LSP is short for Last Step Product or Process. It's the last product that's applied to your paint--usually known as the wax. Though sometimes people will apply a beauty product like #7 Show Car Glaze over the wax that will provide a temporary effect for car shows, and that could be considered the LSP.

Richard

 

^^ ahhh, thanks doc!

 

I can say that Griot's has full customer service, and it is instant. They will spend an HOUR with you on phone helping you decide what to get and what not to get. They have a firm grip on how to use their products as well. They are a classy joint. No ghetto operators, no meathead old boys network either. 303 company, call them, youll get annoying meathead good ol boys thing going on. Autopia, get no one on the phone but a message thing.... things like that get you irritated after a while . I havent spoken with meguiars yet though. Their tightly wrapped window cleaner that I bought was 4oz empty as it spilled all over the inside of the box. shrug. Griot's stuff is always sealed and ultra clean. Their boars bristle brushes come so clean and well built, its freaky.

I like products that work seemlessly, are always 100% safe for every application and have no negatives. Nothing griot's has that I have used (380 dollars worth of it in one big box) has not been perfect. Some of the items might be middle of the line good, that's possible I guess. like a towel, or their clay is the same as another top brand some say. but nothing is ever WRONG with them. Actually their clay rox and doesnt take off wax when you use it speedshine. Speedshine and their vinyl and rubber dressing alone made me like their line. Being that their whole system revolves around those two substances plus their interior cleaner, I thought I couldnt go wrong with the other products.

only thing left is the carnauba paste to test. I havent as I wont put that stuff on anything but the mini and that is in 2 weeks.

Definitely though, if you go Meguiar's NXT you can save money and shop around and its great stuff that octaneguy endorses more often than not.

i think zaino and synthetics make a mirror too much from what I have seen and its not the look I want. I want depth and glow, surface perfection isnt my number 1 desire.

i wonder how 1900 dollar zymol works or doesnt !

 

Speaking of which, where has BradB disappeared to?

 

i think he's relaxing in his nice garage with his porsches and mercedes and
laughing at us saying SEE I TOLD YOU!

 

Sorry for the delay! I was super distracted last week working on taxes (and hosting my family at our house at the same time!). :impatient I didn't get a chance to visit NAM as much as I would've liked last week.

Thanks, Ords, for thinking of me.

Yo'sDad, I can guarantee that you would receive excellent customer service from us... knowledgable and friendly! We can help you out on the phone or by email. We're new to NAM so you may not have heard of us before. If you give us a try, I'm sure you won't be disappointed.

Please feel free to PM me directly (or email or call) if I can assist you in any way.

-Heather

 

What a good deal on wax, eh??

We actually sell select Zymol products in our retail store (but not online). Up until very recently, Zymol sold a cool sampler kit which included their 3 top waxes in small 2 oz jars. It included the Destiny, Atlantique, and Vintage waxes (along with several other things like HD Cleanse and Clear). Each of those waxes sells in their full size for $486, $1,116, and $1,852 per jar, respectively.

The sampler kit cost only $192.... not a bad deal if you wanted to try the very best of Zymol. Unfortunately, they have discontinued the kit. I think they realized that people would buy the kit instead of the outrageously priced individual jars.

Anyway... we have the kit and have tried all 3 of the Zymol creme de la creme. I have to admit... the Vintage is absolutely breathtaking and unbelievable! I don't think I could afford the $1.8k for it, but it really is show stopping. Here's my Vintage story...

Last year, some of the guys here prepped a mid-90's red Honda Accord, which had been very well maintained. After prepping, they used 6 different carnauba waxes on 6 different panels of the car. Then they asked me to come back and take a look.

I immediately noticed the right rear fender panel. It looked like another dimension of red! It was juicey and warm and deep... more of a deep ruby red than the plain red it was originally. The other panels looked good, but nothing like the one ruby panel. It was gorgeous! Breathtaking. Incredible. Unlike any other wax I had ever laid my eyes on. I really can't even find words to describe it accurately. When I asked which wax was on that panel they all sighed... of course it was the $1.8 Zymol wax... the Vintage!

Even after those results, I think only the uber rich can spring for a $1.8k jar of wax, even if it is an unlimited supply! Still, I thought it would be fun to share my experience with it. And no, we don't stock any of the Zymol waxes that sell over $300.

Just a fun story I thought I'd share...

-Heather

 

I would actually correct that just a tad...

Klasse normally does not have any wetness or depth on any color. On reds though it seems to offer more gloss than its usual high-shine-only look. I wouldn't say that it is the wettest or deepest though, even on red!

However, it is a nice option for red if you like the advantages of Klasse, especially the AIO (ease of use, use on trim, cleansers, fillers, etc). It dioes have a really nice glossiness on red.

Basically, IMO, I don't like the look of Klasse on any dark colors except for red. I do really like Klasse for its advantages so I would use it on lighter colors (or red) or cars that I don't want to bother super-prepping and all that (Klasse AIO preps and waxes in one step). On dark colors or light/red cars which I don't mind thoroughly prepping, I would use a full prep system and something truly wet (and more durable), like Prima Epic, which I think ultimately achieves the best results.

Hopefully that makes sense! It's odd that Klasse works so nicely on red so it's hard to explain!

-Heather

 

In our side-by-side testing (as well as in tests performed by independent groups like the Guru Reports), Zaino outlasted both of the Meguair's synthetics by a very far margin in terms of durability. (side note: we don't sell either one!)

However, as you (Yo'sDad) are new to this stuff, you will find that each product has pros and cons. Maybe Zaino outlasts Meguair's but maybe you'd like the look of Meguair's better. Or you'd like how Megs is easier to buy locally than having to mail order Zaino all the time. Or, maybe you'll find that durability is paramount to other factors. Etc, etc, etc. In other words, even among similar styles (ie synthetic or polymer waxes) there are many differences that come down to personal preference.

Ultimately, it depends on what you like in a look, application, accessibility, etc. Don't you wish there weren't so many choices sometimes?! LOL Of course, I think in reality you'll find that the variety out there is half the fun of detailing! Always something different to try.

-Heather

 

thanks for the feedback on that Vintage wax, Heather.
so, that vs. Epic, who's got the wetter look?

 

I'm certainly not going to argue with pt91, it sounds like he has had a lot of experience with other brands of car care products and I really haven't. And I think he is right about Griot's marketing machine...very slick indeed!

Having said that, however, I really do like ordering from Griot's. I'm afraid I've fallen "victim" to their slick marketing machine and have quite a bit of their stuff. It may be a bit overpriced, but I would echo the sentiments of others who have praised their customer-friendly attitude.

And a further note...I have yet to receive anything that wasn't secured as well as Fort Knox! No spills, rips, tears, etc., etc. It would seem that whatever it is that you order from them, chances are 99.9% that the items won't end up spilled all over the bottom of the box in which they were shipped!

Chuck

 

You know, it really isnt overpriced. other companies give you tiny amounts of there stuff. most of their things are reasonable. Also, nothing they have has a draw back and everything they have does what it is supposed to. Also, you know that it's 100% safe for the application you want it to be used for. Nice to know that. shrugs. One day if money is tight I may switch off, but I probabaly never will as perfectly fine is perfect for me.

 

The most important part is you have products you like and you use them regularly on your car. I still order a few things from Griot's but have expanded to many other brands over the years (at last count I had 35 different waxes/sealants in my cabinet).
Their catalog is very nice to browse through and their customer service is top notch. You tend to pay a little extra because of that.

 

also watch out for stores that charge handling! they can show a
low price under the product, but add it up at the end and get
charged $15 for shipping and "handling".. or watever. lol

how do you charge $10 for putting a couple of stuff into a
small box?! :impatient you guys got some labor union going
on with packaging guys working at $35/hr?!

Griots prices are fair imho. plus, they use high quality
boxes and packaging materials.

 

I can vouch for Griot's customer service. I called them up this morning to let them know I was unhappy with two of their products (btw, I have ordered 17 of their products over the past three months so the percentage is pretty good). I told them the synthetic chamois leaves a thin layer of water behind and the foam-type blade in their squeegie keeps coming out of the handle. So... Andy, the rep, tells me although he's never heard of the problem with the squeegie, send both items back and they'll credit me the full amount. Didn't ask me if I had a receipt. Didn't ask me how long I've had them. Didn't ask me for my account number.

Love almost all their stuff. REALLY love their Speed Shine, Tire Sauce, MF Towels, and their Customer Service.

 

cant mess with the speedshine. best thing I ever used on a car.

 

Best thing I've read here so far is PT91's advice that the PREP is 95% of your final result. Wax or whatever LSP you use is clear after all. Polish all those swirls out of your paint before you wax and you'll be amazed at the difference from just wax alone.

 

Unless you're lazy like me. Then you can just use Zaino Z5 and it does an amazing job of taking out swirl marks. I love it! I haven't polished a car yet and you really can't see any noticeable swirl marks after 6 years of owning it (washing it like crazy!)

I do use a clay bar once or twice a year though.....

 

+1 on SpeedShine and SprayOn wax. 2 of the must-have's from Griots.

 

Well I do own a PC , I wouldn't polish if I had to do it by hand!

How does Z5 work? Is it a glaze or a chemical cleaner?

 

Z5 is a glaze of sorts... it fills/conceals swirls and other imperfections. It does not contain abrasives or chemical cleaners.

-Heather

 

The only negative with Z5 (or any Zaino wax product) is that you have to pay an additional $17 for ZFX hardener. I guess straight Z5 doesn't dry fast enough in most climates so they tell you to mix a few drops of ZFX with it so it drys much faster.

I personally, I still think it's worth it because of the time it saves. And I'm pretty picky about how our cars look!

 

I am actually hesistant to polish the car as it is brand new. I know it can be made even better with a PC and polishing compound. I just wonder how many times that can go before its ground down past clear coat. I plan on keeping the car until it spontaneously combusts. I wont be driving it every day either as I work from home half the days and the rest I am chilling on trains/subways. I wonder if like every 1 1/2 to 2 years is a good idea. I will be following showcargarage.com 's tips on the matter, of washing and maintenance. I shouldnt be introducing swirls, and I will be waxing 5x a year or more in the nicer weather.

 

I'm certain if you used a PC on your paint every day, your clear coat will be intact even 20 years from now. Think of it this way. Have you ever seen black vinyl stripes with swirls? They are pretty thin material, yet a PC can polish out those swirls. My point is that swirls don't have to cut deep into the paint to be visible.

By using a PC, you distribute even pressure over your paint when polishing and waxing and removing wax, unlike your finger tips on a sponge pad or towel with 5 different pressure points. Don't do any maintenance or apply wax and in short time your clear coat will have holes in it from neglect. So its evident that if you don't touch your car, neglect will kill your clear coat, all the while your paint will look ugly. I'd much rather take proper care of the paint using the least aggressive means, provide proper protection, and have a super looking car.

Besides, even with proper wash maintenance, if you take your car outside of your garage, swirls will get introduced to the finish. Just having the dust settle while your car is outside, and you drive it, or wipe it off, anything that has the potential to move that dust against your paint will eventually cause swirls and scratches to appear. But you can slow that process by keeping the paint protected, clean from above bonded surface contaminant, and free of contaminants like pollen, insect and animal feces.

Richard

 

do you have horses taking a dump on your car? i say bird crap
but you say "animal feces" which seem gigantic.

i agree, the surface must be clean under the dust and feces for all
the waxes and protectants to work fully.