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New 2014 Mini Cooper S
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  #251  
Old 03-05-2010, 11:05 AM
newbs49 newbs49 is offline
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The tech and servive advisor I know say they get 3-4 cars a week with this problem. DI engine doesn't wash the valves enough to get rid of the carbon and oil buildup. There may be a fix in the works but very costly to MINI. Even the BMW twin turbo motor is seeing the same thing but not as widely know. Cars that are driven HARD have less of a problem. All the cleaner's are just temp fixes, especially gas tank additives which don't get to the valves. Basically all they do is clean your injector nozzle.
Can't say much more. Corporate eye's are watching and listening.
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  #252  
Old 03-05-2010, 08:55 PM
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From another thread
Click the image to open in full size.

Keep up those seafoam (or equivalent) treatments folks.
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  #253  
Old 03-06-2010, 05:40 AM
countryboyshane countryboyshane is offline
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Well there is the proof. Dealers are using Seafoam I'm glad I adopted it into my maintenance schedule.

Everyone here should do the same!
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  #254  
Old 03-06-2010, 09:42 AM
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I really don't think that's the answer. MINI knows of the problem and should correct it or perform the service as a preventative service no charge. The owners should not have to do this, unless high mileage out of warranty.
If you own a R56 maybe you should all contact MINI of the problem. The louder you cry the more they listen.
Think Toyota
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  #255  
Old 03-07-2010, 05:10 PM
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I've noticed on this thread that most of the carbon buildup issues are from "S" (turbocharged) owners. Is that really the case? Is there something about the turbo engine that would make it more likely to have carbon buildup than the base non-turbo engine?

Aren't both engines direct injection? Is the PCV valve routing or design different?
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  #256  
Old 03-07-2010, 06:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by miniclubman View Post
I've noticed on this thread that most of the carbon buildup issues are from "S" (turbocharged) owners. Is that really the case? Is there something about the turbo engine that would make it more likely to have carbon buildup than the base non-turbo engine?

Aren't both engines direct injection? Is the PCV valve routing or design different?
Only the MCS engine has direct injection but both share the same PCV setup with the exception of a second vent on the MCS which dumps into the turbo cold side. From my experiences I can say the MCS is much more prone to having the direct injection but having seen a few MC engines with the heads pulled it's a significant problem across the board.
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  #257  
Old 03-08-2010, 01:51 AM
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Got my car back finally, with a carbon free (for now anyway) engine and a new fuel pump. The dealership I went to know had literally no knowledge of this happening on a mass level to other turbo MINIs, but they did say there was another one in the shop at that moment with the exact same issue mine was having. Gonna have to start using Seafoam.
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  #258  
Old 03-08-2010, 05:35 AM
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Got my car back finally, with a carbon free (for now anyway) engine and a new fuel pump. The dealership I went to know had literally no knowledge of this happening on a mass level to other turbo MINIs, but they did say there was another one in the shop at that moment with the exact same issue mine was having. Gonna have to start using Seafoam.
install water/meth injection
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  #259  
Old 03-08-2010, 07:18 AM
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Originally Posted by OXYBLUECOOP View Post
Only the MCS engine has direct injection but both share the same PCV setup with the exception of a second vent on the MCS which dumps into the turbo cold side.
Thanks, I wasn't aware that the base 1.6 engine was not direct-injection.

That would explain why the carbon buildup appears to be more of an issue on the turbo model.
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  #260  
Old 03-08-2010, 07:37 AM
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install water/meth injection

Water/Meth? Are there any side effects of using this? What is a good company to go with/ stay away from?
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  #261  
Old 03-08-2010, 08:01 AM
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Disappointed

I'm sorry, but I am disappointed in the response from Mini in regard to the high pressure fuel pump problems and in their response to the intake valve carbon buildup.

This company has been in business for over 50 years and has had a good reputation in the past. Their present actions of denial and lack of response on these two problems has left me very disappointed in this company.

I love the car, but may not keep it because of the irresponsible actions of Mini (another Toyota). What ever happened to honesty and responsibility?
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  #262  
Old 03-08-2010, 08:18 AM
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I feel you pain but...

24 million cars were recalled in the US last year. Pretty much all companies have issues, not just toyota.

Pretty much ever DI engine family has issues with carbon build up. Porsche as well. Are they another Toyota? Why it's coming as a surprise is what's baffling... Everyone would be much happier if there were just an every 2 year item on decarbonizing the engine in the maintenance schedule... But it's a problem pretty much for all the manufacturers.

What the DI engine crowd is getting, is about 15%-20% more efficiency, partitioned between power and gas mileage, for the trade off of a new periodic maintenance step. This is a good trade all around!

If it were port injected, then think about the same power levels with high 20 mpg. Do you really want that?

Matt
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  #263  
Old 03-08-2010, 09:17 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr Obnxs View Post
...Why it's coming as a surprise is what's baffling... Everyone would be much happier if there were just an every 2 year item on decarbonizing the engine in the maintenance schedule... But it's a problem pretty much for all the manufacturers...
So do you have any thoughts as to the reasons MINI hasn't done this? We've now documented evidence that they will perform the routine in a corrective (vice preventative) mode. Seems like it would be an easy thing to incorporate into their routine maintenance service, with the added benefit of freeing up room on their service schedule presently occupied with the cars that have the associated symptoms.

Could it be that they are just now coming to grips with the scope of the issue?
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  #264  
Old 03-08-2010, 12:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by newbs49 View Post
The tech and servive advisor I know say they get 3-4 cars a week with this problem. DI engine doesn't wash the valves enough to get rid of the carbon and oil buildup. There may be a fix in the works but very costly to MINI. Even the BMW twin turbo motor is seeing the same thing but not as widely know. Cars that are driven HARD have less of a problem. All the cleaner's are just temp fixes, especially gas tank additives which don't get to the valves. Basically all they do is clean your injector nozzle.
Can't say much more. Corporate eye's are watching and listening.
I am wondering how the problem relates to driver's driving style-shifting at certain rpm. I don't have a problem (knock on wood), never drive in D mode, always paddle/shifter shift at around 3.5-4-4.5 rpm. I can try the sea foam but not sure if actually need it.
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  #265  
Old 03-08-2010, 01:20 PM
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I'm as in the dark

as the rest of us as to why this seems to be "new news" so to speak. I can't belive that DI tech is so new no one saw any evidence of this before. As for the expense of dealing with it, I think a decarbonization with each oil fill wouldn't break the manufacturers bank, and is probably cheaper than really engineering a better solution.

In the future, I'd guess that they do a much better job of phase separation prior to venting via the PCV system, or somethink like my old FIAT had (phase separator with liquid drain back to the sump). Heck, that was a car from 1975 with an engine design from the 60s!

Matt
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  #266  
Old 03-11-2010, 05:15 PM
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Will this do the same thing: http://www.run-rite.com/industry/fuel_zoom.html
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  #267  
Old 03-11-2010, 10:00 PM
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I'd guess

that it's like the Step I stuff, for cleaning the intake. There are lots of things that do basically the same thing.

Matt
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  #268  
Old 04-26-2010, 03:03 PM
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The New and Improved SEAFOAM

Stopped in to my local Advanced Auto and found this on their shelf. Now Seafoam comes as a spray with a nozzel and instructions to introduce their product into the upper cylinder head.

Click the image to open in full size.

Click the image to open in full size.

Click the image to open in full size.
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  #269  
Old 04-26-2010, 09:01 PM
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Originally Posted by -=gRay rAvEn=- View Post
Stopped in to my local Advanced Auto and found this on their shelf. Now Seafoam comes as a spray with a nozzel and instructions to introduce their product into the upper cylinder head. [/IMG]
Where would that be on an R56 MCS?
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  #270  
Old 04-26-2010, 11:03 PM
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That's just an easy way to get the stuff in

from close to the atmospheric side. REally, any way to get the stuff sucked in before the intake manifold should work on the R56.

Matt
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  #271  
Old 04-27-2010, 05:48 AM
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Should make it a bit easier to introduce to intake and to keep the engine running while doing so.

I just changed my oil.....but I may need to do this.
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  #272  
Old 04-27-2010, 10:26 AM
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Originally Posted by Dr Obnxs View Post
from close to the atmospheric side. REally, any way to get the stuff sucked in before the intake manifold should work on the R56.

Matt
Uh, atmospheric side would be before the turbo. Is that what you mean? Send this stuff through the turbo?
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  #273  
Old 04-28-2010, 09:03 AM
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MINI Customer Relations has read posts concerning issues with carbon build up on some late model Cooper S vehicles and customers may be confused as to how to handle this issue; we would like to recommend using BMW/MINI Fuel System Cleaner Plus. Use of non approved induction cleaners may cause potential damage to the injectors and induction system.
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  #274  
Old 04-28-2010, 09:58 AM
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Directly cleaning valves

I saw a post on here about a guy who cleaned off his valves directly with Seafoam (http://www.northamericanmotoring.com...e-seafoam.html). He has before and after pictures and the valves went from full of black gunk to (almost) bare metal. How would one go about doing this? A decent DIY would be amazing if someone could post it up here. I am inclined to try anything myself but the idea of possibly pouring Seafoam directly onto to tops of my valves scares the hell out of me.
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  #275  
Old 04-28-2010, 10:17 AM
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MINI Customer Relations has read posts concerning issues with carbon build up on some late model Cooper S vehicles and customers may be confused as to how to handle this issue; we would like to recommend using BMW/MINI Fuel System Cleaner Plus. Use of non approved induction cleaners may cause potential damage to the injectors and induction system.
I'm going to go ahead and assume you are a MINI representative, given the tone and content of your post. So, gloves coming off...

Please, educate us on how a fuel system cleaner will benefit carbon buildup on the intake valves of a direct injection engine - when those aforementioned valves NEVER SEE ANY FUEL?! The problem is pretty well known now that it is oil being sprayed on the intake valves - and the only reasonable fix is to install an aftermarket oil catch can (and perhaps do periodic Seafoam treatments). I assure you we are not confused, we are annoyed that you geniuses never saw this problem coming and still sit in denial of it. Further, Seafoam is used by MINI technicians exactly for the purpose of clearing up excess carbon deposits - perhaps you customer relations guys should check in with your techs from time to time.

Honestly, if you are going to post here, try harder to give advice that is less specious.
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Old 04-28-2010, 10:17 AM
 
 
 
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