Unusual Rhytmic Whining From Rear of S ALL4
 

I'm reposting this from "1st Gear" in the hopes that someone here will have some ideas:

My 2012 Countryman S All4 with manual transmission and 15k miles makes a rhythmic (on and off) medium-pich whining sound at highway speeds with the engine under load. The sound, which seems to be coming from the right rear of the car, appears to be afffected by outside temp - the colder it is, the more noticeable the sound. Unfortunately, it's usually a lot colder where I live than it is where the dealer is located, which is why the same noise that drives me crazy every day is barely noticeable whenever the car visits the dealer.

Although the sound is annoying in its own right, my biggest concern is that it's a symptom of a serious mechanical problem that will at the very least cause premature wear and perhaps even - probably the day the warranty expires! - result in a costly repair.

The dealer, Motorwerks MINI in Minneapolis, has taken my concern very seriously and put forth a great deal of effort and expense to diagnose and solve the problem. As evidence, they just replaced the final drive/rear differential. Unfortunately, by the time I had finished half the 300+ mile trip home from the service dept yesterday, the outside temp was in the single digits and it became clear that the problem was (gulp) still there.

Here's some additional information about the sound: It's most likely to make an appearance at 62-64 mph. RPM's don't seem to matter - it happens in 5th or 6th gear. There's also sometimes a lower pitch version of the same rhythmic sound that seems to come from the left rear of the car at 70-73 mph.

I realize this is a little geeky (OK, a LOT geeky), but I tried recording the sound with my iPhone. Road and wind noise made the sound hard to hear clearly, so I did my best to filter out the background noise, which resulted in something that admittedly resembles the sountrack of a submarine movie. Still, it's the real thing. If you're up for a challenge and would like to take a listen, I posted the mp3 at http://goo.gl/AnzYE.

I will be ever-so-grateful for any and all ideas.

could it be tire whine?

are you running winter tires?

have you tried rotating the tires?

scott

Thanks Scott for the reply. I wondered about tires, but MINI service personnel pretty much dismissed that possibility - especially because the sound seems to occur only when the engine is under load. I have the original Pirelli All-Season run-flats on the car. If no other possibilities come up, I may just try rotating the tires to see if that makes a difference, so thanks again for the suggestion.

Some of you are going to think I'm nuts, but after listening to the mp3 I'm going to guess that it has something to do with the evaporative emissions control system, the very cold weather, and the change in vacuum when the engine is under load. It's nothing more than a wild guess, and I'm very curious to see what this turns out to be. 300 miles colder than the twin cities? Exactly how far north are you?

Thanks very much for the idea. Not a possibility that's ever been considered before, so I'm eager to run this by the folks at Motorwerks! I'll keep you posted. BTW, we're in the northwestern corner of Minnesota - a hop, skip and a jump from Manitoba Canada and North Dakota. It's 3 degrees above zero here this morning, and my MINI is whining away.

OP, was your issue resolved? I seem to experience the same problem as well.

Hi Ladzio. No resolution yet, but the whining on my ALL4 seems to occur only when the outside temp is fairly low (< 20 degrees or so), so there were no opportunities for the dealer to investigate other possible causes after the rear differential was replaced in March. We plan to resume the search as soon as the cold weather returns.

I'll keep you posted. Please let me know if you learn anything before I do. By the way, I have spoken to BMW/MINI about this so they are aware of the problem.

Got my car back after one week in a shop. Got into car, look at repair order: dealer replaced clutch and flywheel - hyper excited! Start driving: same drive train whine is still there - hyper irritated!! Calling dealer back for appointment tomorrow.

Oh no, Ladzio. I know how you feel. I took the same quick trip from optimism to damn it after my rear differential was replaced.

I wonder what the shop's next hypothesis will be.

I used to have a high pitched whine from the back of the car ... it didn't stop till I told my kid he couldn't ride with me anymore. He stays a lot quieter now :-)

:lol:

Car back in shop. Dealer confirmed the whine, diagnosed the cause to be defective transmission. New manual transmission on order. Whine is most audible when traveling about 50 mph and stepping on accelerator lightly. Pitch changes with speed, not RPM, does not matter what gear is selected. Dealer said that differential is housed inside the transmission, so bad deferential would likely mean transmission replacement. Will know details when get car back with a repair invoice. Below is a video how it sounds, shot after I picked up the car from the dealer with a new flywheel and clutch. It is apparent they did not test-drive the car after the new clutch and flywheel :sly:

Yes, definitely sounds like incorrectly adjusted differential gears. I'm surprised that they cannot simply make adjustments rather than replace the unit. Although "simply" is probably the wrong word. Perhaps the labor to disassemble adjust and reassemble would be as much as BMW's internal cost for a new trans. By the way, what road was that video taken on?… Looks very very familiar.

Whine can also sometimes be a gear issue. All it takes is one edge finished incorrectly or nick during assembly and you can start getting noise.

Sprain Brook Parkway, South bound off I-287.

Ladzio, sure sounds the same as my 2012 All4's whine, although mine only does it in colder weather. As I already posted, replacement of the rear differential alone did not solve the problem, so I'm eager to see what result you get when the entire transmission is replaced.

Would you mind posting the name and location of the MINI dealer who will be replacing your transmission so I can share this my dealer in Minnesota?

Got car back. Repair order says whine was coming from an input shaft bearing. They replaced the transmission. As soon as I left the dealership and stepped on the gas realized the engine has no boost and hence poor acceleration. Sure enough, got reduced engine power message soon after that. Back at the dealer enjoying free coffee and water... Suspect they bumped a hose or wiring when putting new tranny in.

Sure enough, just got an update, some vacuum hose was not secured properly. Hopefully this will be the end of my adventures :).

Which dealer is this? It seems pretty obvious that they don't Road test a car after a repair. I don't think I would even let them change a tire. How do you know that the wheel won't fall off when you drive away from the dealership?:eek:

Ladzio, so is the whine gone?

Indeed, forgot to answer the most important question: Yes, the whine is gone.

Well, while it was a burden to return two times I am nonetheless satisfied with the level of service they provided (free coffee, free water, and free loaners :) ). The dealer is Mini of Fairfield.

Congratulations Ladzio! I personally wouldn't know, but I'm guessing that there's nothing like a whine-free ALL4.

Ladzio, I realize this thread is several years old but what did you end up paying for the bearing replacement? I have the same problem. Thanks.