Just put em in an envelope, rather than the swag bag. And offer the pick em up at the door option for those that are sure to lose em otherwise. Those lines really are not necessary.

 

As a true Canadian stereotype.. I am on the fence on this one. Both sides make good points.. but it sounds like it is a bit of a Catch22 situation.

You need vendors to get the prizes for the give-a-ways, but the vendors do add a lot of commercialism to the event... Having planned some smaller events in the past, I know what it is like to want things from people and not give them much in return (vendors). And having been asked to donate $$ and prizes for events, and not gettin much recognition for the donation, and maybe not getting return business from your $xxx.xx donation.

I bought some stuff(sorry Chad.... I didn't know you sold that thing), and I liked to browse and see what was being sold.

I really didn't have any issues with where the vendor area was, other then due to totally limited space, hard to get around it.

It is unfortunate that the welcome dinner and banquet are limited seating, but that is just the size of Fontana...

and yes when an event grows to that size that fast, there is going to be some growing pains.

They are extending it an extra day, will I be able to attend all 4 days next year.. probably not... will I still go... damn straight (as straight as I can be anyways )
It was pretty crammed together this year, events wise anyways. Didn't really feel that I had time to just take off and do a drive like we did last year. I would have liked to, but again, wanted to get some of the events in for socializing.

I knew a lot of people from last year, which was great, and met many more. Hell, new friend Bob from Chicago and I even helped rescue a HOT biker and his dad that went off the road on the last day and down an 80ft ravine. They were banged up, but I am pretty sure they will live.


I will say this also, the sound in the adventure centre was better... but still had issues hearing... as I told some of the speakers... if your using a microphone, pretend you are... eating a banana, and stop short of eating it.. talking over the mic, the sound is not being received as if you were talking into it...

OR MY SUGGESTION AT DINNER... USE THE BLOODY 2-WAYS... EVERYONE HAS ONE... CHANNEL 7-21, 8-21 ESPANOL, 9-21 FRANCAIS, 10-21 QUEEN'S ENGLISH. There were points where I was just clapping with the crowd, cause I could not here.

 

I know I'm a newbie....but I'd like to volunteer as well.

This was such a great event!!

 

Wow..there are great suggestions here, but I confess I haven't read the entire thread.

This last Dragon was my fifth...I'm one of the original 60.
I don't know quite where to begin with my observations but I'll try to be concise.

It has become a vendor, rather than a social, event as evidenced by the pics in a previous post. That was inevitable with the increasing popularity of MINIs, and I have no beef with any of the vendors or their right to be there. I want to be very clear about that.

Having said that, I do miss the more social aspect of the Dragon.

However, with increasing interest/numbers and a very limited amount of flat space, large (as many as want to attend...400? 500?) groups are extremely difficult to accomodate. Same thing with the vendors..they need flat areas too. The ball field turns into a morass in the wet, and the churning of hundreds of feet and/or thousands of tires will make it worse. It would also destroy that piece of land...which doesn't belong to us. It's the same with the campsite.

The paved areas around Fontana Village are finite. So, do we give that space to vendors or to car/ socializing?

Relying on TVA to give us access to have an event at the base of the dam is not a good idea either. The sheer numbers would make them squirrely. Getting TVA to just mow below the dam is like pulling teeth...ask Barry.

I also read that someone was disappointed that there were no organized drives. Again two factors here...
1. sheer numbers, which makes organized drives on the area roads literally dangerous. 2 years ago, a drive was done on the Cherohala Skyway, which lots of cars attended. The pulloffs up there can safely handle 20 MINIS, max. That's leaving cars lining up on the road...not good.
That brings up capping numbers of attendees...also not good. Someone always gets pissed off.
2. Having said all that, the second factor is organizers. Whomever is running the Dragon, is working their butts off pretty much 24/7 during the event. So if you want to do a drive, make it happen. Do the reasearch and the footwork. Now the we have this thing called the interweb, it's possible. The fact that there were 24 responses to the Dragon Volunteer thread was paltry, to be polite. The organizers can only do so much, folks.
Waaay back in ought three, a drive organization consisted of looking at a map, choosing a route and meeting in a parking lot the next AM to do it. Granted, there were fewer of us, but you get my drift.

I'll shut up now...sorry for the long windedness, but there are so many possiblities and complications. I'll be saying more, I'm sure.

 

-----

turn right from the main entrance and go about .25 mile on Rt. 28. the old registration area is on the right.

 

I don't know if this has been suggested yet, but maybe there can be a bulletin board of some sort so people can communicate with each other. Like if you had an extra dinner ticket and was willing to give it away, or if you wanted to let your friends know which room/cabin you were in.

 

Shame the vendors can't set up on the tennis courts.

 

Both drive ideas are good suggestions. Perhaps the same runs on each different days over the course of the event, this way drivers can pick and choose. I'm seeing it more of a logistical issue than anything else.

WiFi reception was best "poor". Hopefully the FV staff are looking at ways to improve on this. So using some electronic signage spread through the village with a scrolling list of activities perhaps? Just remember there's always an expense and it's the people who attend who will end up paying for it. So the question is, how much is it worth to have this available to everyone?

On a side note, how many cabins had no phone service, (Ours was one of them) and the front desk was little help other than saying call collect from the house phone. Again, nothing overly bad but it's the little things that make a difference over time.

 

Regarding phone service. My Cingular cell phone (but not my Verizon one) could get signal at the parking lot near the top of Fontana Dam (not the actual little shop parking lot, but the overlook just before it.

I made 1-2 trips a day up there to call home/check messages/etc.

 

Relying on FV to keep its word on matters involving the internets has previously proven unwise. I think we need to bite the bullet and add a couple bucks to the cost of each registration to cover paying a few people to be responsible for distributing information. With 800+ registrants, the added cost need not be all that high.

One advantage of hiring folks for the weekend is that it is appropriate to have 'expectations' of them, whereas it is hard to complain when a volunteer decides he has had enough of 'helping' and heads off to enjoy the road.

 

That Cherohala drive was a great one, and it should be done again, with highly restricted numbers, say 20 to a trip. I still remember the "rest stop" where the parking lot was filled with cars from an earlier drive group, and our group pulled off on the shoulder and drivers wandered off behind the nearest tree to...

Here is a thought that might work. Offer a drive, and limit registration to the first 20-25 cars. I'd say just 20, but there will inevitably be some no-shows, so registering 25 might result in 20 cars. Then just plain close the registration.

Now, a whole lot of people are going to be unhappy that they missed the drive. I can see it now: "The drive was posted 20 minutes ago, and now its closed? WTF?"

There are three possible solutions:
1. The person who organizes the drive can offer to do it again. And again. And again. Obviously, this has its limitations, but some volunteers might be willing to do it more than once.
2. A variation on this theme would be for the organizer to recruit some helpers, and let them run the extra drives.
3. Another idea would be for the organizer to simply close the drive, as I suggested, and then make the maps available to whoever else wants to do it. That need not involve a lot more than providing a few Mapquest links in some situations, though obviously more involved drives (like my proposed Dragon Movie run) would require some more work. Anyway, once the run is complete on paper, we can hope that some others will step up and volunteer to stage the same run at different times. I really think the idea of many small runs at many different times can be made to work.

 

Another idea: Way's swap meet was a great idea, and a great service on his part, but it was announced at the last minute. I think it could be a lot bigger next year. Bigger, perhaps, than Way would be willing and able to handle. Perhaps we could make a Mod Swap event? It'll never be as big as the Beer Swap of course (hey, we all have our priorities), but with proper prep it could be quite kewl.

 

Let me touch on some of the things mentioned since my last post last night. Some of this may be repetitive but some people won't read the whole thread anyway.

Whovous:
The lack of drives this year is not due to any of the Volunteers that made MOTD happen. It was due to the lack of Volunteers putting the drives together. Everyone needs to realize that if next year is to be an improvement over this year then other people need to step up and make things happen. To my knowledge no one has ever said "I want to organize this" and been turned down. It sounds like next year we'll have more drives which is great. I just want everyone to be clear why there were less drives this year.

The movie drive you suggested sounds great. Why don't you put that together? I don't say that as a smartass. It's your idea and you'd probably put more attention to it than anyone else.

Hiring professionals doesn't seem like a wise move to me. First off you already have people complaining that this has gotten too far away from the grass roots aspect. Second, who do the professionals turn to for answers and what not? NAM? Then you're just adding a middleman to it. If we can get a committee style thing going then we should be ok.

The whiteboard needs to be heaved in the trash. This is the second year in a row where information was supposed to be put on there and no info ever showed. It clearly isn't a method that is working and we should move on.

The dinner wristbands in bags at registration was tried last year. There was a lot of confusion, people lost their bands, etc....it was a pain. BUT, that said, a new system has been brought up by an organizer which definitely has some potential and she is looking into that. Please don't take the vagueness as secrecy. I just don't want to post the potential ideas for the various issues if they aren't going to end up in place.

There were a few drives this year that were done by clubs including the Cherohala Skyway run. If they had wanted it open to the masses they would have posted about it in NAM. They didn't. They kept it on their boards with the intent of it to be a club run, with some obvious tag alongs who they are friends with. And there's nothing wrong with that. The Ice Cream Run was WELL publicized. All the details were known well in advance. If you couldn't find the start time or place then you should have checked NAM prior to coming to MOTD.

A lot of people come to MOTD with a "I'll make my schedule as I go" attitude. And that's a very cool way of doing it. I wish I could be that relaxed. But the problem is many of you don't bother to at least bring the details that have been posted in advance. Then you show up, don't know what's going on and where and then complain that the information isn't posted at Fontana. Do your homework before you arrive. No one says you have to plan everything out but at least bring the info on all the activities so if you feel like doing it you can look at your stuff and see what the details are.

An info booth is a good idea if we can figure out how to do it. The only way I see it working is if each event creates a flier with all the details and those fliers are posted all together in one spot. Then if you need to know where the Brew Swap is you can go to that one spot, see the flier and get the information.

Back to the drives again, I know I'm jumping around but these are my notes...Yes they need to be in small groups. That's how this was done last year. Agranger's run last year went in 3 groups of 30 MINIs. The run to Dillsboro was around 32 MINIs. Yes even that number can be a problem on roads like the Skyway and Dragon but when you are heading to a destination town or what not with no planned turn offs, a larger group is fine. So, scenic runs, yes keep them small, say no more than 25. Runs to towns or landmarks with no planned side stops can be larger.

Xiek:
We're working on doing no-limit dinners. So if that can be pulled off no one will miss out next year on a dinner.

Everyone:

People talk about the lack of socializing this year. What stopped you? Not having a place to park 50 MINIs at once? Come on now, you have cabins, there's the lodge, there's drives...the lack of socializing was mainly due to people not coming together on their own. We're all adults here. If you want to mix and mingle then do so. Throw an impromptu party at your cabin and invite passer bys. Take the intiative. I do agree it would have been good fuel for the socializing fire if the main lot and road were open.

I'm going to be adding names to my spreadsheet for anyone who wants to volunteer to help organize or run an event. Or if you want to volunteer for a specific event which you know is happeneing next year you can chime in for that too. Send me a PM with your name and contact info and we'll keep you in the loop as next year's event pulls together.

 

Here is one possible solution to the wristband/food ticket thing. You can use the numbers on them for different food events or activities. You can have them numbered in addition to the tabs and use the numbered tabs for door prizes. You can have them custom made so the tabs say exactly what they are for. That way everything needed is right on the wrist. Don't know how irritating the tabs might be though.

I considered them for Mini Meet East but in the end someone donated wrist bands to us.

http://www.wristbandexpress.com/index.php?cPath=28

 

Great points Matt.... Since I suggested the info. booth, I'd be more than happy to set the whole thing up, provided that Mark is OK with that and can provide a tent/booth.

We had a FREE MOTD mixer for all to show and mingle and not alot of folks show? What's up with that. We're complaining there is not enough mingling and then we have night dedicated to it and very few show up.

Like it's been said before. Stop saying we need more drives and here is how we should do it. Instead say, I'm gonna host a drive and who wants to join me. If you have the desire and not the know how, all you have to do is ask me or Agranger, etc. and we'll get you started

 

There is a effort by NAM in the works to do away with the wristbands and prizes at the earlier dinners, and focus more on the social aspects and feeding all who want to come. Mark had some great ideas for this and I don't think we'll have the dinner wristbands next year. I'll let Mark put up the details as he irons it all out.

 

Those bands are interesting. It appears that the tabs fold over to the same width as the band and a "snap" holds them in place. Not sure how durable they are for a 4-day period - would tabs break off? what if people accidentally tear off two - or the wrong one? There are bound to be some issues with any solution, but not having ever seen/touched these it's hard to say what their faults might be. If nothing else, they are an interesting idea to keep in the mix - depending on whether the other option being investigated pans out.

 

That's a generous offer Barry. I think Katie already gave the best answer: get a map and figure it out!

 

A. I realize every year is going to be different, and that drives require organizers willing to put up with the grief when something inevitably goes wrong. For now, it looks like there will definitely be more drives next year. I will try to do my part and see if I can put the movie drive together from afar. Sometimes, you just gotta drive these things, and I do not know if I can get enough info over the interwebs to obviate that need.

B. I use the term 'professionals' loosely. The idea is to have a centrally staffed info source. I did read up, and sign up, from home before the ice cream run, but I did not bring a lap top with me and neither did I print out the PDF pamphlet everyone got (aside - could these be printed and put in the swag bags again, or is that just too expensive?). My wife asked for directions, and we wound up waiting at the general store. At least four other cars made the exact same mistake.

Now, it was a pretty dumb mistake, and there is plenty we could have done to avoid it, but a reliable central info source could never hurt. That is what I see as the main role of the 'professionals.' Their job would be to be in a known location and provide information.

C. As for getting away from the grassroots aspect, I understand the concern, but let's face it, those grassroots were getting walked on by the time of MOTD3 and were pretty much trampled by MOTD4. This year was much more professional than the prior years and I think it was the best of the three MOTDs I have attended. It is going to get bigger still. I think there is plenty of room for both grassroots and some professional organization in the same event. It is not an either-or matter.

D. As for the wristbands, DO NOT put em in the swag bag. Use a separate and clearly marked envelope, with the buyers name and the warning "Lose this and you starve!" printed on the outside. We are all hungry enough by the time we reach the doors, and do not need the extra appetite stimulation the lines provide.

 

Response to Whovous:

A. It's certainly more work and a little stress but you can definitely do it without going to the area. Just might require some calls to people or asking local MINI folks to run it as a test drive. I organized the Brew Swap last year without ever having been to Fontana. Stressed me out but I couldn't be happier that I did it. This year was much less stressful.

B. Thing is none of us want to give up our vacation to be an info person all day every day. And finding enough volunteers to man a booth may prove difficult. That said, I'll put my money where my mouth is and say that Heidi & I will volunteer for at least a 2 hour shift (maybe longer) on one of the days.

C. Totally agree. This year was 10x more enjoyable for Heidi & I than last year. The organization is great. My point was simply that we shouldn't bring in NON-MINI folks to run the event.

D. If the suggested method comes through then this won't even matter.

 

Maybe you could do a pamphlet and have vendors run adspace to pay for it?
Graphic designer here, willing to get in line to provide organized information if needed (signage included).

I'm also one of those who forgot to print and bring the pdf info, so we were in the dark this year
(I suppose I'd be on the "misplaced his wristband" category as well).

edit: Yes a booth could do the same thing, hence my ire with no whiteboard info. Great idea.

 

I'll happily volunteer to (wo)man an info booth or whatever for a few hours. PM sent. It appeals to my inate bossiness and need to teach.

 

As long as we keep getting volunteers to man it I think the info booth can probably be done.

 

In regard to the wrist bands and their use as entry document to certain events there is already something in use that can eliminate them.
The ID cards on the lanyard were really nice and I wouldn't go anywhere without it. The ID card could include a check box that was filled in at the time of its creation showing what events that person was registered for.

There does seem to be a need for an information booth with a person. As has been noted, MOTD has gotten big enough that "word of mouth" does not seem to cut it. And by the way, what a way to meet people at MOTD by helping in the info booth for a few hours. Along the same line, someone suggested elsewhere volunteers wearing t-shirts identifying them as someone who can answer questions or direct you to the proper person who can.

Dinners: It seems to me that having 800+ attendees and only room for 300 at the welcome and farewell events is undesirable. I know that there is possibly good reason that all these events are held at Fontana but the village is obviously not capable of handling everything. I am not saying cut them out but maybe the city of Robbinsville could stand a cut of the pie.

There might be a facility in Robbinsville that could accommadate a larger gathering. On the subject of food for example, there is a BBQ place in Robbinsville called something like Brushy Mountain BBQ that serves an unbelievable plate of ribs for $10. I am currently wearing my armored shorts while making this suggestion as some of the flame jobs lately have been amazing.

I also felt that the welcome dinner could stand a head table so that the people who spend so much time organizing this event would be a little more visible. Those of you who have been there more than once know who they are but the new people don't. Fame is fleeting and should be milked to the max.

Another thought concerns trying to ID certain cars that we might be interested in looking at. Some of the cars this years had numbers displayed as per autox. Would it be possible for each registered MINI to be assigned a number so that the caretaker of that MINI could post on the car if they desired. That way I could tell which CR I wanted to talk too. I wouldn't care if my name was on a list which people could check but some might.

No smillies were injured in this post but my pride has been humbled after looking at some of my spelling.

 

I agree the talks at the farewell dinner were looooonnnnngggg. I felt like they were trying to sell me a car......I already have a MINI. The "tech talk" type venue would have been better for that one.

The scavenger hunt idea was not good. We ended up with four raffle tickets at the farewell dinner by pure accident. No one else at our whole table could participate in the prizes. It was a little uncomfortable sitting there checking numbers all by ourselves.

I haven't heard any negative talk about the group photo. We arrived late and got there just in time to get in line. We couldn't even park together....my husband and I got split up. That didn't kill us, but when I went to leave, I parked my car off the edge of the road so I could drop off my order form and someone started screaming as I walked up to the crane truck where the photographer was. I immediately threw my order form at the guy with the order table and ran back to my car. There was a very VERY nervous and rude cop standing there demanding my license. He also wanted my registration and got very irrate when I told him I wasn't carrying it because it's not required in Texas. He got even more belligerent and rude and then proceeded to give me a $100 ticket for having one wheel in the roadway. I tried to explain to him that we arrived late and missed all the information about leaving that side of the road clear. We never heard a peep out of the photographer about it all the time we were having the photo taken and he never mentioned anything about it as we were leaving. I told the cop that they really needed to post signs if they didn't want anyone on that side of the road.....I mean, come on! Of all the revenue that little community receives out of MOTD, you'd think they'd have a tiny bit more compassion for stuff like that. The photographer was a real dunce, too. He wouldn't even confirm that he had found my order form after I moved my car and went back. I'm assuming he did find it and that no one has stolen my identity in addition to the stupid ticket I got from "rent a cop".

As for the tri-level vendor area. My husband has bad knees and I have arthritis in my spine and hips. Walking from the Lodge all the way down to the Laundry and Country Store and back up almost did the both of us in. We started driving down after that first day. Parking was bad, but not as bad as our aches and pains.

Okay, I'm done. We WILL come back, and thanks to all the hard working vendors and volunteers. Next year will be our third Dragon and we plan to drive the Dragon MORE instead of walking around the Village.