The real issues with tuning in another location has to do more with the car rather than the facility although the facility and equipment can present insurmountable obstacles. When I'm in my home shop I have at my disposal every diagnostic tool and data collection device that I could ever need. I also have a complete parts inventory and special tools so that I can deal with whatever problem arises. This is impossible to duplicate on the road. In most cases it's not needed but if it is and you don't have it then you're sunk. Also, we're not live tuning these cars at these locations so the changes that we have available to chose from are somewhat limited to small changes to well developed tunes for various combinations. To simply state it, the Mini is a whole lot harder to deal with than the average Subaru or Evo. Not harder to tune, but because of the method, much more time consuming. Hornguys was here most of the day and in reality there were very few changes made from his initial tune. Just the process of downloading the ecu and reflashing it after mods can take ten to fifteen minutes and this needs to be done for each set of changes. This also affects pricing because of the amount of time required to tune each car. I know that the Mini is an inexpensive car but it's powertrain management is one of the most complicated out there and this affects the costs of the final product.

 

nope....John and I had a good, long pleasant and interesting talk while I was there, right before he ran my credit card for 30% more than his advertised price. I even confirmed the price before handing over the keys to confirm so there was no misunderstanding as I'm no novice when it comes to dealing with tuners.

His response to my at the price increase was "you are the only one to ever complain" Some discussion with other active DCMM members after this showed me I was indeed not alone. Bait and Switch ain't cool, mmkay?

I meant well. He meant well. I vote with my wallet and will no longer give LDG a dime despite them being local and doing some cool things.

 

Amen to that! You owe her a nice dinner out for that priceless wisdom...

 

Originally Posted by SpiderX
funny you say that..... I have been saying I could have bought a used Elise and put $30K in the bank...... My GF reminds me that I would have never gotten to know Sid, Peter, Tuls, Jim, Eric, John, Kieth, Mark, Dave, Joe, Ryan, Matt, on and on and on...... the Mini ride has been much more than the car......

Well, clearly you are referencing knowledgeable car people you have met.

I must be on the other list .

 

Welcome to my world Bart

 

I was given a price of 700.00 for a tune at LDG and was told that it covered two hrs of tuning and that it shouldn't take any longer than that. I haven't done it yet because Jan isn't sure what size injectors to run so I still have stock 330cc. I dont want to pay 700.00 for a tune with stock injectors and then have to pay again when Jan figures out what size is best for this head.

I will say this though, If I got quoted a price before the tune and the tuner tried to charge more after it was done I wouldn't pay one more penny. After hearing about this happening I'll make sure to get my quote in writting before any work is done in the future

 

You might have though when Jan was engineering the "system" he would have figured out what size injectors he needed, but guess not of well.

 

Oh we know which size we are using..... We aren't telling people who want to steal our stuff.... If you want to know what we are really running you have to buy the system.


unlike some we actually test things before releasing our products. There are so many on here running high rev limits now without proper fueling and it will be a matter of time before you see them on the side changing pistons or worse. This will be their trial and error. This is why you buy a "SYSTEM"

 

I just sent you an email Jan ,please respond

 

Everyone that has the RMW head will get the proper tune and injectors, we are nearing completion.

 

 

Sounds good Jan ...I miss my MINI...

 

Not me...I was raising hell last night with the RMW head/header...

 

Sid,

You are not helping matters here...

 

The Devil got to me...

 

Concerning PGT's input, the additional charge was to install the correct belt when we installed the pulley. An important point of this thread is this exact issue. 90% of the Minis that show up for a tune have the wrong belt and it's slipping.
Concerning which injectors to use, we already know because the options are very limited and we figured this into our design goals for our package. The fuel system, at the power level we operate at for our track cars, is a different story. It is, however, adequate for street driven cars. With a good tune the RMW head should put up good numbers but what I can't understand is why it's taking so long to develop the tune. The VE changes associated with a high flow head are very easy to compensate for. The types of mods that are very time consuming and more difficult are the ones like the M62 swap or switching to turbo charging. These require a complete redo of the way manifold pressure(air flow) is reported and long hours on the dyno.

 

don't forget about the $18 for 'shop supplies' that weren't included in your advertised price if 90% of cars need a belt for a 15% pulley (especially since my car was barely months old at the time), perhaps you ought to discuss this up front with the customer. This, you did not do. You just went ahead and charged my CC without ever mentioning it. Not cool John. Bait and switch. Your loss.....I had plenty of money to spend with you as we had discussed between a head and tune.

 

Have you ever had a car serviced? Shop supplies are standard. I'd bet John doen't give a damn where you spend your money be sure and send some of it to jesus.

 

nope. I've never even changed my oil on any car I've owned. ever.

An advertised price should be honored. LDG's advertised special to DCMM members was not. How hard is that concept to grasp? I've dealt with many shops and spent tens of thousands on mods for cars over more than ten years. I can honestly say that I felt taken advantage and told John as much. He didn't seem to care. THAT'S the point a few of us are trying to make here.

If you want to be a John fanboi despite being informed of questionable business practices, that's your call. I'll pass.

 

+1

 

Just wondering where the people that have just the head got it if you need to buy the system?

 

OK, so I am a bit slow to get into this thread, but it is very interesting and exactly the same information that I got from Don. I am a DMH supporter as he pretty much tells you like it is. It also sounds like LDG is the same way and it is refreshing to get some fresh information on these matters. Keep up the great work guys!

 

Hi John...I understand your talk with Jan went reasonably well...However, I'm wondering why you won't take him up on his offer to fly you out to CA and tune his RMW Mini? I sincerely believe you have the knowhow, experience and tools to get this done right and I hope you will reconsider taking up his offer...I think you won't regret this...Jan is a manufacturer, you are the tuner...I for one am very much looking forward for you to take this opportunity and make some real magic happen for all of us...

 

Look I'm not here to defend LDG and you are certainly entitled to your opinions as well as who you select for service but I'm not sure this is the place to air your grievences.

 

I only brought it up to serve as the counterpoint to the incessant LDG leghumping going on in this thread. It ain't all roses...