrs,
As for pricing, you will be surprised
Here's a sample:
M7/Cosworth Stage 3
1. Cosworth ported head.
2. Cosworth Cam (Schrick for now).
3. M7 AGS/ pro with 62mm TB
4. M7 400cc injectors
5. M7 Oil Catch Can
6. M7/ Cosworth software uppgrade
7. Exterior "Power By Cosworth badges"
8. Cosworth serial # badge for cam cover
This package can be had for $ 3519.00 We have heads in stock for
immediate delivery on our packages....
peter
Team M7
562-608-8123
Thanks
Al
#74
09-09-2005, 09:49 AM
Originally Posted by rednwhitecooper
WTF, they say for MINI Cooper and Cooper S, but ive failed to see ANY Cooper parts on M7's site......
Us standard Cooper owners need a site thats sells parts for OUR cars.
Instead of buying a part, getting it and going to install it only to find out its ONLY FOR AN S, we could buy parts just for Coopers!!!!
HEY, NOT EVERYONE HAS AN S!!!!!!
Us standard Cooper owners need a site thats sells parts for OUR cars.
Instead of buying a part, getting it and going to install it only to find out its ONLY FOR AN S, we could buy parts just for Coopers!!!!
HEY, NOT EVERYONE HAS AN S!!!!!!
(of course it's not as extensive as our "S" section, but it's gradually growing.)http://www.mini-madness.com/index.asp
Last edited by mmMatt; 09-09-2005 at 09:53 AM.
#75
09-09-2005, 10:21 AM
Originally Posted by rednwhitecooper
unless it says it will fit a cooper, i'm not buiyng it. ive done that before because they said oh, ok mini cooper, like theres only one type of mini cooper.
wrong, only for an s,
no thanks, i'll go somewhere else.....
also, id like performance parts for the cooper, not just wings, spoilers and grilles...not the universal stuff
wrong, only for an s,
no thanks, i'll go somewhere else.....
also, id like performance parts for the cooper, not just wings, spoilers and grilles...not the universal stuff
I'm also a Cooper owner, and I feel the same frustration, only more so. I have an '05 Cooper, and there are enough differences that lots of the '02 thru '04 stuff for Coopers won't fit on '05 Coopers. For example, I can't find a single CAI that will fit an '05 Cooper.
Looks like there's a big untapped market here.
Joe L.