Hello all,

I recently had to do some *community service* to pay my debt to society... in doing so, I met a few guys that were also *doing time* as it were, for street racing of all things. What I noticed most about these guys is that they really did know a fair amount about engines, mods and what works and what doesn't.

Granted there were general taste differences between what I thought *looked* good and what they thought looked good, epecially for rims, but in all, they were amicable, knowledgeable and fun to talk with.

They loved the MINI and several of them expressed a keen interest in what was available for them in aftermarket parts and add-ons.

One guy was driving a 95ish Mitsubishi Eclipse, carbon fiber hood on 18's with a full body kit and a large 2 blade spoiler. At face value I thought he'd probably be an idiot but he was the coolest about the mods he'd done and about my MINI and how I liked it and what I was planning to do to it.

I guess my point is that, looking at some of these guys and their rides, I kind of always thought they were all snapperheads that thought stickers and underglow made a car handle better and go faster... and for sure, they're quite a few that come from that school of thought, but in the grand scheme of things, I think a lot of them are just trying to do the best with what they've got... they want a performance car at a reasonable price, and spending more than the cars worth on mods is not out of the question... of course *reasonble price* is relative to ones wallet, for some of these guys in their mid-twenties a brand new $20K +/- car is a bit steep... plus mods , etc...

So even though I cringe at some of their car fashion-sense, I can appreciate where they're coming from, they certainly didn't pigeon hole me as a yuppie with a girls' car when I showed up and so I feel it only fair to give them the benefit of the doubt from here on in.

Just thought I'd share my experience...

orb

 

orb- think of them as being musicians. there are some that are just
looks and no play. some are just damn good at what they do and
their image is justified.

I find more mini owners not knowing about cars (in general)
than the sportcompact crowd. it seems like most mini owners
skipped the sportcompact genre and dove into the mini.
whether good or bad, that's what I am feeling. :smile:






_________________
03MCS IB/Blk: 123, Aerokit, R90 17x7, TK5 16x7, 6CDMP3, and a few more.

 

I would agree in my own experience...

the wing thing and lightshow is highly subjective...but the suspension and engine mods are up to par with anything the MINI community is doing...especially with the VTEC engines! I have mentally toyed with a blue neon kit

I think the snobbery comes from the "clothes" they put on the cars and not the mechanical/performance components

 

Yeah... makes sense to me, good analogy. I was just amazed how cool they were about all of it. I had em' pegged for snot-nosed punks that didn't know anything... but I'm a generally angry and "hate first ask questions later" kind of person so I guess that's got something to do with it. Having the MINI as a conversation piece / ice breaker is a good thing in this case as I've made some new friends.

 

I have found that most motorsports enthusiasts, regardless of what they drive or ride, all share the same passion.

Kind of like ice cream. We may prefer different flavors, but we all love it!

 

Gearheads are gearheads. Would you ever think that a guy who drives a cooper s would have the slightest interest in old ,slow poor handling classic 4x4's? I do. My pride and joy is a 79 toyota landcruiser. I haven't encountered any car enthusiasts who aren't interested in mini's.Many will probably never own them, but they get it.

 

Agreed all. I know we're generalizing here. They don't want to spend a lot on their car, and then when they get extra money, they upgrade something. I do think that the looks of their cars are sometimes extreme, but I like that better than stock. IMO most stock cars all look mostly the same anymore, i.e., egg shaped. I really like cars that are different -- the MINI for example, but others are: Suzuki Aerio (really a neat car to drive), Toyota Matrix, PT Cruiser (looks awesome), Volkswagon New Beetle, Toyota Celica (looks like a jet). I guess these are not the typical cars we are talking about, but they are different. Ah la diference! I think I would enjoy attending a car show with souped up Civics, Acura's, etc. and hang out as we all love our cars and modding them. When I was living north of San Diego a few years ago, I drove by a strip mall and noticed there was a lot of such modded cars parked with crowds of people checking them out. I stopped and hung out and it was a lot of fun. They all love their cars and showing them off.

 

Yeah you're all right on with the comments it just seems that there's this stigma attached to driving and hopping up certain types of cars, specifically a lot of the Japanese and Korean imports... and I for one, was definitely of the mindset that these guys were mostly punks, mostly obnoxious with their coffee can exhausts and primer grey body kits, mostly ignorant of performance mods... and found that it was me who was ignorant of them and their vantage point.... at least with the guys whom I've met recently.

I never would've thought a gruff looking guy on a Harley would stop me in traffic to ask me about my Mini but it happened... horses for courses I guess.

I agree that gearheads are gearheads as the poster above mentioned but it seems that these *ricers* get a bad name to and from themselves from that segment of the group that just has no useful clue as to what they're doing with their cars... and seemingly no restraint in what they'll put on their machines... either for looks or for speed.

 

Just because they are a "ricer" doesn't mean they are clueless about cars...if they really are car enthusiasts and know how to maintain and fix up their cars then they aren't ricers at all. I know lots of people that drive Japanese cars that know what they're doing. Speak to some of them, lots of them are also into euros and muscle cars...or anything fast I think this whole sport compact crowd has gotten a bad rap from the F&F movies and all the kids out there who just get their licenses and think they're race car drivers.

On the other hand theres some ricers that think the mini is a girly car that can't hold its own. Thats until I kill them in the twisties or pull away from them on the freeway. But there are lot of them that like the mini and ask me lots of questions about it.

 

>>Yeah you're all right on with the comments it just seems that there's this stigma attached to driving and hopping up certain types of cars, specifically a lot of the Japanese and Korean imports... and I for one, was definitely of the mindset that these guys were mostly punks, mostly obnoxious with their coffee can exhausts and primer grey body kits, mostly ignorant of performance mods... and found that it was me who was ignorant of them and their vantage point.... at least with the guys whom I've met recently.
>>
>>I never would've thought a gruff looking guy on a Harley would stop me in traffic to ask me about my Mini but it happened... horses for courses I guess.
>>
>>I agree that gearheads are gearheads as the poster above mentioned but it seems that these *ricers* get a bad name to and from themselves from that segment of the group that just has no useful clue as to what they're doing with their cars... and seemingly no restraint in what they'll put on their machines... either for looks or for speed.
>>

I've always thought of the stigma as being attached not specifically to Japanese or Korean imports but to the silly bling bling that is associated with the modification of those cars in recent years. When I was a kid, I had a '77 Celica (20R) that I bought for nothing and modified--mainly the suspension and drivetrain, though. I think that was before the advent of true ricerdom. With regard to looks, the focus was never to make my car look good, but to make it look cool. But what I really cared about was how it handled and the power. So maybe I'm just more of a purist, but I never sought to glue a biplane onto the rear deck to create drag. Furthermore, you would think that a reasonable knowledge of auto performance would actually deter modders from worrying about foolishness like rear-mounted horizontal stabilizers and neon.

 

Yeah, I read an article a couple years ago that tested a Mustang with rear spoiler and found that it only made a difference of a couple miles per hour, but that was at 135 miles per hour, so it boosted it to about 137 or so. I think that below 100 mph that it probably made little or no difference. I still like the looks of spoilers, though. But the MINI seems to be more of a mature car, with more upscale owners than the Japanese cars, i.e., "ricers".

 

I for one think the term "ricer" is tasteless. I am 20 years old and have had two other cars before getting a MCS. I had a 87 Honda CRX Si and a 2001 Honda Civic. Both of which were great cars which I never had problems with. I modded them with tons of aftermarket parts but I never considered myself a ricer. Performance is performance. I know that the term is used for those who only do cosmetic mods, but there is a lot of work that some people put into those cars, me for example. I took my 110 hp machines and produced a 184 hp CRX and a 190 hp Civic. I hope that everyone gives "ricers" a break because without some of their input into this type of market a lot of MINI owners would not know what they liked and what they didn't like.

B

 

I agree ukbyoung, I apologize for using the term *ricer* but I just don't know any other term to use... it seems that most people know who and what you're talking about when you use that term as opposed to say something like "asian-import-modder"... though I guess that'd be pretty acurate. YMMV.

I think it's a mindset for some people... they get a car and want it to be *theirs* in some way, either by adding horsepower and performance mods or just adding flash/bling style mods like over-the-top body kits, rims, accessories... or sometimes both.

 

Well said Orb. I will stop using the term ricer, although I never have really used it or referred to it except here just now.

Your're right ukbyoung. I have owned several Honda's and always liked them, but I never got into modding them. Wanted to, but it was a lot of money for me back then. I have respect and admire those that have modded them. I don't really know that much about all this, but I'm actively trying to learn about it now. There's something about this MINI that I really want to learn all about performance and soup it up. I also started watching the Speed Channel, but not until I got the MINI just over a month ago. I'm really getting into all this big time. Looking forward to the future, whatever it holds. Motor on!

 

I guess I'll have to jump in and be a hater here. I think that most "ricer" cars are just dumb. I'm not saying that their drivers know little about what makes cars go, but if they really do, then why do they throw their money away on crap that doesn't make their car faster or better-handling? These cars tend to make me laugh because they have thousands of dollars in TOTALLY USELESS body additions (namely spoilers); they typically have automatic transmissions; they often have hilariously painted drum brakes; they carry stickers for products that aren't on the car; they tend to have exhaust tips that are bolted on to their factory exhausts, and the list goes on and on. This is what is considered "rice." When was the last time you saw a car covered in stickers and with a giant spoiler on it that actually had a nice suspension setup? I'm guessing approximately never. This is what is typically referred to as the "ricer mantra"--All show and no go.

Now, if we were talking about the nicely prepped, nicely equipped Acura Integras and Honda Civic SIs that I've seen at the track that would beat the pants off of any MINI out there, then we're not talking about ricers anymore; we're talking about "import tuners," and that's a totally different animal. Import tuners know what they're doing, and that's probably who you ran into. These are two very different camps, and they do very different things. If there's a windshield-long sticker identifying the make of automobile; then it's probably a ricer. If there are serious suspension and ENGINE modifications, then it's probably an import tuner.

As always, just my two cents though...

 

Good (two) sense, Chitown.

 

The moders that scare the bejesus out of me are the snapperheads who drive their cars like they were stuntmen from the Fast and the Furious (which was mostly camera tricks ... trust me I was there when they filmed part 2). The asian-moders that now about engines, breaks and suspension really know their stuff. When you engage them is serious conversation is quite enlighting and refreshing. But ... the cockroaches that put neon kits, 4 foot batman wings, 22 inch wheels w/ 35 profile tires, glass pack exhausts and the NOS sticker on the front quarter panel ... those you have to be carefull off. These snapperheads will do 60 MPH is a school zone kill your kid and ***** to the parent that they'll have to pay for their kid damaging his car. Sorry ... I'll get down from my soap box now

 

I eat RICE three times a day. I guess you could call me a "ricer" if you want. I know my rice Maybe I should refer to my self as an "imported ricer desquised as a Mini Big Mac"



_________________

 

>>I guess I'll have to jump in and be a hater here. I think that most "ricer" cars are just dumb. I'm not saying that their drivers know little about what makes cars go, but if they really do, then why do they throw their money away on crap that doesn't make their car faster or better-handling? These cars tend to make me laugh because they have thousands of dollars in TOTALLY USELESS body additions (namely spoilers); they typically have automatic transmissions; they often have hilariously painted drum brakes; they carry stickers for products that aren't on the car; they tend to have exhaust tips that are bolted on to their factory exhausts, and the list goes on and on. This is what is considered "rice." When was the last time you saw a car covered in stickers and with a giant spoiler on it that actually had a nice suspension setup? I'm guessing approximately never. This is what is typically referred to as the "ricer mantra"--All show and no go.
>>
>>Now, if we were talking about the nicely prepped, nicely equipped Acura Integras and Honda Civic SIs that I've seen at the track that would beat the pants off of any MINI out there, then we're not talking about ricers anymore; we're talking about "import tuners," and that's a totally different animal. Import tuners know what they're doing, and that's probably who you ran into. These are two very different camps, and they do very different things. If there's a windshield-long sticker identifying the make of automobile; then it's probably a ricer. If there are serious suspension and ENGINE modifications, then it's probably an import tuner.
>>
>>As always, just my two cents though...

Yes. Those are excellent definitions of the terminology--"ricers" and "import tuners". I think people get hung up on the Asian thing, thinking that people here are just out to slam Asian cars. Back in the day, I loved my Yota. It was a great car--as solid as a rock and fun to drive. Toyota is known for making fine cars. The gripe is with what people do to ruin their cars.

 

>>Hello all,
>>
>>I recently had to do some *community service* to pay my debt to society... in doing so, I met a few guys that were also *doing time* as it were, for street racing of all things. What I noticed most about these guys is that they really did know a fair amount about engines, mods and what works and what doesn't.
<bits snipped>
>>One guy was driving a 95ish Mitsubishi Eclipse, carbon fiber hood on 18's with a full body kit and a large 2 blade spoiler. At face value I thought he'd probably be an idiot but he was the coolest about the mods he'd done and about my MINI and how I liked it and what I was planning to do to it.
>>
>>I guess my point is that, looking at some of these guys and their rides, I kind of always thought they were all snapperheads that thought stickers and underglow made a car handle better and go faster... and for sure, they're quite a few that come from that school of thought, but in the grand scheme of things, I think a lot of them are just trying to do the best with what they've got... they want a performance car at a reasonable price, and spending more than the cars worth on mods is not out of the question... of course *reasonble price* is relative to ones wallet, for some of these guys in their mid-twenties a brand new $20K +/- car is a bit steep... plus mods , etc...

Ok, I have to wonder what use a 2 blade spoiler does. As someone already pointed out, spoilers really only do something at 130+mph speed (and only do something for a rear wheel drive vehicle) A two bladed spoiler actually negates these effects. So basically they just add more useless weight to the car. I don't know what else you talked about engine wise but I can tell by the fact that he point a double spoiler on his car he doesn't know that much. Sure there are lots of guys who run import cars and know what they are doing but anyone can pay someone to make their car go fast and memorize a lits of parts and spew numbers about HP. "Ricers" are those who have double spoilers, stupid exhaust tips (with stock can), neon lights (more weight is not good) and stickers for stuff they don't even have on their car. A fire extinguisher on the pillar will not make you go faster nor will 20+ gagues.

I've found that most "ricers" will talk a lot of trash whereas people who know a lot and usually have a mean setup are the ones you don't notice till they've just beaten the pants off you. I like sleepers... not a lot of flashy graphics.

 

not the best representation of my sleeper, but it will smoke
most of our MCS's here through the straights and non-hairpin
corners. very tight corners might be tough on this car due to
its AWD..but it's suspension is setup to turn very fast.

0-60mph under 5sec. 1/4mile under 13.5sec. :smile: and this is
only Stage1 out of 4 stages. Since this is only a streetcar, I don't
intend to make it any faster even though it can easily reach
250-300whp with a few more bolt ons.

I don't consider myself a ricer, but i am part of the sportscompact
crowd... id like to think of myself as a car enthusiasts as all of
you guys are here. Ive work with nitrous oxide and other stuff
on my other cars, but my next goals are migrating to larger
displacement NA motors and a FR platform.




_________________
03MCS IB/Blk: 123, Aerokit, R90 17x7, TK5 16x7, 6CDMP3, and a few more.

 

 

>>not the best representation of my sleeper, but it will smoke
>>most of our MCS's here through the straights and non-hairpin
>>corners. very tight corners might be tough on this car due to
>>its AWD..but it's suspension is setup to turn very fast.
>>
>>0-60mph under 5sec. 1/4mile under 13.5sec. :smile: and this is
>>only Stage1 out of 4 stages. Since this is only a streetcar, I don't
>>intend to make it any faster even though it can easily reach
>>250-300whp with a few more bolt ons.
>>
>>I don't consider myself a ricer, but i am part of the sportscompact
>>crowd... id like to think of myself as a car enthusiasts as all of
>>you guys are here. Ive work with nitrous oxide and other stuff
>>on my other cars, but my next goals are migrating to larger
>>displacement NA motors and a FR platform.
>>
>>
>> I've been on a couple canyon runs with a few WRX's and they can really move!

 

>>not the best representation of my sleeper, but it will smoke
>>most of our MCS's here through the straights and non-hairpin
>>corners. very tight corners might be tough on this car due to
>>its AWD..but it's suspension is setup to turn very fast.
>>
>>0-60mph under 5sec. 1/4mile under 13.5sec. :smile: and this is
>>only Stage1 out of 4 stages. Since this is only a streetcar, I don't
>>intend to make it any faster even though it can easily reach
>>250-300whp with a few more bolt ons.
>>
>>I don't consider myself a ricer, but i am part of the sportscompact
>>crowd... id like to think of myself as a car enthusiasts as all of
>>you guys are here. Ive work with nitrous oxide and other stuff
>>on my other cars, but my next goals are migrating to larger
>>displacement NA motors and a FR platform.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>_________________
>>03MCS IB/Blk: 123, Aerokit, R90 17x7, TK5 16x7, 6CDMP3, and a few more.
>>
>>

You're obviously an import tuner, not a ricer. WRXs are great cars. They look like total econobox hell but have what counts. I shied away from getting one because it looks like some kind of laughable Corolla GT knock-off, but I recognize that the WRX is a very good car technically.

 

In this case, I'm going to drop the "ricer" and call it aftermarket. There are a three different routes of modifications to any car. Performance, bling, and combination of those two.

Performance is anything that raises the engine's output or allows the car to explore outter limits of handling and speed. The most common is intake and exhaust. But spring kits, coil-overs, nitrous, turbos, certain types of wheels, etc., are also in this route.

Bling is anything that changes just the look of the car. Anything. Those bonnet stripes are bling. The "kamikazi-attack" wing is bling, most wings on cars have no purpose anyway at highway speeds. Most wheels are bling. Its a look, achieving a look, being different, and being noticed.

Finally is the combination of the above two, which basically speaks for itself. Goes fast while looks different.

Obviously, this is all open to personal tastes and opinions.

My MINI is loud, has gold wheels, and sports a spoiler. Its "aftermarket."

This isn't a hierarchy.... its either boat stock, or it isn't.

_________________
-goin440 IB/IB MC