>>


Why don't the numbers on the charted lines match up with the numbers on the top of the graph?

 

>>Why don't the numbers on the charted lines match up with the numbers on the top of the graph?


The numbers on the chart represent a timeslice. Both cars will not necessaily make their peak HP at the same time/rpm and they definitely won't peak their torque at that same time/rpm too.

 

>>
>>The numbers on the chart represent a timeslice. Both cars will not necessaily make their peak HP at the same time/rpm and they definitely won't peak their torque at that same time/rpm too.
>>


Ahhh, I see that now

 

After you changed to a 15 or 19% pulley, what effect did it have on mileage? Are there any tradeoffs with 19% or is it all pure fun?

 

I haven't seen any change in mileage going from 15% to 19%. Before that, I hadn't seen any change in mileage going from stock to 15%.

 

I'm sure I'm not the only one with this OLD request, but where is the dyno chart done on the same car with the stock, 15% and 19% pulley? If it's already been posted forgive me, I did a search and came up empty handed.

I would think it would be most useful if a big A$$ fan was blowing over the intercooler, (IC) to simulate "real world" conditions. Correct me if I'm way off base, but wasn't there discussion earlier that the gains achieved with the 19% would be negated by the increased heat produced and " heat soak"?

Where is this "dyno testimonial" done on the same car after the IC has heated up???

 

>>My reason for using 2nd gear for stuff like that is the difficulty in finding safe and legal places to do such runs in higher gears. <<

Yea, like downtown Philadelphia.

 

I had to negotiate these two intersections both directions last night:

http://www.statefarm.com/di/danlist00.htm

Performance testing comes second to self-preservation in areas like that.

 

>>>I wonder how the 19% will hold up in the dead heat of summer days. This will be the first summer for the 19% pulley since its introduction. Interesting to see the result!

No it is not the first summer, I had mine all of last summer, if i am not mistakes several others were "testing" last summer no problems

 

Caddman - did I remember reading that you're in FL? The summers get awful hot here in Atlanta (a couple of triple-digit days), so I'm interested in the comparison.

 

>>Caddman - did I remember reading that you're in FL? The summers get awful hot here in Atlanta (a couple of triple-digit days), so I'm interested in the comparison.
>>

Caddman is from Charleston, which is about as equally hot as in Atlanta (I have lived both places and currently live in Atlanta). Charleston sometimes feels a little cooler because of the nice breeze, compared to no breeze ever in Atlanta.

Anyway, Caddman had some really nice photos of his supercharger vanes from his supercharger with 40,000 miles of 19% pulley runs. It looked identical to stock. I couldn't tell any difference. That is a testimony to the reliability of the mod. The 19% pulley shouldn't affect the reliability of the motor as much as the reliability of the supercharger. That is what is experiencing the increased number of turns as well as the brunt of the heat. If after 40,000 miles with the 19% pulley the vanes still look stock, I would say that is a pretty good indication there are no major problems. A lot of people in Hawaii have been running with them in the heat as well and no problems yet. To increase the performance boost of the 19% you may want to get a larger intercooler. This would help offset the temp increase to the engine, even though that still doesn't seem to be too big of a problem either. Andy's measurements do not show that big of an increase in heat buildup. An intercooler with another 10-20% efficiency would easily offset the temperature increases.

 

So what is the PSI for stock super charger? I see that 19% reduction has it at around 8-9 psi... per Andys dyno post.

What kinda HP gain are we talking between 15%,17%,19% reduction?

Compare that with risk, cost... I dont know if my supercharger/ engine is worth 3-4 extra HP.... If its too big of a jump.... then that may be worth the risk.

 

These are estimates from what I've seen:
15%.....15lbs of torque, equal horsepower
19%.....20-22lbs of torque, only slightly more horsepower than 15%
17%.....Somewhere in between.

 

Ok, so is this then
15% =aprx 15 hp
17%= 17 HP
19&=19 hp?

Thats what I am wondering, how the HP breakdown is for each percent reduction or as close to it as possible.

 

>>Caddman is from Charleston, which is about as equally hot as in Atlanta (I have lived both places and currently live in Atlanta). Charleston sometimes feels a little cooler because of the nice breeze, compared to no breeze ever in Atlanta.

Aint that the truth.

>>Anyway, Caddman had some really nice photos of his supercharger vanes from his supercharger with 40,000 miles of 19% pulley runs. It looked identical to stock. I couldn't tell any difference. That is a testimony to the reliability of the mod. The 19% pulley shouldn't affect the reliability of the motor as much as the reliability of the supercharger. That is what is experiencing the increased number of turns as well as the brunt of the heat. If after 40,000 miles with the 19% pulley the vanes still look stock, I would say that is a pretty good indication there are no major problems. A lot of people in Hawaii have been running with them in the heat as well and no problems yet. To increase the performance boost of the 19% you may want to get a larger intercooler. This would help offset the temp increase to the engine, even though that still doesn't seem to be too big of a problem either. Andy's measurements do not show that big of an increase in heat buildup. An intercooler with another 10-20% efficiency would easily offset the temperature increases.

Okay, that sounds like a reasonable assumption. Any recommendations on a larger intercooler? About 75-80% of all the performance threads involve intake, pulley, and exhaust - with the rest of the parts (TB, IC, heads, cam, spark plugs, etc.) filling out the rest. I don't recall a whole lot of threads that talk about intercooler options.

Doug

 

Doug,

At this point there are not a lot of intercooler options. They can be broken down to air-to-air and air-to-water. You can read a lot on the pros and cons of these on this site and webbmotorsports.com/forums. There is one air-to-air at this point, and it is made by Alta. MSFITOY purchased and installed one, but they are expensive at $990. Both Mini-madness and Webbmotorsports have a air-to-water intercooler at about the same price. RDR is developing an air-to-air intercooler which should be cheaper than Alta's. It should be released quite shortly. Webbmotorsports is also developing a front mounted air-to-air intercooler. It is quite a novel design but it appears the pricing will be above $2,000.

 

>>Doug,
>>
>>At this point there are not a lot of intercooler options. They can be broken down to air-to-air and air-to-water. You can read a lot on the pros and cons of these on this site and webbmotorsports.com/forums. There is one air-to-air at this point, and it is made by Alta. MSFITOY purchased and installed one, but they are expensive at $990. Both Mini-madness and Webbmotorsports have a air-to-water intercooler at about the same price. RDR is developing an air-to-air intercooler which should be cheaper than Alta's. It should be released quite shortly. Webbmotorsports is also developing a front mounted air-to-air intercooler. It is quite a novel design but it appears the pricing will be above $2,000.

I'm working on a top mount larger than the Alta that should be considerly cheaper too.

 

As for intercoolers.... I would love to upgrade mine. It would make me feel a whole lot better about jumping into a pulley install. As was mentioned already, the $1000 for the Alta is just a bit pricey. Thus, I am holding off on the pulley upgrade to make sure that I wont have any overheating in the summer.

I am still trying to find out what the stock PSI is for the SC. It has been posted for psi for the reduction pulleys... Anyways, I am awating the intercooler from RDR... hopefully its a bit less than the Alta.

 

well using the promini boost gauge, and my stock pulley, the most I've seen is 11 psi. compare that to Andy's 15.5 and 17.5 from the graph on the previous page

_________________
Motorin' ... right now!

 

That is correct for the units. This is the max psi.. under heavy acceleration... what about just idle? What is the range for the psi? That you have seen....Where is Andy when you need him???

 

Yup, that is absolute max that I can get, foot to the floor at high rpm. At idle (even at cruising) its in vacuum so there's no boost to speak of. The range? well 0-11 (more correctly its negative something to +11 but I dont have that number in my head). If you meant the range of the gauge, it maxes out at 30psi.

 

if money is an issue (ain't it always???), jscspeed.com has the ALTA intercooler for $899. Hope this helps someone out there in the MINI world...

Marty

 

I'm going to do the pulley upgrade soon and can't decide between the 15 and 19.
I live near Atlanta so heat is an issue where I live.

To go with the 15, I believe you really only need one step cooler plugs?

For the 19, what kind of plugs do you need?
Sounds like the extra heat only affects the life of the SC, not the engine?
So to increase the SC life and lower the heat to get the most performance out of the 19, a larger/better intercoller is recommeneded? Are most people with the 19 using a larger intercoller?
And, is a different belt or any other parts recommened for use with the 19?

Thanks

 

Great questions jzlemon!

Let me see if I can address them, someone correct me if I am wrong please!

1- 19% requires colder plugs to increase the performance.

2/3- Extra heat does affect the SC and the Engine. If all that over heats you're going to have crack of the block etc etc etc. So a larger intercooler would reduce the overheating issue. As for upgrading the intercooler you are not going to extend the life of the SC w/19% reduction. The life will be cut in aprox. 1/3 the time.

For the last part of 3- With the 17% and 19% you need a smaller SC belt.

The 15% has been tested and results have proved that it is reliable. They use something similar in the JCW, I believe 13& reduciton, and its well within the limits of the Eaton Supercharger. Anything over that you are now strechting.

As with the 19% you may have to do the ECU upgrade... I know the 17% doesnt require it, but I am not sure about the 19%.... Hope this helps!! If any of this is incorrect please let me know or correct it. Thanks!!

 

I know of several people who are running the 19% with stock intercooler in the southeast without any problems, but they are not doing any type of racing, or continous driving hard driving, they just wanted the extra gains for trips to the drag strip. I personally feel that they should at least be looking into cryo or something, but they are reporting to me no problems(just two ranges colder plugs) so i think it is a matter of preference....