--I was perusing the Car and Driver web site and I noticed a new ad MINI had just put out. It lets you race your MINI vs. a bunch of mean machines in a 700ft slalom race. Here's a list of the machines it goes against

Acuras RSX - Type S
Lamborghini Murcielago
Subaru WRX
Volkswagen GTI
Dodge Viper SRT10
Porsche 911 GT3

You'll be really surprised at the results of not just the Cooper S but the other cars as well. Here's the link enjoy:

http://www.miniusa.com/crm/700_ft_slalom.jsp

 

Narrow understeering cars have a very decided advantage in the slalom and lanechange exercises. For example the Honda Fit Sport tested by Car and Driver went through their lane change faster than a Corvette Z06, and that was on 195/55-15 all-season tires.

 

Now that was very unexpected. I never would have guessed.

Thanks for posting. I will now go show everyone I know.

 

i want to see one done vs a CivicSI coupe.

 

Awesome

 

If you want to see the REAL times for the 700' slalom, go look them up at the R&T website which actually runs the cars.

The record holder in 2004 was the Enzo at about 73 mph. In 2005, the Boxster S beat it at 73.9. In 2006, the Cayman S has the record over 74.1 MPH.

The actual 2006 JCW MINI time was 66.2 MPH
Ken .... Civic SI was 66.8

See http://www.roadandtrack.com/assets/d...data_panel.pdf

No excuses about tires. Run what you brung because any of the cars could also switch to stickier tires too.

 

I would love to see actual results for the MCS with Koni FSD shocks. TireRack did a test that compares the MCS with stock shocks vs. FSDs and, based on that test, I would expect to see an improvement; the question is how much of an improvement would there be.

 

FSD's are a street shock. Koni sport's are more suited for performance driving because you can adjust them to your particular car setup. Ask any auto crosser and they will tell you the same thing.

 

That wasn't my point. Since the Cayman took the title in 2006 with almost an 8 second advantage over the posted number for the JCW MINI, I was wondering about the improvement that the FSDs would provide, based on the better control (while still improving on the ride comfort) over the stock shocks. If the FSDs could cut the Cayman's advantage to 4 (or 2, or better yet, erase it) seconds, that would seem to be a compelling value proposition for the FSDs (especially since they are not available for the Cayman at present)....

 

Would that not be comparing apples and oranges? PASM is still new technology. Its only a matter of time before PASM approved aftermaket suspension bits will also be available for the Cayman/Boxster platform pulling it farther away. I suspect the Caymen bested the 05 boxster speed based on being PASM equipped.

 

It probably did (best the Boxster) based on being PASM-equipped. Porsche Active Suspension Management sounds an awful lot like the Magnetic Selective Ride Control technology that GM has implemented on the 2003 and 2004 C5, the C6 and the Cadillac XLR. The reason why I am curious about how much of a gap there is between a MCS with FSDs and the Cayman is because in my experience (my 2003 Corvette has the MSRC option), the FSDs are close (~60% - 70%) to the MSRC capability on the Corvette (not as hard as the MSRC Sport setting and not as soft as the MSRC Touring setting; but right in the middle of the curve). If adding FSDs to the MINI gave it the ability to erase the performance gap that the PASM provided, then as I mentioned in my original post, that would seem to be a compelling justification for the FSDs.

If PASM is a licensed form of MSRC, I doubt you will see it available as an aftermarket option any time soon. The cost of entry is too high (parts cost alone is north of $10,000 between the ride control units (they aren't called shocks) at the corners and the control computer); then you have the development work on the vehicle control software that runs the computer....

 

You have a good point. If it made a big difference, it would be a good addition to a MINI.

I have no idea who actually makes PASM. I suspect it is Porsche developed just like their PCCB brakes. From what I understand, it is always on, making real-time adjustments to all four wheels at the same time. If you flick the switch, it lowers the car for a harder ride. However, the Cayman is so good OEM that many ppl buy the PASM just to get the softer ride while "off" with 19" wheels. PASM "off" is a much softer ride than stock (for highway cruising). Walter Roehl (sp), the factory driver says that no PASM and stock 18" is best for most ppl and you really only get advantage on the track (4 secs quicker at the RING when PASM equipped). That makes it hard to justify a $2K option for most ppl.

I do know they some companies are working on making PASM compatable shocks but I expect big money. They do call it shocks so maybe its not the same system?

You got a good point about the Konis. Unfortuanately its hard to ever get comparisons like that.

 

Cool site.. thanks Amazing little car..

 

That is one of the reasons why PASM sounds awfully similar to GM's MSRC - it is always on, it uses rheological fluid in the corner units, there are two settings (Tour or whatever for comfort setting and Sport or whatever for the track setting) and you can change the settings at will while the car is moving.

Inevitably the really useful data is never published. My seat of the pants experiential testing tends to conclude that the MCS with FSDs is certainly better than the 66 second test result. How much better is the real question....

 

I will second the post; and in particular about the car. The more I explore options to modify it, the more fun I have.

 

for those who ask about the new SI honda civic, I can say that although it pulls fairly fast when you want it to, it sways and swooshes more than the mini regular cooper by far.

mini rules all

 

My neighbor has a yellow '06 Lamborghini Murcielago! My '06 MCS is on order, expected to arrive this coming week...

I fully expect the live Mini versus Lambo showdown is just a matter of time!

 

lol! this will be a funny event. I totally bet you winning unless theres a 1/4+ mile of pure straight run during the race where he can use no talent and just gas peddle.

 

68.6-mph for 2004 Lambo vs 66.2 mph for 2006 JCW per R&T.

I dont think so.

 

I still think and would bet that mini would win.

the mini gives confidence at high speeds turning, you feel and know it can do it. the lamborgini feels larger, difficult to see out of, out of touch with the environment. it is very easy to race an owner of an exotic car for many reasons not even listed.

 

hmm, I guess MINI marketing has done its job well

 

Absent confirmed driving skills (driving courses followed by objective track times), nothing should be taken for granted. Thinking the MINI is naturally superior is asking for trouble. (If you believe that the MINI is naturally superior, you have swallowed the Kool-Aid that the MINI marketing folks have been pushing....) I personaly believe the MINI is a car with a lot of performance potential (and I am having fun tweaking it), but am under no misperceptions about the role that the operator plays in getting the most out of it.

 

I want a Murcielago.

 

--I also really think that all things being stock it really depends on the driver. I mean someone who is intimate with driving Ferraris and Lambo's might not quite know how to squeeze every inch of speed out of a sport compact car and vice versa. No doubt that the mushy civilian biased type of test drivers for MT are no match for Road and Track and Car and Driver testers but... everyone has their specialty.

When I raced in the last Superlap series race in Honolulu my buddy DKMini coached me and on one of the laps he caught up with and kept pace with my other buddy in a 300hp STI. That was fun! Especially since he was driving my MCSa which was bone stock at that time. But then I got back in the saddle and I was behind my STI friend by 5 seconds.

But yes the MINI is an awesome platform to tune and develop on, but don't get delusions of grandeur and take on Vipers at stoplights. Our cars take a bit of tuning before they can stomp over supercars. They can get there, but then it's the driver skill that takes it up a notch even further.

I just thought the ad was fun and the numbers were surprising because those were a lot of the cars that I considered instead of the MINI.

I WOULD like to see a real life MINI vs. Lambo slalom comparo tho. That would be fun. Just keep it on the track kids!

~pyratio

 

You need to drink more of your Kool-Aid. Otherwise you will never believe the following:

Minis are more reliable than Hondas.

A Mini will out-accelerate an STI.

A Mini will outhandle a Ferrari.

Minis do not depreciate. In fact they appreciate more rapidly than an 5 year CD.

BMWs are known for their excellent customer service.

A cherry R53 with the JCW package will be worth $500K at the 2025 Barrett-Jackson Car Auction in Tempe.