I did some research on lowering the car. I found out that people are having problem w/ their H@R coilover. I am looking for jux around 1" drop. Should I just go for the H&R stage 2 spring or for the coilover?? which coilover has the most flexibility to adjust the height? I will be down in NJ and I don't want the snow damage my aero kit bumper!!!

thanks in advance..

Ed

 

If you don't plan to do serous auto-x or road racing, the h-sport springs
on stock shocks work pretty well. 1in drop all around...haven't scraped
my front-end just yet. (aero kit).

on 205/45/17's

 

>>If you don't plan to do serous auto-x or road racing, the h-sport springs
>>on stock shocks work pretty well. 1in drop all around...haven't scraped
>>my front-end just yet. (aero kit).
>>
I m planning to do autoX... the only thing I m worry about is the winter road condition....!!!! sigh...

btw, did u change ur rear control arms too??

Ed

 

>>>>If you don't plan to do serous auto-x or road racing, the h-sport springs
>>>>on stock shocks work pretty well. 1in drop all around...haven't scraped
>>>>my front-end just yet. (aero kit).
>>>>
>>I m planning to do autoX... the only thing I m worry about is the winter road condition....!!!! sigh...
>>
>>btw, did u change ur rear control arms too??

EDK13,
If you plan to do autoX then you have to think about your mod budget and how serious you want to get with suspension.
There are two general camps on autoX. One is that it is largely driver skill applied to a basic car that will get you the farthest- thus H-stock for an MC or G-stock for an MCS and a great driver will do well. So no suspension mods.

If you do springs and wheels you get into STS or worse. Pulley upgrade gets you into SM. Then even if you are a good driver your MINI cannot be modded enough to keep up with the competition. Even with coil overs it will be hard not to mention the cost of that upgrade. If you want your suspension to be competitive then you have to think about having front and rear camber adjustable. This means camber plates in front and rear adjustable control arms. Otherwise you don't really need them unless you want to adjust rear camber with the control arms and forget the front camber and just stick to springs that lower the MINI a small 1" amount like H-sports, Eibachs, or Alta springs. All are good choices.

To learn more call Randy Webb at Webbmotorsports.com or Eric Savage at Helix13.com
Both do autoX and both sell the full line of suspension mods from simple to fully modded.
Also whenever you think of doing suspension mods don't forget to plan on the right wheels to match your suspension.
Often times your aftermarket rims will fit a smaller range of wheel offsets like from 42 to 48mm or you may risk getting rubbing of the tire outer rim against the wheel well inner plastic.

 

have you checked out maybe the KW coilovers? or even just a set of H-
Sport springs with Koni yellow shocks (the route i may take myself).

 

like Kenchan said, unless you are a very serious competitor, a coil-over setup is overkill. A set of lowering springs will most likely fit the bill. H-Sport's springs are still the best on the market, offering slightly lower ride height and improved spring rates that dial out some understeer for a more neutral handling MINI.

Cheers,
Ryan

 

thnx for all input guys!!!!! I personally think coilover is kinda overkill too! and now come to a point that I hv to choice between... H-sport (with around 1" drop) and H&R stage 2 (with around 1.5&quot drop.... any suggestion? I know H-sport has good quality... how about H&R stage 2???

thanks a lots

Ed

 

I m planning to do autoX... the only thing I m worry about is the winter road condition....!!!! sigh...
btw, did u change ur rear control arms too??
>>

ed- I think 1in drop you'll be okay in the snow. might be a good idea to
invest in winter wheel set with 195/60/16's if you'd like to lift the car up
a tad if you do encounter rubbing. In my case, when I stuck my car through
the autowash one time (in salty chicago), the rails rubbed the rear shock bottom.
I decided not to drive my mcs in the wet any more! if I had the taller
sidewall, it would've cleared the rails and additional snow clearance!!

No, my control arms are factory. imho, unless you drop the car 1.5" or more youll
still be within factory tolerance so you're fine. if you do plan to autox, you
may want to lessen the rear camber to improve turning. Rear swaybar would
also be good too.

When my stock shocks blow, I will be moving up to the Koni's. I was thinking
about doing KW's, but tried the Hsport with factory struts and it's good enough
for the streets. The rebound is a tad fast for me, but not bad enough to spend
more money on it right now.

 

Do the h-sports. Great for auto-x and track days. Get the rear camber links, you will not like the ride without them. Consider doing the koni shocks at the same time. You will do the same amount of work to replace the springs as you would to replace the springs and shocks at the same time. Make sure you do the rear sway bar while you are in there.

The difference is amazing.
Ubercooper

 

I also took the H-sport rear control arm in consideration...I am worrying about the quality of the control arms. Will it be stronger compare to the stock one?

thanks

Ed

 

Do you need to drill out the top mounts to get the Koni piston shafts to
go though?

 

Interesting. I was told by many that lowering the car will effect rear camber and thus producing more understeer. )
H&R is a pretty reputable name in racing.

 

any other opinions on this?

 

Here's why I believe the H-Sport springs are the way to go, take it or leave it (and I also sell the H&R):

The MINI has limited front suspension travel, and more than 1" or so of drop leaves you riding the bump stops under hard cornering.

- The H-Sport springs lower the car 7/8" to 1", and replace the stock bump stops with shorter, harder poly stops, regaining most of the lost travel.

The MINI is programmed with understeer for safety from the factory - most cars are today. The way to dial out understeer is to stiffen the rear of the car. That can be done with spring rate, or swaybar.

- The H-Sport springs are the only springs on the market that split the front to rear rate, with a stiffer rear rate to dial out understeer.

When you go stiffer, you may lose ride quality. Most of the lowering spring companies realize this, and counter with a "progressive rate" spring. This is essentially a variable wind that gives a soft rate under slight compression, with a firmer and firmer rate as the spring is compressed (as in under hard cornering).

- While the H-Sport springs are progressive, so are most of the others on the market, such as the H&R, so it really isn't an advantage, just a good thing.

Lastly, the H-Sport springs are very competetive in the market price wise. It's pretty rare that you can get the best product at less than the most expensive price!

- The H-Sport springs range from $240 to 215 depending on where you buy them (again, I price match )

As for your dilemma on what to do with a set up for autocross, it is a great question, and one I hear all the time. I think that unless you are nationally competing, and you are a competitive driver on a national level, the coilovers are not for you. They simply cost too much for the advantage gained.

What are the advantages? Well, the biggest difference is the ability to corner balance the car. The other is being able to select your spring rate in some cases. Finally, most coilover kits allow you to fine tune the compression and/or rebound. They can even be custom specified in some cases.

What does that equate to in lap times? If properly set up, and driven by a consistent and skilled driver, only about .5 seconds on a 1:20 road course. Less than that on a 1:00 autocross course.

I would recommend, as many of the others here have, looking first at the H-Sport springs, then - only after your stock units have worn out - going to the Koni Yellows which allow for rebound adjustment (albeit not easliy in the rear). The reason I say that is because I think MINI got it pretty right on the stock compression and rebound. Take the money you have saved from not getting coilovers and buy front camber plates (I like the RDR and the new ones I'm designing that haven't hit the market yet) and lower camber links for the rear. Then you won't have to worry about if the rear camber is off - you can set it.

Feel free to contact me on set up questions - toe, camber, swaybar.

As far as the rear camber without adjustment after lowering the car, it really depends a lot on the car. I had fast time of day in a car with H-Sport springs and no rear camber adjustment in the morning before the tires corded on the front this past weekend. Some cars will end up with over 2 degrees of negative camber in the rear after springs, while others will be just about where you want them - 1.5 or less. If you are doing it yourself and are on a budget, do the springs and see where your car is it. Then, only if you need them get the camber links for the rear.

Hope that helps!

Randy



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This still ain't no disco!

 

Thanks for the detailed reply Randy.

Maybe I'll do just that. Just went to 16's and I think lowering would look better but it isn't worth it to me if it isn't going to have a positive effect. I am about functionality and efficiency and not throwing money away.
:smile:

 

Aren't some of the really competitive autocrossers in STX running -1.2 degrees camber in the rear and -2.2 up front?

I'm running all H&R stuff on my car, and I can honestly say that it's working extremely well. I like the look better than the H-Sports, since there was a tiny bit more of a drop. IMHO, the 19mm rear H&R swaybar is a perfect compliment on the stiffest setting. I think H&R did a good job matching up the spring rate and the stiffness of their rear swaybars...

After installing the H&R springs, my car is sitting at about -2 in the front and -1.2 in the rear... and it's wicked fast through the corners...

I plan on upgrading to adjustable Konis paired up with the H&R springs at some point in the future. But right now, the car is dialed!

 

Ditto Randy -- thanks for the great writeup. I'm sure everyone here appreciates it, I certainly do. :smile:

 

FYI outmotoring.com still has alta springs on sale for $180. I helped install these in a friends car and they worked out well. Keep in mind that some dealers will not fix rattles under warranty on a car with aftermarket springs.