I think my hood scoop is melting...
3rd Gear
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 294
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From: ChasMO
tkwasny--thanks for your support. A couple of points:
You mention that there were changes from 2007 to 2008. Are you referring to the "opening" of the scoop grill? If that's the case, they actually did that in mid-07. Unfortunately it didn't make a difference. And I have 2 friends with '08s, and both have had exactly the same degree of deformation that I have, and that has been shown in the photos of this thread. (Their scoops have been replaced, but I don't know how the new ones are faring.)
My second point is that we can't count on BMW/MINI continuing to support us after the warranty runs out, even though we may report it. A case in point: We also have a 2001 530i. Something went wrong on it--I can't remember what, but it was about $250 to repair. We were very close to the end of the line with our warranty, so I called our service writer and told her about it when I made the appointment, figuring that I would preserve our rights. Didn't work that way. I was told that our car had to be in their driveway BEFORE the warranty ran out, or they wouldn't pay for it. And it was--all of TWENTY (20) miles before the cut-off.
Given the scope of this problem, we might not have that hard-line handling, but I'm not counting on it. I plan to replace it now, at Zippeee!'s next oil change--this week or next--and hope that will give me a chance to make sure the next one doesn't go bad before I'm out of luck.
BTW, does anyone know this--if the scoop is replaced, is the "grill" replaced also? Mine has the totally closed type.
You mention that there were changes from 2007 to 2008. Are you referring to the "opening" of the scoop grill? If that's the case, they actually did that in mid-07. Unfortunately it didn't make a difference. And I have 2 friends with '08s, and both have had exactly the same degree of deformation that I have, and that has been shown in the photos of this thread. (Their scoops have been replaced, but I don't know how the new ones are faring.)
My second point is that we can't count on BMW/MINI continuing to support us after the warranty runs out, even though we may report it. A case in point: We also have a 2001 530i. Something went wrong on it--I can't remember what, but it was about $250 to repair. We were very close to the end of the line with our warranty, so I called our service writer and told her about it when I made the appointment, figuring that I would preserve our rights. Didn't work that way. I was told that our car had to be in their driveway BEFORE the warranty ran out, or they wouldn't pay for it. And it was--all of TWENTY (20) miles before the cut-off.
Given the scope of this problem, we might not have that hard-line handling, but I'm not counting on it. I plan to replace it now, at Zippeee!'s next oil change--this week or next--and hope that will give me a chance to make sure the next one doesn't go bad before I'm out of luck.
BTW, does anyone know this--if the scoop is replaced, is the "grill" replaced also? Mine has the totally closed type.
6th Gear
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 4,743
Likes: 5
From: Hot Springs Village, AR
The grill is NOT replaced. Had mine replaced yesterday & it was the same grill which surprised me. I asked the dealer if the new scoop would fare better than the old one & he said yes, the new scoops are made of a different plastic. So time will tell. I for one will go back for a new scoop if needed.
Time will tell. I'm not particularly concerned now.
6th Gear
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 3,446
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From: L.A ca
Randy
M7 Tuning
6th Gear
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 4,743
Likes: 5
From: Hot Springs Village, AR
I've heard days to months, but I don't think it's necessarily a regional (temperature) thing--from what I've read over the past couple of years, time might relate to the heaviness of the foot. I'm in a hot part of Texas, and it was 2 or 3 months, as I recall.
And your dealer might be lazy, especially if cars are at a premium. That certainly was the case when gas prices were higher.
n733lk--have you seen anything yet?
And your dealer might be lazy, especially if cars are at a premium. That certainly was the case when gas prices were higher.
n733lk--have you seen anything yet?
5th Gear
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 609
Likes: 0
From: Houston, Texas
I've been keeping up on all these various threads and nobody seems to have a DEFINITIVE answer to this problem. Last night, I drilled out the stock grill, AND bent down the sheet metal beneath the scoop, effectively more than doubling the available air flow in and out of the scoop. Hopefully, this will help.
Wrap v. M7 Shield??????? After a recent thread re the Shield, I'd be concerned about the diverted heat melting the top of my engine cover.
Wrap v. M7 Shield??????? After a recent thread re the Shield, I'd be concerned about the diverted heat melting the top of my engine cover.
4th Gear
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 493
Likes: 0
From: San Diego, CA
Well, as for my new scoop, it hasn't changed at all since it was installed. Don't know if that's because of the cooler weather, or what. One thing I have noticed is my new scoop stands above the level of the metal bonnet. The old one didn't, which suggests there might be a manufacturing variation there.
Personally, I still think the warping is caused by a combination of engine heat, solar heating during hot days, and deformation stress caused by how the scoop is mounted. The issue certainly has become rather quiet through the winter months, which would support my theory; take one of these factors away and there's no warping.
Personally, I still think the warping is caused by a combination of engine heat, solar heating during hot days, and deformation stress caused by how the scoop is mounted. The issue certainly has become rather quiet through the winter months, which would support my theory; take one of these factors away and there's no warping.
6th Gear
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 4,743
Likes: 5
From: Hot Springs Village, AR
Don't forget lead foot. When this first came up, I got the impression that this was a factor, too, not just the amount of time the car is run.
5th Gear
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 625
Likes: 6
From: Phoenix Az
for what its worth.. Here is my update.. on both of our Turbo models.
Day one of ownership.. R56 removed honeycomb insert. 1.6 years 22k miles, liviing in the HOT arizona sun.. No warping
R55 dremmeled out remaining honeycomb insert holes on day one of ownership.. 1 yr old this week..18k miles.... no warping..
Day one of ownership.. R56 removed honeycomb insert. 1.6 years 22k miles, liviing in the HOT arizona sun.. No warping
R55 dremmeled out remaining honeycomb insert holes on day one of ownership.. 1 yr old this week..18k miles.... no warping..
4th Gear
Joined: May 2008
Posts: 493
Likes: 0
From: San Diego, CA
Just out of curiosity, how how did you remove the R56 honeycomb insert?
I would think that unless you're drag racing down the same street you're parking the car on, there will be enough time spent at low power/low speed operation to let the turbo cool off before you park it. You've got a lot of air flowing past the turbo on both hot and cold sides, so it's going to change it's temperature based on how hard it's working pretty fast. Based on old Lycoming aircraft operating instructions, turbos need about 30 seconds of idle operations to normalize at their idle temperatures after high power operations. And those were aircooled turbos without the forced liquid cooling that the Mini turbo has.
I would think that unless you're drag racing down the same street you're parking the car on, there will be enough time spent at low power/low speed operation to let the turbo cool off before you park it. You've got a lot of air flowing past the turbo on both hot and cold sides, so it's going to change it's temperature based on how hard it's working pretty fast. Based on old Lycoming aircraft operating instructions, turbos need about 30 seconds of idle operations to normalize at their idle temperatures after high power operations. And those were aircooled turbos without the forced liquid cooling that the Mini turbo has.
Last edited by Ken G.; Apr 25, 2009 at 01:59 PM.
5th Gear
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 635
Likes: 2
From: Danville
Just out of curiosity, how how did you remove the R56 honeycomb insert?
I would think that unless you're drag racing down the same street you're parking the car on, there will be enough time spent at low power/low speed operation to let the turbo cool off before you park it. You've got a lot of air flowing past the turbo on both hot and cold sides, so it's going to change it's temperature based on how hard it's working pretty fast. Based on old Lycoming aircraft operating instructions, turbos need about 30 seconds of idle operations to normalize at their idle temperatures after high power operations. And those were aircooled turbos without the forced liquid cooling that the Mini turbo has.
I would think that unless you're drag racing down the same street you're parking the car on, there will be enough time spent at low power/low speed operation to let the turbo cool off before you park it. You've got a lot of air flowing past the turbo on both hot and cold sides, so it's going to change it's temperature based on how hard it's working pretty fast. Based on old Lycoming aircraft operating instructions, turbos need about 30 seconds of idle operations to normalize at their idle temperatures after high power operations. And those were aircooled turbos without the forced liquid cooling that the Mini turbo has.
once you remove the scoop from the hood, it's just held on by 4 screws.
I just had my hood scoop replaced as well and I never shutdown right after driving it hard. I always let the car idle for about a minute before shutting down and it still warped. Once I got the replacement I removed the grill completely. We'll see if that prevents the warping or not.
6th Gear
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 4,743
Likes: 5
From: Hot Springs Village, AR
I just had my hood scoop replaced as well and I never shutdown right after driving it hard. I always let the car idle for about a minute before shutting down and it still warped. Once I got the replacement I removed the grill completely. We'll see if that prevents the warping or not.
At the end of that highway, I have another 3/4 mile of slow subdivision driving leading to my house, posted at 25 mph. I shut my car down in the driveway, with no additional idling. The fan doesn't continue on. And the scoop melted. This is on a week-3 2007 build, with a completely closed honeycomb.
When I got the new scoop, my SA thought it would be open, but it wasn't. He went ahead and gave me the honeycomb and the screws. It's now totally open, and I haven't seen any warping. We're now heading into the hottest months, though, so we'll see what happens this summer.
2nd Gear
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 141
Likes: 0
From: South Carolina
My 09' with 10Kmiles has a slight depression/warping in the center of the hood scoop. If you look across the surface, there are stress cracks in the paint.
I plan to call the dealership this AM for an unrelated issue (AC is not working!) and am going to ask about replacement. Also, I want to do some prevention measures and don't want any warranty BS. Summit Racing sells sheets of adhesive thermal pads that I would like to put on the hood above the turbo and I want the "ok" before i do it.
I plan to call the dealership this AM for an unrelated issue (AC is not working!) and am going to ask about replacement. Also, I want to do some prevention measures and don't want any warranty BS. Summit Racing sells sheets of adhesive thermal pads that I would like to put on the hood above the turbo and I want the "ok" before i do it.
6th Gear
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 4,743
Likes: 5
From: Hot Springs Village, AR
Is yours open or closed? This is the way it starts, and may not progress--haven't heard about stress cracks, though. I'd absolutely get a new one under warranty. Unfortunately it's not a one stop operation--has to be painted first. My dealer had to see it first, THEN order & paint. Good thing I'm only 20 minutes away.
5th Gear
Joined: Jun 2003
Posts: 625
Likes: 6
From: Phoenix Az
The heat issue is not so much while driving, as it letting the heat out after you stop.. If you want to test the theroy, before you remove or dremel out the vent, drive for a while, turn off, feel how much heat is escaping.. then remove, and try agian... when heat RISES off the turbo it has to go some where..while the car is moving, there is some circulation under the hood. But when stopped and shut off, the heat just rises.. has to get out some way... or dissipate over time..the turbo gets hotter for a few minutes after shut off before cooling down.. wanna see some thing cool, at night, run the car hard, then in a dark area, stop, turn off, open the hood and look at the turbo glow a reaaaaal bright orange... see how long it lasts..
4th Gear
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 492
Likes: 0
From: Renton, WA
My scoop has that "dip" in the middle, so I thought it was sagging due to the heat, but after I popped out the scoop, the part that dips is actually where the anchor is. So it made no sense to me that the middle would sag; it should be the area where there's no support under that sags. So based on my observation, the heat is causing some sort of expansion and it is, in reality, making the scoop "buckle" and pushes upward. But since the middle has the anchor that holds it down, it would make it appear that the middle is sagging.
6th Gear
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 4,743
Likes: 5
From: Hot Springs Village, AR
Interesting. If that's the cause for the sag appearance, I would think that would be easy to fix. Wonder why it hasn't happened.
Then again, what about all those temperature readouts that were posted early on? (And what about my ability to cook bratwurst on the turbo?)
Then again, what about all those temperature readouts that were posted early on? (And what about my ability to cook bratwurst on the turbo?)
2nd Gear
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 141
Likes: 0
From: South Carolina
mine's a dip too. AND the mount for the top anchor is quite malformed from the heat. It's not so much the dip that bothers me, as the spiderweb of heat stressed paint. As of now it's not peeling or fully cracked through, but it will get there.
Once it's replaced, i'm ditchin' the grille immediately
Once it's replaced, i'm ditchin' the grille immediately
2nd Gear
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 141
Likes: 0
From: South Carolina
I don't know if it's confirmed, but it releases alot of heat. I ordered a new one in the supposedly thicker plastic. I told the service guy I wanted to run it without a grille and he said no problem.
6th Gear
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 4,743
Likes: 5
From: Hot Springs Village, AR
Huh? Aren't you getting a free replacement under warranty? Why do you have to do the ordering?
4th Gear
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 388
Likes: 0
From: Atlanta GA
I just felt mine today as the temps are starting to go up. I can't see anything yet but when I run my hand accross the top gap with the hood I can feel a slight gap I have a little under 2000 miles. How do you get the thing out to cut out the extra holes?
5th Gear
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 609
Likes: 0
From: Houston, Texas
There is one screw beneath the scoop, in the center of the bonnett. This secures the scoop to the hood. Once this is removed, the scoop will "pop" out; there are a number of connectors, but they simply pop out with a little pressure. Once the scoop is removed, there are just 4 little screws attaching the grill to the scoop. It will be obvious at this point.
Good luck!
Good luck!