Schnool - is Bear Creek right outside Wilkes Barre, on 115? If so, we are competing against each other. Hahaha. I too am trying to sell my wife's 2008 MINI S convertible because the stealerships won't give me close to what it's worth. She doesn't want to give up her little convertible but based on BMW's current ad campaign I can put her in a topless 2012 128i lease for less than what we're paying on her current MINI.

If only I could find a dealership coming within $1500 of what I find the car is worth at 4, now five, different websites. I'm doing the Craigslist thing too but all I'm getting are scam artists offering to pay my asking price by putting the money in Paypal or sending an "agent" to handle the transaction.

And like Buddy Lee said, if KBB, Edmunds, Black Book, Clearbook and NADA are all over estimates, why then are the dealerships listing these cars for even more than the suggested retail value?

 

I'm trading in my 2009 MCS to the dealer that I bought it from for a 2012 JCS Coupe. The car is perfect and has about 26,300 miles on it. All maintenance and any warranty work was done at the dealership.

The dealer says they will give me $20,500 for the car.

The NADA book says it is worth $22,275 as a trade.
The Kelly Blue Book says it is worth $20,500 as a trade.

The website just mentioned, Clearbook, asks a lot more about all of the options. In fact far more than both NADA and Kelly.

Clearbook says the car is worth $20,310 as a trade.

I thought that the dealer was giving me a decent price for the car and based on this data I have to believe that the price is in fact a fair price. The dealer will put it on the lot and ask from $24,500 to $26,500 for the car. And they will probably get it. It has all of the desirable options except for Nav. (Nav is debatable if it is desirable in my book.)

Anyway, once the time comes I may try and squeeze another $500 or $1000 from the dealer. The car is parked now and not accumulating any more mileage. (Plus I want to eliminate any chance of injury to Fulburt.)

I'm still taking a bath on the deal cause I paid a heck of lot more than that when I bought the car. But I just have to have the JCS Coupe.

Regards,

Pat

 

Gluh, yes Bear Creek is above WB.
PatM.. I am glad you found someone who will give you KBB... Wanna share?

For the record, I have a flawless CARFAX on my car as well, Now I have not taken to the stealership for oil changes, or the PS pump.. I did those myself. But then.. I kept immaculate records of those things as well. Plus I have had the stealership look at the car 2 times as well, to help me diagnose it (run flats, and thermo gasket)... Then I did the work.

My take if you are within $1500 of KBB that is pretty close.

My biggest bother in this, is I have even tried negotiating with used car for used car (to get something bigger mostly at that point). That should afford more headroom for sure? not so much.

The heck with it... I'll pay off the car, and run it into the ground...

I just don't remember some of the sleazy tactics these guys are using...
Example... Hyundai dealer was whiting out Window sticker totals and "pinstriping" and the like and marking up the cars $2000! Wife was beside herself... saying the prices for the NEW cars were listed online between $1500 and $2000 less than the stickers on the cars (and online they showed the window stickers unaltered!).

REALLY? This is what the industry has for us?

We ought to ditch stealerships, and order our cars online, and have them shipped to our door. See how well these dealers hold up to that.

 

With ya on that. I just got my Mini July 27th, its a 2009 MCS, 33000 miles, I paid $24,000 (of course, I have a loan & a cary payment). I wondered if I should have gotten a convertible. So yesterday I am browsing dealers, and this dealer has a Mini convertible and a link that says "compute your trade-in value" -- so I thought, why not?

After answering all the questions and listing all the options, it came back with a trade-in on my Mini of $16,000 -- $8,000 less than I paid for it a month ago. That's insane!

 

We all need to remember that the dealer is going to make money on your trade. They are going to spend time and Money to sell your car. If you're going to a Mini dealer to trade in a Mini, odds are the dealer is going to have a newer, more expensive, and higher profit margin model on the lot already. They simply don't want to deal with it. If you're will to trade in the car for lower than the "trade-in" value, they the dealer's profit comes back up. Just a simple game really.

You could always pay off your current loan, get the title, sell your own car, buy a rental, take a month to buy a new one, Or you can spare yourself 40 hours of work and hassle to loss a few grand on the trade.

If you happy with your Mini, you should be worried about trading it in anyway!

 

Fact is your buying a depreciating asset. if you want to make money you need to buy gold. Used to be able to say stocks but not in the last couple of months.

The reality is that as you drive that car off the lot you can kiss minimum of 5K goodbye. It's just the way it is. Most people that trade any car in after a short period of ownership or don't put a lot of money down are just going to take a bath. Most people don't trade in a slightly used car cause it costs a lot of money to do so. Especially if you have financed the car for 5 or 6 years. It's hard to do.

Anyway my point is that the dealers are going to make money and they hold all the cards. Your the one who has the need not necessarily the dealer.

It doesn't seem fair sometimes but it's the way it is.

 

You guys aren't listening.

I think the dealers have upped their margins considerable over the last 3 years... AND/OR the economy is SOOO bad that they cannot make enough money on new cars.

I NEVER said I mean to make a profit. I never said it was an investment. I do love the car... but I just got married and between the wife and I (brady bunch), we have 2 kids now... It is no longer just ME and the kid! A little space would be nice..

Also, did you hear me, I tried trading for a USED car, that had a huge margin on it already. I also tried trading to the dealer I purchased from... EVERY one of these dealers were almost $3000 less than KBB FAIR condition trade in value for my car.

I am OK with a loss... even expect it.. but when I go to a dealer and manage to calculate at least a $5000 profit on the deal, I am sorry that should seal the deal.

 

I think I understand your dilemma but your facing market forces that are not in your favor.

The Mini Dealer I am dealing with is Northwest Mini In Tacoma, Wa. Have you shopped your car at several Mini dealerships. Did you price it at ClearBook? I would be interesting to see what that says. It has very detailed accessory listings.

It's been generally known that new car profits to dealers are not as lucrative as used cars. I think that has been true for many years. (Certainly for the domestic brands, I'm not certain of the foreign brands.)

Maybe a JCW car to a dealer is not as valuable as the more stock models. I would venture to guess that dealers and maybe this one in particular just don't have a good track record of buying and selling used JCW cars. That could be for a myriad of reasons. They are driven harder, many are tracked cars, the miles are typically harder miles than the average car, there could be many, many reasons.

I may face the same thing with the JCW Coupe I am buying. I hope not just because I think it's going to be more of a cult car and will hold more value, but that is a gamble I am willing to take and can afford to take. Cars are fickle and you never ever know how your going to come out. Maybe the dealer I am dealing with is giving me more for my car cause i have already bought 2 and now I am buying a third that is very expensive. I don't know but I think you always have to be prepared for the worse.

It's a supply and demand business. I don't blame the dealer for making as much as he can. I do that in my own business. I maximize my profit in every way I can and for as much money as I can. You can't blame anyone for that.

Sorry for being long winded. I feel for you friend and hope that you find a solution that works for you and your family.

Pat

 

No you guys are all wrong.

^ This is the reason.

 

You have a very good point. It's one of the reasons I always buy red cars. One I like the color but the second reason is that red has proven to have a higher resale value than other colored cars.

A dealer is certainly going to take that into account.. If he can sell a red or a blue car weeks faster than he can a yellow car well that naturally is going to command a higher price point in his mind. I would do the same thing.