I am sorry but these comments about "Instant Classic" is just pure ignorant drivel. Talk about *******'s and opinions! Go to any classic car or motorcycle auction and SEE what holds its value. Is it some ratted out specimen hitting the local drags and autocrosses every week for 20 years with its header and high performance after-market add-ons, or a BONE stock verifiable low mileage example of a vehicle exactly as it rolled off the showroom, 20 or 30 years before?

Have FUN with any vehicles you own but don't think it's ever an investment unless you drive it to a storage locker and bring it out once a year until you sell it 20 years later, and be sure you had the omnipotent foresight to KNOW which vehicle everyone will be wanting.

Who'd have guessed the vehicles now that sell at the Barrett auctions at upwards of 50K that sold new for 4 or 5K or less?

A VW split-window microbus that sells for 45K to 60K as a sought after classic, I had 3 of those for well under 1K in their time!

 

I tend to like the lights in the hood instead. Makes a clean work space. And you can send morse code to the mother ship...

Which happens whenever a new model is introduced for any manufacturer.


Anyways. To the OP: If you're looking for initial appeal, go for the R56. If you're looking at something you can mod RIGHT NOW, go for the R53. But I am starting to see some mods only available for the R56 that are not for the R53. Saddens me, really.

 

Good points - cars are absolutely lousy as a pure investment, and I think deep down, everyone knows it. Even the cars that you mentioned (4-5k new, going for 50k now) are losers, from a return-on-investment standpoint.

If in 1968, you had bought a car for $4000, and had put another $4000 in traditional diversified investments, the traditional investments would likely be worth around $150,000 today. How many 40-year old cars are worth 150k now (especially after you deduct the money you would have spent insuring, storing and maintaining the car for 40 years)? And would you have had the foresight in 1968 to know which car to pick?

And many of the cars that bring in the truly *obscene* dollars now (like the 1971 convertible Hemicuda) were actually the *least* desirable versions when they were new. No one wanted to put the most expensive, most powerful engine in the heaviest body available (the convertible). That's why there were less than a dozen made. Sure, they're worth a mint now, but you would have had to be crazy to buy one in 1971 as an investment.

 

Not sure I understand the obsession of some posters here with resale value and other financial or coldly rational arguments for the R56 being the better car? Hate to say this, but that kind of talk only seems to fit with criteria that some have (at least partially correctly) accused BMW of prioritizing in the R56 - comfort, accessibility, inoffensiveness. Great criteria if we were shopping mid-priced sedans. But I thought we were discussing minis in this thread, and JCW minis at that (as per OP)?

If someone buys an R56 thinking primarily about getting the "newest" mini, good for them. And I understand that since it is the only mini available new now, it seems like the only option to many. What cannot be denied is that those who love the mini for the famed visceral driving experience seem to all have similar criticisms of the R56. And as the good doctor pointed out above, there have been more than a few owners who, given timing of their purchase, trusted BMW enough to buy the R56, then quickly (and sadly) saw the car had changed so fundamentally that the search for the newest R53 to trade "up to" began (my gallery tells one story - with a happy ending for me, I might add!). Others are ordering R53 'verts, even if they would normally prefer a coupe, before the coming changeover.

Getting back to the OP, I think many open-minded mini enthusiasts who have spent time driving both cars would state that the R56 JCW should be quicker than the R53 JCW (assuming the R56 was not on the sloppy base suspension else all bets are off!). But quicker <> better. And newer <> better.

Spend time driving both generations and see which speaks to you. Drive, after drive, after drive. When you are out on the road away from the NAM forums and either the R53 or R56 peer group, which car is the one that you enjoy driving (either tearing it up on a good road or just cruising along or even stuck in traffic), which do you enjoy sitting in and looking around, which do you enjoy walking up to after a day at work or school, which do you most like to crack the hood on to show to inquiring friends? The answer to those sorts of "less rational" questions are more relevant to a lot of mini owners than "which is newest, which has most hp/tq numbers". Something to think about, at least.

 

i can see why an r56 owner would see the word classic and immedeatley start thinking about resale value, they aren't thinking about keeping their cars that long. In 20 years the r53 will FEEL just as special as it does today, it has that special something that speaks to the driver. no span of time can rob the r53 of its special feel- it's got it. it's that same special feeling or lack of it that makes the mk1 and mk2 cars so different, and is why the r53 will be enjoyed for years to come- it has that timeless driver appeal and involvement that just isn't there in the r56. like the mk1 gti vs the mk3 gti, the mk3 has more power, fancier interior, it's even bigger and more but nobody wants one, it doesn't have that "thing" that you can find in any mk1. and maybe i'm wrong but i think the mk 1 gti is considered a classic in some circles, right? IMO the r56 has lost what makes the r53 so great. the cool thing about the r56 is that it made the r53 a classic as soon as the first rolled off the production line, yay!!

 

sorry, think i'm way off the point of this thread

 

*agree*

 

i have not driven the r56, so i will not pretend to know how it drives and defend it, but for me... turbo > supercharger, hands down. There's more potential in it, period. Granted, it seems the r56 turbo is undersized for any real immediate power but with a replacement snail you'll get more power from a turbo over a sc. Im not going to go into the aesthetics or suspension, because just from reading about the two and seeing pictars, the r53 wins that battle for me hands down. But engine to engine, i like the 56. Plus (and i know this offends 90% of the people on here)... but i have just never understood the appeal of the SC whine. Sounds like a damn electric car haha. For me, turbos definitely SOUND sexier and nothin wins me over like a bov pshhh. But that's just sound, i'd go performance over some stupid sounds any day

 

My comment about classic had nothing to do with value and everything to do with enthusiast support and interest. There's a reason most of the "Die Hard" MINI owners still have R53's, and it has nothing to do with cost.

I have no intentions of selling my car, and couldn't give a rat's *** about resale value. R53's are still selling for 95% of their original value here in SoCaL by the way.

And I certainly don't drag race my car... talk about boring.

As for the comparison people keep making between the engines, there isn't one. They are two completely different engines. One of them is bullet proof, simple, and easy to work on, the other is unknown (Already has major issues with cam chain tensioners and hydraulic lifters) VERY difficult to work on (Expect to pay $$$$$$$$$$$$ for out of warranty repairs) and incredibly complicated.

One of them keeps on chugging even up to 8200+ RPM redlines people have imposed, the other dies off at 5k RPM's. Sure, you can change the turbo, then it keeps going to 8k, and has no power until 4k.

People keep bringing up cars as investments? I have no interest in keeping my car as an investment. I'm highly against garage queens. If you buy a car, DRIVE THE DAMN THING!

That's part of the reason why I could never own more than 4-5 cars, because if I didn't drive it I wouldn't own it. I'm the kind of person that would daily drive an Ariel Atom on the street.

 

Some of us aren't interested in having a car that sounds like every other modified turbo car on the road. The SC gives the car character beyond what any production car on the road today has. Drive past someone with their eyes closed in a MINI and they know it was a MINI.

Beyond that, I already explained why I have no interest in a car that makes it's power from 1800 - 5k RPM's. That's great if all you do with your car is pick up laundry, but I actually drive mine.

 

a few days ago. Wore a helmet!

Not sure about the trailer queens holding value better than racers. Take a look at what it takes to buy a factory or verifiable historic racer, and it's a pretty penny, even with the kiss into the tire wall and the fact that it's on it's 17th clutch. Provinance is more expensive than pristine that is more expensive than hacked. Since so many of the nice older cars are being bought up and rotissary restored, there is more and more interest in unrestored cars that really haven't been beat and still are original. The world keeps turning....

Oh yeah, best is so subjective on this one, the debate is pointless. But I did learn something here, Rustboy155 really doesn't like the R56... Oh wait... I knew that already....

Matt

 

I don't dislike it, I just prefer the R53 over it. If I had the money to buy an R56 in conjunction with my car, then I'd be all over it (Ok, that's a lie, I'd rather have a used Lotus Elise, .

 

I'm going to echo a little bit here - the decision cannot be made "by the numbers" as they are comparable in performance and different in character. Really, buying a Mini at all is not a "by the numbers" decision as the cars are all about emotion, fun, character, passion. There are dozens of cars that can outperform the Mini in any particular arena - from ride comfort to utility to autocross/slalom to cupholders.

I had an R56 loaner car for a few days and found the engine to be pleasant and usable for daily driving, but it was the little things that drove me crazy. I disliked the turn signal stalk and the way it functions. I disliked the rear quarter windows - they leave a much larger blind spot than in the R53. I didn't like that the hood scoop was only aesthetic, not functional. I liked the multi-function display but hated the speedo/radio combination. The seats are much better but the toggle switches are less accessible.

It's like being in a long-term relationship. Do you think it matters to me what her opinion is on US Imperialism and foreign policy? No. It matters much more which way the toilet paper roll sits in the holder. (Paper comes over the top, BTW).

It is on these types of opinions you should base your decision to buy the car. This car is an emotional purchase anyway - pick which one makes you the happiest, regardless of what it does on paper.

In the end, the R56 experience made me happier with my R53 and merely encouraged me to fix its minor shortcomings - a day after I gave up the R56, I ordered a pulley and intake. About a month later, the Recaro seat and JCW wheel. With just the basic low-cost mods (well except for that seat...) I've made a car that is just how I wanted it.

 

Well said!

PS:
Also a proponent of paper over the top.

 

I thought my R53 could/should perform better so as soon as the R56 hit the showroom, I went for a test drive. Yes it seemed a little quicker, but many cars have more get-up-and-go than a mini cooper, and overall I was disappointed with the car. So upon returning to the dealer and looking at the various new minis on display, including the original Cooper S convertible, I made my way to the exit. Then I saw it!!! I don't know how I missed it on the way in. Maybe it was that I had eyes for the new mini, and just didn't focus. It was a 2006 factory prepared R53 Mini Cooper S JCW with the JWC suspension and 7,200 miles. Some dude (who is probably sorry by now) had just traded-in for the new R56, and the dealer was selling the JCW as a MINI First (6yrs and 100,000/mile warrantee). Well they let me drive the car, and for the first time I felt that the car was right.

No question, the R53 is superior to the R56 for a driver's car, particularly with the full JWC setup.

Cheers

 

With that this thread might as well be over. There is nothing else to say.
Rustyboy has left the building!

 

So shall it be written, so shall it be done.
R53 and paper over the top.

 

I wonder if stevo is still reading this thread?

He needs to get out and drive, pure and simple. Or he can get an R53 and score rustyboy155 a nice commission!

 

Many of you mention resale value.

When I lost my 03 Mini in May of 06 to fire it was 3yrs old w/82k on it. My insurance company said it was worth over 18k at the time. I was shocked.
It was the first car I ever had equity on. If it weren't for the high milage my check for the car would have been even better.
We'll see if the R56 hold up to that.

Minian

 

and now I can say that the R53 is more fun on the track, and the R56 is nicer on the street.

Who really cares about suspension feel, that's one of the easiest to change. Slap on some coil overs and your done!

On the track running out of HP before red-line made the car feel sluggish. You need to shift much earlier in with the newer car. It needs a bigger turbo, but then you get more lag....

Matt

 

i've driven a 56 for a month ... and just for raw evilness and prowess hands down its 53 for me... im a 53 owner so im biassed ... but driving the 56 is what got me into mcs's ...driving the 53 stole my heart... that bulldog stance engine screem and cockpit feel did me in ... its like everyone has said before... all in your own opinion... but please test drive both ... the 56 too me felt higher and the clutch was clumsy (i was going auto anyway after 14yrs of sticks ) but this auto gets me excited and i love my paddles...so to repeat what everyone has said on here including myself draw your own conclusion ... space shuttle or fighter jet? you decide

 

Bought an 04 MCS (53) with JCW package......wow!!!! test drove a 56...just didn't do it for me...looks either. The whine of the supercharger, and the immediate "classic" design won me over. The speedo in the 56, ruins the interior. Thanks to everyone who helped me out.

 

Enjoy!

 

Grats on the new(used) car!

 

Stevo, sounds like you made a great choice and based it, wisely, on test drives of both generations... you will love your JCW! Enjoy and post some pics when you get a chance!