2nd Gen Countryman (F60) Talk (2016-2024) Second Generation Countryman discussion. F60

F60 Flat-Tow a Countryman S?

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Old Dec 15, 2023 | 09:27 AM
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Flat-Tow a Countryman S?

Everywhere I look I read where you cannot tow a Mini Cooper Countryman S, All4, Manual transmission, AWD, 4-down. I understand the corporate line at Mini/BMW is that you cannot tow ANY Mini 4-down, which is the legal department talking, not the mechanical or engineering department.

Given that many other AWD manual transmission cars CAN be towed 4-down, I have to ask - WHY? What is so different about the Mini transfer case that it cannot be towed 4-down with the tranny in neutral?

Inquiring minds want to know.
 
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Old Dec 15, 2023 | 11:45 AM
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The transmission can get hot on the front and nothing to cool it down, like the engine running and cooling the engine. Risk of something going wrong?

Some people blueox and tow MINIs but I would not do it. I would get a small trailer and tow it, all four off the ground. Most people I know that tow items for a living would not tow a drive wheel that touches the ground.

Also people will spend 100K on a trunk and RV but will not spend the money on a proper trailer?

I guess in an emergency or something is world be ok for short distances. I just worry that a dealer might deny drivetrain warranty if they can prove a vehicle has been towed like that long distances.
 
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Old Dec 15, 2023 | 02:21 PM
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I appreciate your response. My comments are below...

Originally Posted by ECSTuning
The transmission can get hot on the front and nothing to cool it down, like the engine running and cooling the engine. Risk of something going wrong?

What would cause the transmission to get hot if it's just free-wheeling in neutral? If this indeed happens, if the engine was idling, would that keep the tranny cool?

Some people blueox and tow MINIs but I would not do it. I would get a small trailer and tow it, all four off the ground. Most people I know that tow items for a living would not tow a drive wheel that touches the ground.

Thousands of people tow vehicles behind motor homes with all the wheels on the ground. I did it for 11 years and over 100,000 miles with a Jeep Grand Cherokee. It is by far the most common way to tow a vehicle behind an RV.

Also people will spend 100K on a trunk and RV but will not spend the money on a proper trailer?

It has nothing to do with cost. It has everything to do with the "hassle factor" of using a trailer.
  • Finding a place to put it, both at home and on the road.
  • Tying down the car when you go somewhere.
  • Untying the car when you want to unload it.

I guess in an emergency or something is world be ok for short distances. I just worry that a dealer might deny drivetrain warranty if they can prove a vehicle has been towed like that long distances.

This is a 2017 Mini with 60,000 miles, and is long out of warranty. That's not a concern for me.
 
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Old Dec 21, 2023 | 02:34 PM
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I'm just wondering if anyone else has any additional information here?
 
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Old Jan 28, 2024 | 10:46 AM
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Further research on this question reveals that the Mini "All4" AWD system is the simplest of all the various AWD system designs.

The heart of the All4 system is GKN Driveline’s Electro Magnetic Control Device. This is an electromagnetic clutch hung on the rear differential. This clutch is used to control the amount of power sent to the rear wheels. At highway speeds (75+ mph) it is fully de-powered and disengaged, making an All4 Mini a front drive only car at highway speeds. This is done for fuel mileage considerations. The amount of clutch engagement is controlled by varying the voltage applied to the electromagnets in the hang-on clutch. According to GKN, this electro-magnetic clutch design is the smallest electronically controlled driveline on the market.


The Electro-Magnetic "hang on" clutch

The system defaults to a 50/50 torque split front/rear, and only changes this if it detects wheel slip. The system allows up to 50% of torque to go to the rear wheels when the system detects front wheel slip (any more wouldn’t make sense from a weight distribution prospective). However under cruising conditions (on a highway for instance) the ALL4 equipped Countryman is entirely front wheel drive.

Given this design, and a discussion with a local tech familiar with Minis, he suggested that if the battery was disconnected, that would make sure that the electro-magnetic clutch would be completely disengaged. This sets up a scenario where:
-
  • The electric parking brake cannot apply.
  • The front wheels turn freely in the front differential.
  • The front differential drives the transfer case gears, as usual.
  • The drive shaft is spun by the transfer case, once again, as usual.
  • The rear wheels turn freely in the rear differential.
Given this scenario, where is the problem that prevents a drive train like this from being flat-towed? With the electro-magnetic clutch on the rear differential disengaged, this is mechanically equivalent to disconnecting the drive shaft. However, everything in the drive train is turning at the same RPM anyway, just as it would be if coasting down a hill.

Is it really this simple, or am I missing something here?
 
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Old Jan 29, 2024 | 06:14 AM
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Originally Posted by rpmelvin
Everywhere I look I read where you cannot tow a Mini Cooper Countryman S, All4, Manual transmission, AWD, 4-down. I understand the corporate line at Mini/BMW is that you cannot tow ANY Mini 4-down, which is the legal department talking, not the mechanical or engineering department.

Given that many other AWD manual transmission cars CAN be towed 4-down, I have to ask - WHY? What is so different about the Mini transfer case that it cannot be towed 4-down with the tranny in neutral?

Inquiring minds want to know.
I doubt that it's a conspiracy, LOL. Freewheeling a complex drivetrain like that found in MINI/BMW's All4 can build up a heat and cause wear. I would put it on a trailer or find something else to tow behind (presumably an RV) :-)
 
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